|
|
|
Bladen-Kurst
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 3:54 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Location: Boston. MA
|
|
Hello there. I wanted to inquire about a few questions I have about Druids with neutral evil alignments. Well basically, reading a little about NE Druids, showed that they weren't really "anti-druids" per say. They were more of strict druids, that don't really have that much regard for who they hurt as long as the balance is upheld. So what do I do? Like always I immediately make a druid character(though I already have one, Samaltrimeth), playing through sequences in my head, that he will be the most epic, awesome, respected druid ever (Cough, Theos). I enjoy making evil characters, as much as I do corrupting good characters (Anti-paladin) But basically before I start a huge rant, I have to ask about blighters. Are blighters allowed on Amia? If so, is it something to request, or just how you RP it?
_________________ Dying of Thirst.
Avithoth Namora - General of the Fellowship Shildrogr 'Terror' - Ogre Bear Pirate Svaerken Nevros - Greenkin Mobster Ixator Kildradin - Doomguide of Kelemvor Azavhim Thal'utlar - Big Drow
|
|
|
|
 |
|
TormakSaber
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:17 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere
|
|
Blights are not banned, but you will have quite an issue performng their RP necessities that they ned to do to get their powers. They need to destroy massive amounts of nature every day to fuel their powers.
They would be a request thing due to their nature.
_________________ Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Bladen-Kurst
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:22 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Location: Boston. MA
|
|
Hm.... I might end up writing a request about it. But I see your point, I'd be a pretty big target, since I'm trying to destroy the forests, especially at lower levels. Kinda like trying to level up a Cyricist.
_________________ Dying of Thirst.
Avithoth Namora - General of the Fellowship Shildrogr 'Terror' - Ogre Bear Pirate Svaerken Nevros - Greenkin Mobster Ixator Kildradin - Doomguide of Kelemvor Azavhim Thal'utlar - Big Drow
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Dark Immolation
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:24 AM |
|
|

Developer
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Location: The downeaster "Alexa"
|
TormakSaber wrote: Blights are not banned, but you will have quite an issue performng their RP necessities that they ned to do to get their powers. They need to destroy massive amounts of nature every day to fuel their powers. Yep. My math from the Lore Thread on this. Quote: Just did some quick math, and if I'm correct, at lv 30, a Blighter would destroy a plot of land just under 20 football fields(including in-zones) in area with one Deforestation. 19.62 to be exact. So if a Blighter were on Amia, the populace would know within the course of a few weeks, perhaps days if it was a high level.
It's not just the sheer size of the area affected, it's also that nothing can be grown in that area again, unless Hallow(Lv 5 Drd/Clc) is cast on it. A Blighter has to use Deforestation once every 24 hours to continue to cast spells. So thats 20 football fields of area straight -dead- per day. It's not something that would go unnoticed in all but the remotest of places. And even then, only for so long, you know?
_________________ You think Magic is your ally... but you merely adopted the Art. He was born in it. Molded by it. Sometimes, an angel is simply a devil with better intentions.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
TormakSaber
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:24 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere
|
|
It's not even a trying. you MUST destroy a certain radius of nature evey day or you lose your powers.
_________________ Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Bladen-Kurst
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:29 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Location: Boston. MA
|
|
That'd be quite the mass destruction, but would easily go noticed. Considering I'd be destroying places like the entire forest and behold in a single wave. Hmm... I can see why it isn't a popular RP choice.
_________________ Dying of Thirst.
Avithoth Namora - General of the Fellowship Shildrogr 'Terror' - Ogre Bear Pirate Svaerken Nevros - Greenkin Mobster Ixator Kildradin - Doomguide of Kelemvor Azavhim Thal'utlar - Big Drow
|
|
|
|
 |
|
ShortSlasher
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:57 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 21 May 2007 Location: Western Mass
|
|
After reading lady of poison, I have always wanted to make a blighter....
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Dark Immolation
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 5:20 AM |
|
|

Developer
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Location: The downeaster "Alexa"
|
It's nice on paper, and even in PnP. But on a multiplayer server with multiple groups of people and a slower moving physical setting... it just doesn't work out. I'm personally not too fond of the class, even from a lore standpoint. There are druids that put their paradigm in descruction without utterly destroying whole landscapes and continents. A maxed blighter destroys 15 sq miles in a year. Unless someone is putting that back or they're moving around, whole cities and kingdoms are dying. As Kanye said: 
_________________ You think Magic is your ally... but you merely adopted the Art. He was born in it. Molded by it. Sometimes, an angel is simply a devil with better intentions.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 6:03 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
|
An actual Blighter class PC would get so annoying to deal with. You have to kill someone who keeps destroying the wilds by the square miles at a time where the Druids can only repair the damage by spending a whole day hallowing those lands so that they can regrow.
