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bobofwestoregonusa
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 6:48 AM 

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Potions work just as well unless you want quickened combat spells. If it's primarily buffing you can just drink one of the vendor potions. No need to waste your brewed potions on buffing.

But for offensive casting I could see the value of it.

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Bini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 7:01 AM 

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It is worth the cost on a caster cleric without the Travel or Time domain.

You should be looking to fit hellball in somewhere as it is a caster cleric. Whether that means cheesing a ranger level as many do (you don't need tumble), or opting for only 24 wisdom is up to you.

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treant13
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 20:40 PM 

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So I am building my sorcerer and I am wondering if I have picked the best extra feats.

I will have 29 Sorcerer, 1 Ranger (epic-cheezy I know). 20 Cha

So I will get SF, GSF (both enchantment), extend, empower, and maximize
This would leave me with a few feats: I chose, in a practice build, Lightning Reflex, Toughness, Great Fort, Craft Wand. (all of these are just filler and replaceable)

Epic I chose ESF: Enchantment and the rest were Great Cha (up to VII)

I just wanted to know if there were better feats for a sorcerer to take?

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Cerpin Taxt
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 21:40 PM 

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treant13 wrote:
So I am building my sorcerer and I am wondering if I have picked the best extra feats.

I will have 29 Sorcerer, 1 Ranger (epic-cheezy I know). 20 Cha

So I will get SF, GSF (both enchantment), extend, empower, and maximize
This would leave me with a few feats: I chose, in a practice build, Lightning Reflex, Toughness, Great Fort, Craft Wand. (all of these are just filler and replaceable)

Epic I chose ESF: Enchantment and the rest were Great Cha (up to VII)

I just wanted to know if there were better feats for a sorcerer to take?


Epic mage armor.
Hellball.
Greater ruin.
Mummy dust.

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treant13
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 21:54 PM 

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I want the highest dc possible for dominate monster, so no epic spells. Its the pre epics i need to check.

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wolfurt
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 22:19 PM 

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treant13 wrote:
I want the highest dc possible for dominate monster, so no epic spells. Its the pre epics i need to check.


Dominate monster is absolutely terrible, and you can't use it in PvP because players can drink a mindblank while under the effect. It's good for roleplay and PvMing, I suppose.

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treant13
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 22:28 PM 

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Can't one just dispel the mindblank?

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slkNihilus
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 22:31 PM 

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They can, but unless they use Mords (and even then) they might remove other buffs and leave mindblank there or not remove anything at all. And it's really easy for the targeted PC to just quaff another mindblank potion. They can buy those in stacks of ten. You run out of spells eventually.


 
      
treant13
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 22:34 PM 

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Fair, but any thoughts on my pre-epics?

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slkNihilus
 
PostPosted: Fri, Apr 12 2013, 22:37 PM 

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I'd take SF and GSF in another school instead of Lightning Reflexes and Toughness.


 
      
Uncle-Opustus
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 15:26 PM 

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Can EWS be taken simply on a Divine Champion level or does it explicitly need to be a DC bonus feat? I tested this once a long time ago, but buggered if I remember.

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Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 16:26 PM 

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So I have a bit of an odd character build: Fighter 17/*DD 10/Bard 2 that was originally Fighter 18/*DD 9/Bard 2, but I believe going the extra step to 10 *DD is more warranted.

Current feats:
Power Attack, Cleave, Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Knockdown, Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Great Cleave, Improved Knockdown, Improved Critical: Heavy Flail, Toughness, Great Fortitude, Blind Fight, Overwhelming Critical: Heavy Flail, Devastating Critical: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Epic Prowess, Great Strength I, Armor Skin

Ending saves: 22/14/11
Ending stats: STR: 20 (32), DEX: 8, CON: 14 (16), WIS: 6, INT: 14 (16), CHA: 10 (12)
Skillzzz: Discipline 32(43), Heal 13(11), Lore 8(13), Tumble 30(29), UMD 30(31), remaining skillpoints 34 (likely going into Craft Armor/Weapon)


So yeah, the idea is a completely ruthless, vicious beast of a 'man'. Keep that in mind with the current layout.
Primary question: There is a pre-epic feat free. I have zero idea on what to take given what is already taken

Secondary question: Can you take EWS as a regular fighter-level feat in epic, or does it have to be a fighter bonus feat in epic?
Uncle-Opustus wrote:
Can EWS be taken simply on a Divine Champion level or does it explicitly need to be a DC bonus feat? I tested this once a long time ago, but buggered if I remember.

