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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Sun, Feb 06 2011, 19:16 PM 

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And is the dc for the attacks 10+ass levels+int mod?

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Dark Immolation
 
PostPosted: Sun, Feb 06 2011, 19:19 PM 

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Uncle-Opustus wrote:
I'd rate EMA better than the summon with that build, but in case you want them both, just go Wizard23/WM5/Fighter2, or the rogue one as Ulir suggested. Undebatably grabbing an UMD/Tumble class is the way to go and more CL is never in vain.


Yep. When it comes to spellsword, you're either going to be casting a few things or standing in melee. Summons you use as decoys maybe, but they are certainly not worth spending an epic feat on if you don't have your other ducks in a row.

Epic Mage Armor. Definitely. If you spring for a second epic magical feat, it could be anything. A summon is a nice decoy or little perk(Again, you're a spellsword, you really don't require a meat-shield like a weak regular mage). The thing is a lv 9 summon or some of the undead ones serve as just as good a decoy at higher levels. But Hellball could be good to soften up a heavy spawn before charging in. And Greater Ruin is a really good finisher for those long, drawn-out pvp matches that might come if the person you're fighting has high AC like you. Just wait til they get down to Badly Wounded/Near Death and boom. Can't be interrupted or dodged.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 9:39 AM 

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A spellsword without EMD and EMA is silly. Like really really silly. With EMD you have zero down time in terms of DPS and aren't using up a party slot with a decoy, your using it up with something that can actually do damage etc.

23 Wizard 5 WM 2 Rogue works best.

24 Wizard 5 WM 1 Monk is cool points.

24 Wizard 5 WM 1 Harper Scout is even cooler points.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 9:50 AM 

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I won't delve too much into the assassin thing, but would 14 levels be sufficient?

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Dramatic_Prince
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 12:00 PM 

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Ulir wrote:
I won't delve too much into the assassin thing, but would 14 levels be sufficient?

10 + 14 Int Mod + 14 Class = 34
Low DC? I think so.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 12:53 PM 

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Not against reflex or will. Very nearly auto-success versus a bunch of classes. 14 is high enough to do a few things.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 13:36 PM 

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Then I .. need to ask one more thing. I don't mind the mediocre DCs, but I would like to know how many of the new abilities I will be able to get with 14 levels? I would have to say tata to Murder and Kneecapper's Knife, eh?

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 13:37 PM 

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Ulir wrote:
Then I .. need to ask one more thing. I don't mind the mediocre DCs, but I would like to know how many of the new abilities I will be able to get with 14 levels? I would have to say tata to Murder and Kneecapper's Knife, eh?


Knecapper's at level 16

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 13:38 PM 

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Quote:
This kit contains the various tools and liquids needed for a skilled assassin to perform and execute her special underhanded techniques. Every last bit of this equipment seem engineered towards a single minded purpose; killing it's target as efficiently as possible. As the assassin's skill progresses, so does the complexity of her attacks and techniques.

//OOC Note: To use these techniques, simply use the kit and select which one to use. All of these abilities have a cooldown of 1 turn once a target has been hit by this (saving throw rolled, not failed save VS effect) before another attempt can be made. The cooldown is universal and will persist for 1 turn even if you change which ability to use. Note that you do not have to reapply it after each use, the ability will be activated and on your weapons for 1 Turn per Assassin level.//

Braining Blow (Stun) (2 rounds, will)
Head injuries are especially traumatic, and the Assassin knows this. Heavy, blunt force dealt by a pommel or leaden arrow can temporarily stun a foe, leaving them vulnerable to a follow-up strike.

Shrill Strike (Deafness) (Turn/assassin, fort)
The importance of the sense of hearing in combat is not lost on the Assassin. An attack upon the auditory organs leaves the ears of the Assassin's foe ringing painfully.

Beshaba's Favor (-d4 all stats) (supernatural permanent, doesn’t stack, will)
The Assassin becomes adept at turning disadvantage to advantage, weakness into strength, bad luck into blessed fortune. Provided, that this misfortune falls upon the Assassin's victim.

Stalker's Throat-Dart (Silence) (1 round/ assassin, fort)
Landing a blow to the throat is one of the most difficult attacks an Assassin can make. By no chance, it is also one of the most rewarding.

Induce Amaurosis (Blindness) (1 round/assassin, fort)
The Assassin knows that something as innocuous as a culinary spice can have more malign uses. Pepper, thrown into the eyes of the foe in the heat of battle, leaves them a bit burned.

Blade of Terror (Paralysis) (1 round/assassin, will save to counter)
The appalling viciousness of the Assassin's assault cows the target into submission. The assassin may make a death-attack that causes overwhelming fear to the target of this ability.

Bloodlet (Leveldrain) (supernatrual permanent stacks, fort)
The Carotid and Femoral artery are prime targets for a cutting or piercing strike. An accurate slice can cause the most extreme case of profuse bleeding: untreated, such a strike is as good as a death-sentence.

Kneecapper's Knife (Knockdown) (Rounds/3Assassin, reflex)
The legs are a promising, if difficult to hit, target. They are often more lightly armored than the torso, as even the most rigid plate armor has many joints and thin parts in its metal.