Druid RP would basically become us going to where the Blighter was last and hallowing the land (which takes 24 hours to cast) and trying to hunt the Blighter down. And even when the blighter is killed, there's no perma death, so what's the point?
It'll become a vicious, boring and obnoxious circle of stupid, if you ask me. Unless the class was altered for Amia.
Druid player out!
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Bhaalorian
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 6:31 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2011 Location: On the edge of sanity
|
|
Destroy even a single tree in the forest and you will likely be hunted and killed by the non-evil-aligned druids. Seriously..
_________________ ~Elrith Jr'ein, Aspirant of the Heralds of the Triumvir.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Grymia
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 6:44 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Location: Kohlingen, and a Basement in Canada
|
|
I have to agree with Willow's assessment. Plus, the Druids do have friends, and others who would see the Forest safe from harm.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Vinasius
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 6:46 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 21 May 2007
|
|
Evil druids are eco terrorists ie. Pantheros Syvalnight one of my mains believes himself to be a stalwart defender of nature...regardless of whatever others believe of him. He was a former silvanus follower who worships malar and the dogma of malar due to the single fact : that from his experience other nature deities don't do enough to stop the cancer of civilisation from spreading.
contrary to what most pc chars think of malar.(Man i've had pc's calling me disease spreading, undead summoning, creature of blight, and i'm like..what?)
dogma of malar is as below: Survival of the fittest and the winnowing of the weak are Malar's legacy. A brutal, bloody death or kill has great meaning. The crux of life is the challenge between the hunter and the prey, the determination of who lives or dies. View every important task as a hunt. Remain ever alert and alive. Walk the wilderness without trepidation, and show no fear to the hunt. Savagery and strong emotions defeat reason and careful thought in all things. Taste the blood of those you slay, and never kill from a distance. Work against those who cut back the forest and who kill beasts solely because they are dangerous. Slay not the young, the pregnant, or deepspawn so that prey will remain plentiful.
even amongst the holy days.. Feast of Stags
This day has made Malar's worship more tolerable in certain areas. During the harsh winters in the northern parts of Faerûn, Hunts will choose a village in the wilderness, providing food for the people, with one or two Malarites pledging themselves to keeping the village fed through the snows
Hope this post clears some peoples disposition toward malarites thinking that their all like the goons from Forest of Despairs...
_________________ Currently starring: Vinasis D'Magi- Calishite Merchant Pantheros Sylvanight- Lycanlord of Malar Artorious Godstrike- Paladin of Torm
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Grymia
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 6:47 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Location: Kohlingen, and a Basement in Canada
|
|
I do agree.. Malar and Disease spreading (save maybe Lycanthropy which is a DM only thingy.. ) .. doesn't quite add up
One can be an Evil Druid though without being a Blighter as Vinasius just illustrated.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Nysor
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 7:26 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2008 Location: Wherever it is, it better not be cold
|
|
Good Malarites are tough to play, and really awesome to watch RP-wise. Evil druids too. Kudos to anyone who tries it. Its certainly possible without being a destructive force to nature itself.
_________________ Nysor Shorshanis: A squirrel in his own right Solrend Inignus: The Kossuthian cleric who is "hot, but not in that way" Adin Twitterleaf: Crazy elven trickster. Isaac Kley: Young gimp of a sorcerer.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 9:15 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
|
Disease spreading and blight of nature isn't a unfair assessment of certain Malarites though (I should mention though, Malar is indeed served by at least one priest Lich, so undeath by his clerics wouldn't exactly be frowned upon, I don't think). But anyway, this isn't about Malar, this is about the Blighter class and Evil Druids.
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Selvec Darkon
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 9:20 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Location: On a Disk, carried by four elephants, which stand on a gigantic turtle.
|
|
I think if a Blighter was included on Amia it would be reasonable to assume there would be some major changes to the RP and the Class to make it fit better with a multiplayer online environment, and to make it actually playable.
_________________ I keels u with my axe!
"Do ye know where the Holy-Flamin' Frost-brand Gronk-slayin' Vorpal Hammer o' woundin' an' returnin' an' Shootin'-Lightnin'-out-yer-bum is?"