Pretty sure it can be taken on the regular level feat and doesn't have to to be a bonus feat just like with my question, but not 100% sure myself haha.

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 20:39 PM 

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Not sure on Divine Champion, but WS/EWS can be taken on general feat levels with Fighter, no need for bonus levels to take either.

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Uncle-Opustus
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 20:51 PM 

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What I really meant was could anybody check it for me because I'm an awful slob?

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 21:00 PM 

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I just delevelled a DC test offline and relevelled to check. Can be taken on a general.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 21:06 PM 

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You should have made the lazy arse check it himself!

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 21:07 PM 

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:lol:

Sorry!

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Uncle-Opustus
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 21:36 PM 

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Huzzah! Once again I didn't have to bother.

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Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 21:51 PM 

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Naivatkal wrote:
So I have a bit of an odd character build: Fighter 17/*DD 10/Bard 2 that was originally Fighter 18/*DD 9/Bard 2, but I believe going the extra step to 10 *DD is more warranted.

Current feats:
Power Attack, Cleave, Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Knockdown, Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Great Cleave, Improved Knockdown, Improved Critical: Heavy Flail, Toughness, Great Fortitude, Blind Fight, Overwhelming Critical: Heavy Flail, Devastating Critical: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Epic Prowess, Great Strength I, Armor Skin

Ending saves: 22/14/11
Ending stats: STR: 20 (32), DEX: 8, CON: 14 (16), WIS: 6, INT: 14 (16), CHA: 10 (12)
Skillzzz: Discipline 32(43), Heal 13(11), Lore 8(13), Tumble 30(29), UMD 30(31), remaining skillpoints 34 (likely going into Craft Armor/Weapon)


So yeah, the idea is a completely ruthless, vicious beast of a 'man'. Keep that in mind with the current layout.
Primary question: There is a pre-epic feat free. I have zero idea on what to take given what is already taken.

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GreatPigeon
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 22:45 PM 

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I would drop toughness and take disarm and improved disarm. Because you are using a heavy flail its just a big boost in AB in many situations.

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Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sat, Apr 13 2013, 23:27 PM 

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So basically with using a large weapon it's a free disarm attempt, right? With Imp Disarm, of course.

I've also heard there are 'issues' with disarm vs PCs. Are there 'rules of engagement' if in PvP? Is it just returning the weapon after? Derk, I believe, posted in here that when you disarm a PC you take their weapon. Someone else mentioned that only when unarmed do you take their weapon.

How exactly does disarm work in both PvE and PvP?

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Tomato Sword
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 0:05 AM 



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Naivatkal wrote:
Naivatkal wrote:
So I have a bit of an odd character build: Fighter 17/*DD 10/Bard 2 that was originally Fighter 18/*DD 9/Bard 2, but I believe going the extra step to 10 *DD is more warranted.

Current feats:
Power Attack, Cleave, Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Knockdown, Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Great Cleave, Improved Knockdown, Improved Critical: Heavy Flail, Toughness, Great Fortitude, Blind Fight, Overwhelming Critical: Heavy Flail, Devastating Critical: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Focus: Heavy Flail, Epic Weapon Specialization: Heavy Flail, Epic Prowess, Great Strength I, Armor Skin

Ending saves: 22/14/11
Ending stats: STR: 20 (32), DEX: 8, CON: 14 (16), WIS: 6, INT: 14 (16), CHA: 10 (12)
Skillzzz: Discipline 32(43), Heal 13(11), Lore 8(13), Tumble 30(29), UMD 30(31), remaining skillpoints 34 (likely going into Craft Armor/Weapon)


So yeah, the idea is a completely ruthless, vicious beast of a 'man'. Keep that in mind with the current layout.
Primary question: There is a pre-epic feat free. I have zero idea on what to take given what is already taken.