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Vinasius
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 11:15 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 21 May 2007
|
Quote: Disease spreading and blight of nature isn't a unfair assessment of certain Malarites though (I should mention though, Malar is indeed served by at least one priest Lich, so undeath by his clerics wouldn't exactly be frowned upon, I don't think) Hey gunz, not too sure about disease, The gospel of Saernclaws is a holy decree that applies to all priests of Malar. It was the creation of Garmos Saernclaws. It reads: “ The Hunt must be clean. If disease or affliction is visited on hunters by a beast, clergy of Malar must do all they can to root out and exterminate the taint, that bloodlines and beasts in the wild remain always strong." But you may be right against undead, i always read somewhere that Malar they were against undead as all druids are, but could you point to me of the reference for the lich that serves malar..i would love to read up on it. and you have waaay more lore knowledge then me =) actually if any of u could just point to some good resources of evil druids, malar and their stance on undead etc would really be appreciated.. Re-blighters, I'm not sure how the blighting/destruction of nature bit can be mechanically executed in game. may a once per day ability, negative energy drain on a certain radius around the caster? but then the environment around said toon would have to change as well.. no idea.
_________________ Currently starring: Vinasis D'Magi- Calishite Merchant Pantheros Sylvanight- Lycanlord of Malar Artorious Godstrike- Paladin of Torm
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 16:18 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
I always wondered why there were no evil druids on Amia, I'd think they would be pretty fun to play, if horrendously isolated people, due to EVERYONE hating them as someone pointed out to me. Who said Banites had it bad again? So I have a question for the DMs, if someone played a NE druid of Malar or such and didn't have any problems with undead, or at least could tolerate them. Would that be acceptable? or no? Least that would allow them SOME allies or at least a mutual benefit among necromancers or even Banites.
Never heard of a blighter class till now, but IMO they sound interesting, they'd need to be altered something fierce before they could be played tho. Like maybe rather then outright destroying a forest, they drain it dry over time, plants dry up, lakes dry up, land dies, but slowly, very slowly. Like it would take a good long while before people start to notice, but when they do notice, it's severe, kind of like how a disease builds up over time and then wracks the whole body at once. And since this IS a PW, it would likely be in direct proportion to how active he was, the more power he uses the more it drains etc. This would of course still lead to an eventual event where people hunted down and killed said blighter, so eh..
Also, what would happen if a blighter didn't destroy anything? or least put it off for awhile, he looses his powers and what else? He dies? if not could he get his power back again or is it gone for good?
|
|
|
|
 |
|
IronAngel
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 16:31 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
|
|
Malarites aren't the best example of evil druids. Malar's extended (F&A) dogma tells you to kill druids and piss on their weak ideology of balance. 3e allows for Malarite druids, but they must be somewhat different from the archetypical enemy of civilization who defends the balance and autonomy of nature with no regard for human life. Silvanites make great eco-terrorists.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
|
|
|
|
 |
|
hendrack
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 17:37 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
|
|
Make druids of Sebek, there are enough swamps on Amia to feel comfy.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Nekhy
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 19:44 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 29 Dec 2009 Location: A beautiful fowl house in A'dam
|
hendrack wrote: Make druids of Sebek, there are enough swamps on Amia to feel comfy. They have a nice place of worship in Khem, too.
_________________ Current plots: DIVIDE BY ZERO ERROR
Prod me for development-related stuff.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Pony
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 20:04 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 07 May 2005
|
|
Neutral deities are awesome for evil. You need not devote yourself to the overlord of darkness, but your character can intend what he sees as good and the will of his patron with extreme measures. Evil Kelemvorites, evil druids of Silvanus, evil protectors of Helm, etc. I find those concepts far more interesting than the simpler all round bad guy.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
tsukasa1991
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 20:14 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2009
|
|
i have one question. if a blighter needs to destroy forestation to have powers then why would one willingly stay in amia an island with lots and lots of adventurers and little forest space ?
_________________ Plays- Maggot Bucktooth (Retired) Giando Paladrious (Retired)
|
|
|
|
 |
|
My Sovereign
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 20:34 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 19 Sep 2010
|
|
I made a blighter with Huge viper shapeshifting, who was undead, and could use all his spells while shifted...
Completely legit...lich snake.
_________________ - "The fiend is less hideous in his own shape....then when he rages in the breast of man"
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Bladen-Kurst
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 20:47 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Location: Boston. MA
|
|
Well. Possibly If a blighter was looked at as a class, then you wouldn't have to only take blighter for all your levels. Though it isn't a class in the game, so its just kinda like you ARE the Blighter. Soo you will have to destroy a extremely ridiculous amount of land each day. I'm making my Evil Druid though, well I made him prior to this. Hes basically going to be similar to what I read, which is a stickler to the rules of the balance, and doesn't care who he harms to protect the land. Still working out how he is, but it'll be similar to that.
_________________ Dying of Thirst.
Avithoth Namora - General of the Fellowship Shildrogr 'Terror' - Ogre Bear Pirate Svaerken Nevros - Greenkin Mobster Ixator Kildradin - Doomguide of Kelemvor Azavhim Thal'utlar - Big Drow
|
|
|
|
 |
|
NAUX
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 20:53 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 15 Mar 2010 Location: Norway
|
|
There are more evil druids than you think out there! (SHIFTY EYES)...
_________________ The inspiration behind the character: - https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Grenadier_(3.5e_Class) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBjewxCxKLA
|
|
|
|
 |
|
phalanxyrian
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 21:11 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Location: under your bed (the netherlands)
|
|
You could always play a Blightlord. Make some kind of druid blackguard. They dont deforest stuff they just corrupt it into some non undead undeadish state. Its all in "the unapproachable east".
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 21:23 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
So NE druids and undead mix just fine?
|
|
|
|
 |
|
IronAngel
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 21:30 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
|
|
No. The DMs are quite strictly of the opinion that Druids of any alignment should have nothing to do with undead, or even actively work with brethren of the faith who use them (though this question is less clear and you'd have to find out IC, anyway).
You could play a Talontar Blightlord I guess, yeah. They don't do undead, they just do disease and stuff. But while some of them are druids before taking the Prestige Class, the PrC itself has little to do with the druid class and isn't simulated very succesfully with druid levels. But I imagine Talontar Blightlords are subject to the same restrictions as normal druids of Talona, more or less. (Edit: Apparently not. Talontar Blightlords turn their backs on druidic traditions and ignore weapon and armor restrictions. Nonetheless, they're not undead summoners, they bring blight.)
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 21:58 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
No. Druids + Undead = Bad. No matter how you slice it. We've been through this already. In fact, we had a pretty long discussion about why Druids hate Undead and Aberrations in the lore thread just a week or two ago. Go there and have a read. Saernclaws gospel is something that Malarite usually adopt, yes, but it's not Malarite dogma. They don't -have to- obey it. And truth is, lots of them don't. The People of The Black Blood are disease spreading monsters. Lycanthropic lay worshipers of Malar can be horrible disease spreaders too. Sure, they're nowhere near as bad as a Talonite would be, but that's besides the point. That would be like saying cutting yourself with a knife isn't an injury, just because you didn't lose a limb for it. Malarite -can- be eco-terrorists, but they're actually more typically children of slaughter, murder, destruction and bloodlust. I have to agree that Silvanites make the best eco-terrorists by far. Silvanus is the only truly neutral nature god in the Faerun Pantheon. He has good, neutral and evil clergy. As for the priest of Malar who's a lich: Quote: Malar is also served by a few rare Beast Lords. These lone spellcasters breed unnatural monsters like bulettes, stegocentipedes, owlbears, perytons, and so forth. While most Beast Lords are human, a few are drawn from the ranks of other races such as illithids and beholders. One prominent nonhuman Beast Lord in the North is an illithilich, believed to be based in ruined Dekanter, who seeks to conquer part of the dark realms of the Underdark with an army of beasts. So there you go. Also, note that there are normal aberrations who take to the path of Beast Lords of Malar too. These aberrations, undead and combinations of the both are things his Druids would have to be extremely careful about associating with. Luckily, these things don't exist on Amia and I'm willing to bet Malarite Druids have no clue about these things usually. Those that do, probably consider them great enemies and heretics to the Malarite faith.
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Yossarin
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 22:10 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 23 Jan 2006
|
Yossarin wrote: There are 3 primary forces in the universe: the dynamic, the entropic, and the static. Dynamism is defined as creation, or "forward" progress (natural or civilized); entropy is the proceeding downswing, which can be destruction, it can be death, it can be misfortune, it can be regression; these two universal concepts comprise the cycle every druid by virtue of being a druid adheres to, with or without any formal training from a Circle of Druids. Some favor the dynamic over the entropic (certain Chauntean agriculturists, for example), and some favor the entropic over the dynamic (predatory druids of Malar, for instance, or blighters, which are still technically druidic). Most you will see encourage the whole "balance" aspect, and while they apply the concept of balance to a lot of themes - civilization vs. nature, tend to nature vs. let it do its own thing, good vs. evil, etc. - they are ultimately operating within the universal confines of the Dynamic/Entropic cycle.