You don't need 30 "ranks" in UMD. Just with CHA mod and whatever, you reach a multiplier of 5. I personally don't think Craft Armor/Weapon is worth it with so many items you can easily get (especially with UMD).

How about Spot! It won't be very high with 6 WIS but.... >.> RDD gets Spot.


 
      
Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 0:19 AM 

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Yeah, I corrected a few mistakes like with UMD after the fact haha. Spot won't be too good really, and the RDD levels end aat like character level 15 so it would only gain like 16 spot after the modifier lol. Wouldn't match much with the concept, either.

Craft Armor/Weapon is good, though, if you actually want to be a weaponeer/armoreer because you actually have the skill rather than reply upon items. Really, I can't find anything else to plug the ranks into haha. I'd really love shoving them into Intimidate... but the classes don't get it :(

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Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming


 
      
Gobbledygook
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 3:43 AM 

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Quarterstaff Weapon Master Monk. It's something I tried to build a while back, but found it wasn't viable because there wasn't enough AC to keep it alive. With the fact that the quarterstaff now works I was wondering what would be the best way to build for this.

Not entirely sure whether to have more of a focus on Monk levels for defensive capabilities, or WM levels. Basically it would be a Monk / Fighter / Weapon Master (Or fighter could be replaced by something else if necessary - but I was thinking it would be needed for Weapon Spec.)

So there's a few ideas:
- Monk 21 / WM 7 / Fighter 2 - Gets glowy eyes, monk goodies, lower AB.
- Monk 6 / Fighter 5 / WM 19 - Higher AB, IKD from monk, Epic Wep Spec, maybe Dev Crit?
- Monk 1 / Fighter 10 / WM 19 - Not sure if 1 Monk level at the end is going to change the quarterstaff bonus. It'd be horrible to level, but have the highest AB in the end.

The character would basically just be entirely focused around quarterstaff fighting, and external Ki abilities (such as Ki Damage), rather than internal Ki abilities (such as Empty Body). I'm worried about it's defensive capabilities, as it seems that everything I build ends up getting pwned in PvM. No shield, so that's -7 AC assuming a +4 Tower, which means it is going to hurt. Also, I'm not sure you get monk bonuses with weapons if you're in armor, so it'd have to rely on a DEX bonus too.

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Uncle-Opustus
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 10:55 AM 

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There's a nifty change, coolio. Monk6 seems realistic for boosting your AC with DEX and WIS. Naturally with that you will have to choose between Tumble 30 and EWS. At any rate, I like the idea of having WM19 tremendously.

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QPR
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 11:44 AM 

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Also making a quarterstaff monk, but going the route of 25 monk/5 DwD. My questions is if the SR from 25 monk levels will be enough in PvM, and if there is anything else than the Disarm path, blindfight, dwd reqs and Wf/IMp crit I should take pre-epic?

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Gobbledygook
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 12:15 PM 

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Decided to save the idea for another time. :)

Monk 21 / WM 7 / Fighter 2 works well though!

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Theander
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 12:18 PM 



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When creating a cleric, must ALL domains must the character's god in order to gain the benefits of party-wide blessing, or only some?

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Manarethan
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 12:37 PM 

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Both the domains you pick must be domains the god supports or you'll be unable to use spells and divine abilities whatsoever, including the pray function.


 
      
NinjaClarinet
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 12:38 PM 



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Under the current system, both your domains must come from the deity's list in order for you to cast at all. You'll get zapped if they don't.


 
      
Theander
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 12:52 PM 



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Cool.

Another question, Mummy Dust. How do those summons compare to the level up ones, such as Mummy and Greater Mummy for Create Greater Undead or the Trumpet archon through Gate?

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Uncle-Opustus
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 13:07 PM 

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QPR wrote:
Also making a quarterstaff monk, but going the route of 25 monk/5 DwD. My questions is if the SR from 25 monk levels will be enough in PvM, and if there is anything else than the Disarm path, blindfight, dwd reqs and Wf/IMp crit I should take pre-epic?

Four levels of Fighter, duh.