Druids have access to their divine abilities because they have made an implicit or an explicit "pact" with their deity to ensure that the Dynamic/Entropic cycle is affected to some combination of their deity's will and the druid's will. In my estimation, there's always a little bit of breathing room there for personal interpretation (though not as far as dealing with the undead, and I will explain precisely why to you shortly). Let's take an Aurilite druid for example. A druid of Auril would have the responsibility to ensure that winter does as winter should do, in all its glorious themes. Drive away autumn and forestall rebirth of spring as long as possible. Chill mankind to the bone and lay waste to his crops. Put certain mammals into hibernation and others into vicious hunting cycles for food to keep their metabolism/body heat going. Snowblind. And somewhat like a cleric of Auril, a druid of Auril might have the secondary responsibility (it would be primary for a cleric) to remind people of the association between winter and Auril. It is not frostbite that destroyed your child's fingers and toes, it was Auril's breath. That avalanche was not a circumstance of pent-up snow, it was Auril's heaving breast, or the full weight of her displeasure with your mountain community. Alternatively, a frozen lake is Auril's gracious gesture, allowing a possible yet treacherous passage across the water to those who would otherwise have too much difficulty in a boat.
Where this decidedly personal notion that the druid is responsible for the Dynamic/Entropic Cycle comes from is up to you to decide, but it is an imperative you must accept of playing the druid class.
I mentioned 3 different forces. The third is the Static. When most people tend to consider the iconic "good" and "bad", they have the kneejerk belief that dynamic is good and entropic is bad. In actuality, it is the static that is more often than not "bad", because entropic is really just part of the cycle of life.
The Static, on the other hand, is alien. It is Other. It is outside of the normal flow of events. Unnatural. There are a few things which belong to the universal static force (constructs, architecture, civilization when it stops being dynamic and reaches a peak and becomes the concrete jungle before it starts to crumble entropically, ideas, whatever one might associate with unchanging, unaffected, and non-moving). The undead are a prime example of the static. They are neither living nor dead and thus exist outside of the Dynamic/Entropic cycle that druids are naturally prone to defending.
Therefore, any druid who tolerates the presence of the undead is, in fact, courting not only violation of the principles the druid personally holds dear (and has to hold dear for his or her magic to work!), but is also at great risk of angering their divine patron, particularly if that patron is anti-undead.
The situation you raise is an interesting one. A druid of Auril and a non-druid of Auril together, and the non-druid summons an undead. Both of them serve the same deity. One would think the deity would provide some slack to the druid, right?
Not so, for at least two reasons:
- Regardless of the deity, the undead is ANATHEMA to the druid...again, regardless of any formal training or teaching in a circle. You are naturally, almost preternaturally disposed against the undead as a druid. To tolerate the presence of the undead without so much as demanding it go away or putting it away or leaving the area is to have the druid force him or herself into a quandary: by failing to act, am I failing my principles? Doubt is the enemy of any magician, arcane or divine. Arcanists combat doubt with knowledge (Int-based), or with raw personal force (Cha-based). Divine casters combat doubt with faith (Wis-based, generally). By going against your faith and courting doubt, you immediately risk Falling...even if Auril has no problem with you hanging around, YOUR OWN construct of being a druid is threatened and you spiritually abandon the connection to your deity.
- Alternatively, the druid may have the very question you have: the person who summoned the undead serves my goddess. Is She telling me to tolerate it, even against my will, even though it makes me sick to my stomach to be near it? Not likely. Let's frame Auril here for a moment. Winter's chill is intended to slay people...and never let them come back to life, unless it is through Auril's grace, with people making great sacrifices to her. She wants the bitter bite of cold to have a very physical effect on everything it touches, be it man, animal, life, matter, flora, fauna, emotions, whatever.
Now, you could logic to yourself, "Oh, the undead are cold! Therefore, they must be approved by Auril, yeah, because they have chilling touches! Especially winterwights!"
The chill of the undead is NOT winter's chill. It is negative energy chill. There's a significant difference. That significant difference being that the former is Auril's domain, her control, the extension of her divine will in the world, and the other is not.
The keener logic for the druid to apply is the idea that Auril might not actually like the undead. Why? They don't feel her cold. They're immune to the freezing temperature and the harshness of the snow. They just get buried and come out again unaffected when springtime rolls around. They don't suffer, and they'll never worship her. Auril is a goddess with a domain and a power of nature, a domain/power that is firmly within the Dynamic/Entropic Cycle, and therefore anything from the Static is probably an affront to her because it is "immune" to her winter.
And therefore, why should the druid tolerate the undead? It may come from the same source, but any divine caster should have the wisdom to understand that the deities do not necessarily approve every single spell that is cast, they merely approve of the ability for the faithful to cast it. If the faithful casts it incorrectly or wrongly, then the deity is likely to be incensed...if they notice. And therefore, the non-druid Aurilite summoning the undead is using Auril's divine gift incorrectly and needs to be corrected by the druid. I deserve to be quoted. 
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Mobile_Svensk
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 22:16 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
|
|
Yossarin. I've used your quote, Too, In educational purposes. Do you demand royalty money for it?
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 22:57 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
Well that clears it up, guess a truly evil druid will have to remain a loner for the most part, or keep his actions secret.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Dark Immolation
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 0:06 AM |
|
|

Developer
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Location: The downeaster "Alexa"
|
|
Nope. An evil druid would just have to realize that there are more forests on the server to hang out and dominate other than Amia Forest. >_>
_________________ You think Magic is your ally... but you merely adopted the Art. He was born in it. Molded by it. Sometimes, an angel is simply a devil with better intentions.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 0:21 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
Most Druids are said to be loners at heart anyway. My Druid certain is. 
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Yossarin
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 0:24 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 23 Jan 2006
|
|
Nah, I know how you can be an evil druid without being a loner. You just have to find the perfect way for that evil to manifest. "Eco-terrorist" is a beautiful one thrust out by G&R whose druid RP I trust pretty much implicitly.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 0:56 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
Eco-terrorist as draining natural resources to meet their needs, goals, ect? Or someone that actively seeks to destroy nature?
Or wait, you mean they go after humans and civilization and the like in the name of nature? I dunno if I'd personally consider that evil..
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:12 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
SLS wrote: Eco-terrorist as draining natural resources to meet their needs, goals, ect? Or someone that actively seeks to destroy nature? No, that's not what an Eco-terrorist is. An Eco-terrorist is a person who commits acts of "terrorism" in defense of nature. So they actually do the exact opposite of what you're thinking. For some real life accounts of "Eco-terrorists," you can look at groups like: Animal Liberation Front Earth Liberation Front Sea Shepherd Conservation Society Some people consider PETA to be Eco-terrorists too, and I suppose they kinda can be. Their methods are pretty tame, in comparison to the three groups above though. Then there's also Green Peace, who are rarely, but still sometimes, called Eco-terrorists. The term hardly fits them though, imo. They're non-violent, which is a key and defining element in any real Eco-terrorist. There are varying degrees of extremes taken by all these groups. But I think the main thing that qualifies as an Eco-terrorist in the real world is the use of violence to get things done. Of course, in the FR setting almost all Druids use violence when pushed. So an Eco-terrorist in the FR world would probably be someone who takes things to true extremes. Here's an example of something I think a true and full Eco-terrorist would do: Town A is logging Forest X at an unsustainable rate. The Druidic Society for Forest X is mad. The Druidic Society for Forest X begins slaughtering Town A loggers as they come without warning. Town A loggers begin bringing back up support to fend off Druidic Society for Forest X's actions. The Druidic Society for Forest X then decides it's time to hit harder. The next day, Town A no longer stands, it has been totally destroyed by Druidic Society for Forest X over night, killing nearly all peoples there. Eco-terrorism isn't strictly for evil though. Neutrals can totally be Eco-terrorists too, but of course not nearly as bad as evils.
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:29 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
So basically acts of killing in the name of nature then?
Hmm then the ground rules for Druids, regardless of alignment would be:
Disapproves of/Hates undead. Always puts nature first and never harms it but does use it to his/her advantage. Needs to be aligned with a deity of like mindedness?
Could a Druid have no deity? I know there are ways for Clerics to find divine power through philosophical means, or faith in their beliefs and not necessarily a deity. Like Fall From Grace from PS:T, could Druids do that as well?
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Nekhy
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:35 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 29 Dec 2009 Location: A beautiful fowl house in A'dam
|
Oh man, I'm an eco-terrorist... Seriously, eco-terrorism as a word is really bad and invented by the people who meet the other definition of the word. For example the groups in your example are all nonviolent by principle. ALF is probably the most extreme of them, because they target property (which doesn't count as violence, it's not against people). Even Sea Shepard doesn't do that, unless forced to. Anyway, basically in FR an evil druid is just a druid on steroids and based on the principle end justifies the means. They stop at nothing to defend nature, whilst a good druid will stop to think how his/her actions affect others. And in FR, a druid must have a deity. Must.
_________________ Current plots: DIVIDE BY ZERO ERROR
Prod me for development-related stuff.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:38 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
You are? Remind me not to mess up your lawn Nekhy.
Well I guess that clears up things, I'm still not sure if I'd consider that sort of action "evil", least not a clear evil, it's far to vague. But I suppose most kinds of evil tends to be.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:48 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
|
A Druid can harm nature, actually. There's just a fine line. A Malarite can slaughter, a Talonite can spread disease, a Kossuthian can burn some trees, a Talassan can create destructive storms and they can stay Druids. They can embrace the destructive force of nature -- it's what an Eco-terrorist does too, really. They just can't be ones who do nothing but destroy nature and seek it's total elimination, like the Blighter does.
Yes, all Druids oppose undead -and- aberrations. Some oppose outsiders too (save for elementals, usually).