Theander: I've gotten the impression that the EMD summons are solid companions. Some dish out more damage than the others, some are tankier than the others, but they are fairly balanced and universally usable. Naturally you have to factor in that EMD lasts longer than Gate, for example, and cannot be dispelled. Therefore it makes sense that 'power-wise' the Gate and EMD are more or less equal. I'd imagine Greater Mummy is somewhat more situational, but Winterwight, I hear, is da bomb.

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DnDgirl
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 17:41 PM 



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I think this is a pretty good build for those looking for a shifter.
5 druid 19 shifter 6 Champion of Torm/Divine Champion
Gets you all the forms plus the epic version of the forms.

Starting stats:

Strength 11 (10) after ffolk subrace
Dexterity 10
Constitution 9 (10) after ffolk subrace
Wisdom 18 (19) With the ffolk subrace
Intelligence 15 (14) With the ffolk subrace
Charisma 8

Level 01 Class: Druid Feat: Luck of Hereos & Weapon Focus Quarterstaff
Level 02 Class: Druid
Level 03 Class: Druid Feat: Alertness
Level 04 Class: Druid Wisdom + 1
Level 05 Class: Druid Spellcraft to 8
Level 06 Class: Shifter Feat: Blindfight Skill Spot and Listen
Level 07 Class: Shifter
Level 08 Class: Shifter Wisdom + 1
Level 09 Class: Shifter Feat: Knockdown
Level 10 Class: Shifter
Level 11 Class: Shifter
Level 12 Class: Shifter Feat: Toughness Wisdom + 1
Level 13 Class: Shifter
Level 14 Class: Shifter
Level 15 Class: Shifter Feat: Lightning Relfexes
Level 16 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Wisdom + 1
Level 17 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Bonus Feat: Expertise
Level 18 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Feat: Great Fortitude
Level 19 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Bonus Feat: Improved Expertise
Level 20 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Wisdom + 1
Level 21 Class: Shifter Feat: Great Wisdom 1
Level 22 Class: Shifter
Level 23 Class: Shifter Feat: Great Wisdom 2
Level 24 Class: Shifter Feat: Undead Shape Wisdom + 1
Level 25 Class: Shifter
Level 26 Class: Shifter Great Wisdom 3
Level 27 Class: Shifter Outsider Shape
Level 28 Class: Champion of Torm/Divine Champion Bonus Feat: Great Wisdom 4 Wisdom + 1 Gets you the 30 Wisdom for Dragon shape Skill Discipline to 31
Level 29 Class Shifter
Level 30 Class Shifter Feat Construct Shape Bonus Feat Dragonshape Skill Tumble to 15 Spellcraft to 15

Skills:

Discipline, Spellcraft, Tumble, Spot, Listen, Concentration, fill the rest with what you want.


 
      
Hell-billy
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 20:36 PM 

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Looking at building an assassin that will take advantage of the Amia bonuses to the class and have death attack with a very high DC.
Am looking at Assassin 20, Fighter OR Ranger 8 OR 9 and rogue OR monk 2 or 1. Would be halfling. Attributes focusing on either intelligence or dex. I'm wondering if high intelligence bonuses becomes redundant on a 30 level cap and if so go for dex. Also is there a better combo to focus on assassin.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 21:05 PM 

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It's so awesome that you now can have monks with staffs.
But how feasible is a sgaff?
Does it have the 1.5 str modifier? The big crit? Etc erc

http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Quarterstaff
Wiki says nothing.

1d6 damage
X2 crit

Doesn't seem overpowering?
But it depends if it counts as a large weapon

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Rigela
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 21:20 PM 

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Read the page you linked, it says the size category it is!

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Hell-billy
 
PostPosted: Sun, Apr 14 2013, 21:41 PM 

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Hell-billy wrote:
Looking at building an assassin that will take advantage of the Amia bonuses to the class and have death attack with a very high DC.
Am looking at Assassin 20, Fighter OR Ranger 8 OR 9 and rogue OR monk 2 or 1. Would be halfling. Attributes focusing on either intelligence or dex. I'm wondering if high intelligence bonuses becomes redundant on a 30 level cap and if so go for dex. Also is there a better combo to focus on assassin.


input?