And yes, a Druid should of course be aligned to a god that shares most of his ideals or how can the relationship possibly work? You need to have a connection to a god to be his priest, surely? Druids aren't the preachy priest types as Clerics usually are, but they still are what they are: they're priests.
In standard D&D, yes. But we're playing in FR. All Clerics, Druids and other divine casters (Rangers, Paladins, Champions, etc.) -must- get their powers from a deity (god, primoridal, powerful outsider, etc.). There is no such thing as a Druid who gets their power right from nature in FR and there is no such thing as a Cleric who gets his powers right from his philosophical ideals. There -must- be a deity involved.
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Gunz
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 1:55 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
|
Nekhy wrote: Oh man, I'm an eco-terrorist... Seriously, eco-terrorism as a word is really bad and invented by the people who meet the other definition of the word. For example the groups in your example are all nonviolent by principle. ALF is probably the most extreme of them, because they target property (which doesn't count as violence, it's not against people). Even Sea Shepard doesn't do that, unless forced to. I agree that the word Eco-terrorist is stupid and doesn't fit. But the term was developed to mean what it's come to mean now. Violence doesn't have to be directed at people to be violence either. the ELF, ALF and Sea Shepherd organizations are all arguably "Eco-terrorists" by it's definition because they do indeed use violent acts to get things done, even if it's not directed at people all the time. I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling them all "bad" or "evil" though. I actually like the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society. I support their cause. I don't like the ALF or ELF though. They go a bit too far for my taste. Especially the ALF. Funny enough, I don't like PETA because they don't go far enough and they're total hypocrites. Green Peace, I consider to be too soft for the most part, but at least they're not hypocrites. Go figure!
_________________ My Characters: Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
|
|
|
|
 |
|
IronAngel
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 11:50 AM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
|
o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote: Saernclaws gospel is something that Malarite usually adopt, yes, but it's not Malarite dogma. They don't -have to- obey it. Just to be accurate, dogma is a whole of beliefs that some religious party maintains. If some Malarites believe it to be normative, divinely inspired or even somehow pertaining to the divine and correct (such as the logical consequences of some basic articles of faith), then it is part of their dogma. Dogma is by definition something mundane and social, not an immutable truth given from above. There's no reason to assume the short blurbs in F&A, DD, P&P and F&P are anything but rough sketches of the central beliefs a faith generally holds. The idea that every god had given similar, long (F&A etc.) and short (F&P) versions of their dogma at the dawn of time for the churches to keep, is not very believable. So I wouldn't objectively seperate a core dogma Malarites "have to" obey and adiaphora they can dismiss or adopt at will, because what Malarites consider such will vary locally. Despite the tangibility of the FR gods, I don't see why it would be much different from the Bible: even among Christians who do believe the Bible to contain divine revelation (and I guess all Faerûnians fall under this category, so we can ignore the non-believers), you will find huge disagreement in what is the "actual" core of the faith and what's just historical coincidence and optional baggage. I don't see a need to dumb down IC theology to gamer level and assume the reality of faith is any easier than in the real world. So in short: what is believed normative IC is dogma and what isn't, isn't. The paraphrased dogmas in game book shouldn't be considered normative IC documents but rather overviews of the faith to us players. There's no reason to assume every priest or lay-follower will know, acknowledge or adhere to all facets of those descriptions or that the authority of dogma is limited to them. It would be a pretty short and light substance of faith, if the latter was the case, whereas we have plenty of examples of "heresy" that is perfectly tolerated by the god if condemned by the dogma of the mainstream church. I don't believe you would go as far as I suggested, but I thought your choice of words warranted some attentio anyway. What you said about druids is solid, as usual (if a little extreme and absolute for my skeptical tastes).
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
|
|
|
|
 |
|
colanah
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 15:47 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2008 Location: Lost In Thought
|
|
I'm just a tiny bit curious on the whole "Destroy the module" aspect. As long as there were IC witnesses saying that an area had been destroyed the way it often is cited after things like hellballs and Ice storms or Greater Ruins....who's to say a Blighter couldn't request a widget to do the VFX of Wounding Whispers or such and ICly say something happened without a full on map change?
I mean, if we go by the usual Amia stance of the "Hell ball or ten wrecked the forest!" and next reset it's assumed the local nature squad took the night through to mend it unless RP otherwise is felt to be needed. This is part of the day/night cycle as well kind of messing with both sides of the argument time wise. Not disparaging it, just tossing it out there.
I'm sure there have been players with items that required an IC kill count for the items to remain powered up without the victims being perma'd. Perhaps the "RP impression" of forest death for a Blighter that falls within accepted DM boundaries?
Also...A Talontar Blightlord is just about the most awesome thing to crawl out of Talona in forever.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Selvec Darkon
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 15:54 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Location: On a Disk, carried by four elephants, which stand on a gigantic turtle.
|
|
In my upon, Blighting of nature should not be a mechanic given to PC's. Ever. Its something best left to DM's. A PC can do it under DM supervision and such, but it shouldn't be made into a mechanic or ability that can be used willy nilly. It's a good plot device for a story, not so much as a PC driven ability.
Greater Ruin, Hellball and such all don't necessarily effect the environment around them. They effect other PC's more then they effect the RP environment. However Blighting effects the environment more then it effects PC's. Heck I'm not even sure it does effect PC's other then making goodly druids have a little cry.
Maybe a Mechanic for blighting could be. "vs Goodly & Neutral Druids, Will DC 20. Failure forces characters to their knee's and forces an emote of "Begins to bawl her eyes out over the wee plant life all killed"
_________________ I keels u with my axe!
"Do ye know where the Holy-Flamin' Frost-brand Gronk-slayin' Vorpal Hammer o' woundin' an' returnin' an' Shootin'-Lightnin'-out-yer-bum is?"
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 15:59 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
Selvec Darkon wrote: Maybe a Mechanic for blighting could be. "vs Goodly & Neutral Druids, Will DC 20. Failure forces characters to their knee's and forces an emote of "Begins to bawl her eyes out over the wee plant life all killed" Urm.. what? Isn't that more of a "reaction to the blight" then a "workings of the blight" mechanic? Also doesn't Hellball only target a single person? Does it still count as destroying the surroundings?
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Selvec Darkon
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 16:08 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Location: On a Disk, carried by four elephants, which stand on a gigantic turtle.
|
|
Mechanically it targets one person. But the actual spell is meant to leave untold destruction behind it. Another point actually, Blighting simply wouldn't be possible as a PC ability due to the fact that mechanically it probably wouldn't be possible to implement. Unless the DM's want to put a stamp on something and enforce an emoted description of whats going on. Which previous requests suggest they do not want to do.
But yea, I mean, does it have any negative effects on people? Or is it strictly focused at killing off nature? Cause if it has no negative effect on PC's o monsters I can't see it working to well. As a buff, maybe, but then you lose the aggressive element of blighting, which is essentially killing of mass life...just...plant life. <_<.
_________________ I keels u with my axe!
"Do ye know where the Holy-Flamin' Frost-brand Gronk-slayin' Vorpal Hammer o' woundin' an' returnin' an' Shootin'-Lightnin'-out-yer-bum is?"
|
|
|
|
 |
|
SLS
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 16:15 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
|
|
Well, you could always take the easy, and cheap route, that they take trips far beyond the islands and do their destruction out of the reach of any PCs.
Also destruction of nature doesn't mean just burning down/plaguing forests and stuff right? They could cause things like droughts, floods, stuff like that. Small things here and there that get worse over time and build up. That way they wouldn't have to just ruin one forest, they could do minor forms of mayhem all over and feed of that, the cumulative would still total to a fair amount of destruction no? Or wouldn't that work.
EDIT: Here's a thought, if Blighters are not limited to the type of destruction they cause, then they could also kill sea life and the like right? In that way the destructive RP for the PC in question could be done on the forums, as he goes about destroying the ocean and would have no direct impact onto the module's design or appearance. Wouldn't have to worry about other PCs not reacting to it either, since the ones that do will be the ones that read the forums. Ie. those that pay attention to the local news and changes, where else the others would simply go about their business being in the dark.
|
|
|
|
 |
|
colanah
|
Posted: Wed, Feb 09 2011, 17:16 PM |
|
|

Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2008 Location: Lost In Thought
|
|
AH..see, I was thinking about Hell Balls since the VFX for those is pretty AoE damage inducing from the looks of it. Torn up ground, the works. Must be the untold destruction part of the equation.
Ice storm is just a massive rain of..well ice. Sharp, bludgeoning, you name it. I figured it was like a massive hail storm and we've all at one point seen the damage a heavy hail storm can do.
SoV has always struck me more as a Talosian favorite than anything. Acid, lightning, massive devastation if you imply it. Nice for someone looking to harm far and wide.
Greater ruin...hmm.. This would be my first pick for something a Blighter could do only it would be red light not golden white. Red/green for a sickly brownish thing... But like many things, that's just me. I'd think maybe 3-4 non-plotted tree deaths a reset might count but I'm not the deciding party by a long shot. Unplotting random trees on maps would keep the Blighter on the move and nature folks chasing him or her.
Actually, that's kind of dynamic in a very weird way.
|
|
|
|
 |
Who is online |
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 34 guests |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum
|
|