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Mournal the Guardian: A loyal killer for a mad mistress.
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Theander
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 11:00 AM 



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Sounds like an awesome concept, but I don't think 20 levels is necessary, and I think a lot of it is going to come down to feat choice.

Think about what feats you want to have and use that to modify your fighter/ranger levels.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 12:24 PM 

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So. You are now a quarterstaff wielding monster monk. Awesome.

But how much damage do you do?

The staff counts as a large weapon, so it has 5 mythal powers.

#1 - 5ab
#2 - 4 enchantment.
#3 - 1d10 damage
#4 -Keen
#5 - (Something random)

He is str focused
38 str buffed / that's 12 modifier ( + 12 damage) multiplied by 1.5 = 6 = 12 + 6 = 18 damage.

18 + 4 enchanment + 1d10(1-10) + 1d6 (1-6) = 24 minimum - 38 maximum. Plus a dubble damage on crit.

Add 1d8 (1-8) flame weapon and you get 25 minimum -46 maximum.

More or less then unarmed?
More or less then kamas?

How do i calculate the number of attacks?

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Poorsod
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 12:32 PM 



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http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Unarmed_base_attack_bonus

You'll get six attacks if you multiclass as a full-BAB class. Eight with Flurry of Blows and Haste. If I understood that page correctly.


 
      
Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 12:39 PM 

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No i mean - How do i calculate it? Do i just take Minimum + Maximum and multiply it with X (The number of attacks)? how do i incorporate crit modifier and % chance to miss?

I need a proper way to count the average damage, crit and miss chances included. Any way to do that with a simple math formula?

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slkNihilus
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 13:02 PM 

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There's no simple formula, unless you know exactly what the AC of the opponent you're trying to hit is. That pesky d20 will always make calculating things without knowing it very difficult.


 
      
Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 13:08 PM 

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Okay. If we then skip out of the Hit/miss chance?

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 13:16 PM 

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http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/nwn/

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Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 14:02 PM 

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Naivatkal wrote:
So basically with using a large weapon it's a free disarm attempt, right? With Imp Disarm, of course.

I've also heard there are 'issues' with disarm vs PCs. Are there 'rules of engagement' if in PvP? Is it just returning the weapon after? Derk, I believe, posted in here that when you disarm a PC you take their weapon. Someone else mentioned that only when unarmed do you take their weapon.

How exactly does disarm work in both PvE and PvP?

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 14:04 PM 

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it cant calculate a quarterstaff monk ! :(

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 14:08 PM 

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It can.

Mind that it isn't 100% accurate to NWN (for instance, Weapon Focus and Epic Weapon Focus stack in NWN whereas they don't on that site, because the two feats don't stack in PnP), but it's good enough an estimate.

Anyway, that's a 30 monk with Weapon Focus/Epic Weapon Focus, 38 Strength, standard combat feats and a warforged quarterstaff.

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QPR
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 14:13 PM 

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Uncle-Opustus wrote:
QPR wrote:
Also making a quarterstaff monk, but going the route of 25 monk/5 DwD. My questions is if the SR from 25 monk levels will be enough in PvM, and if there is anything else than the Disarm path, blindfight, dwd reqs and Wf/IMp crit I should take pre-epic?

Four levels of Fighter, duh.


But i want moar SR! But seriously, is the SR from 4 monk levels and an epic bonus that feat inferior to EWS? 16 BAB pre-epic I get from DwD, so fighter would only be useful for more damage.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 14:44 PM 

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PaladinOfSune wrote:
It can.

Mind that it isn't 100% accurate to NWN (for instance, Weapon Focus and Epic Weapon Focus stack in NWN whereas they don't on that site, because the two feats don't stack in PnP), but it's good enough an estimate.

Anyway, that's a 30 monk with Weapon Focus/Epic Weapon Focus, 38 Strength, standard combat feats and a warforged quarterstaff.


Shit. What was war forged now again?
There are trueforged, war forged right? What was the difference?

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CelestialDante
 
PostPosted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 15:38 PM 

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This is a fun tool :)

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