Murder (Death, death ward ignored, fort)
The most valuable and feared tool at the Assassin's disposal is not their famed agility or skill with blade or bow, but their knowledge of anatomy and flagrant disregard for the niceties of honorable combat. This attack leaves nothing about the Assassin's motives to question. A feint, a flash of steel from the shadows, or a careful shot: a strike made with the intent to bring their target down instantly, no matter the cost.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 13:40 PM 

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I thought as much. Alrighty.

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My Sovereign
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:28 PM 

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22 Barb/7wm/1rogue

Plausible?

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:32 PM 

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My Sovereign wrote:
22 Barb/7wm/1rogue

Plausible?


On a human you have 8 feats pre-epic.

WM Cost 6 feats
#1 Dodge
#2 Mobility
#3 spring attack
#4 Wep focus
#5 Expertice
#6 Whirlwind

Then you have
#7 Imp.Critical
#8 Blind fight.

If you're looking to make a STR version, you'll loose out on Dev.crit unless you mix in Fighter levels, but then you'll have to few Barb levels. Or if you try to make it a dexxer, but then you'll have to dump a feat to make room for wep finesse.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:32 PM 

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Feat strapped.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:33 PM 

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Here's the barb builds i know of that work

16Barb/13Rogue/1ranger (Dex based
24Barb/4Fighter/2Rogue (STR based
24Barb/2Bard/4rdd (STR based and Con based
28Barb/2Rogue (Con based

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:46 PM 

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Ughhhh 24 Barb 2 Bard 4 RDD. . .thats terrible.

FYI.

24 Barb 5 WM 1 Rogue works a treat with say a Greatsword.

20 Barb 8 CoT 2 Rogue works aswell albeit you need to spend a feat on heavy armor prof.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:48 PM 

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MoshingChris wrote:
Ughhhh 24 Barb 2 Bard 4 RDD. . .thats terrible.


Works wonders. You only need to spend a feat on Heavy Armour proficiency, and since you get extra STR you don't need to MAX your STR attribute, This makes your stat sheet look tad nicer as you don't really need a dump stat.

Resilient and sturdy, with looaaads of Hp.

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maglorine
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:54 PM 

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Dragonshape Druid - need improved unarmed strike? I'm thinking of all the potential Attacks of Opportunity. Looked at the builds on page 58 and didn't see it mentioned.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 21:57 PM 

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Very_Svensk wrote:
MoshingChris wrote:
Ughhhh 24 Barb 2 Bard 4 RDD. . .thats terrible.


Works wonders. You only need to spend a feat on Heavy Armour proficiency, and since you get extra STR you don't need to MAX your STR attribute, This makes your stat sheet look tad nicer as you don't really need a dump stat.

Resilient and sturdy, with looaaads of Hp.


Also stupid as hell because you only took 4 levels of RDD.

18 Barb 2 Bard 10 RDD is doing it properly, your way is cheap cheap and will in future prevent the character from being rebuilt to any other class but X X RDD as-well as being one of the easier(cheaper) ways of getting Mighty-Thundering.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 22:00 PM 

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maglorine wrote:
Dragonshape Druid - need improved unarmed strike? I'm thinking of all the potential Attacks of Opportunity. Looked at the builds on page 58 and didn't see it mentioned.

Don't need Improved Unarmed Strike, it's treated as a creature weapon (except for Improved Critical) so you won't trigger Attacks of Opportunity.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 22:00 PM 

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May be, But the option is out there. It's not up to me to decide whether it's a good or bad thing for the player's RP, I just provide the builds.
Needles to say i'm quite confident that the player making such a character will regret himself/herself in the future, Or go the full length of 10Rdd or come up with an excellent excuse to why there's only four levels.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 22:56 PM 

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Very_Svensk wrote:
May be, But the option is out there. It's not up to me to decide whether it's a good or bad thing for the player's RP, I just provide the builds.
Needles to say i'm quite confident that the player making such a character will regret himself/herself in the future, Or go the full length of 10Rdd or come up with an excellent excuse to why there's only four levels.


Not going to say anything else other than this:

Responsible players don't do this. Its like giving someone whose tried to kill themselves 5 times a gun and locking them in a dark room effectively. I don't mean this directed at just you either, but just "providing the builds" makes you look like an ass on an RP server. Thats how I view this thread.

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Mobile_Svensk
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 23:02 PM 

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If I'm the irresponsible guy with a gun, Then you're the gun salesman. You fine tune the stuff and fill in the 'blanks'. So you're basically shooting yourself in the foot with that comment.

Let's not even get into gun politics.

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DerkDerkistan
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 23:22 PM 

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What he's saying is there's a difference between making something solid and making something cheesy.

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Vaul Tarrith
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 23:41 PM 

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I believe this is the 3rd time this conversation has come up in this thread: the classic conundrum of Acceptable Cheese vs. Nasty Dirty Shame-On-You Cheese. That's usually when Tormak locks it off and starts a new one.

Take her away, boys! :twisted:


 
      
Nekhy
 
PostPosted: Mon, Feb 07 2011, 23:48 PM 

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Cheese is much better on crackers than in builds.

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Roppi
 
PostPosted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 0:45 AM 

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Part of amia's appeal for me is that it caters to a wide variety of
Players IMO. Tea partiers, drama mamas, boss farmers, mob grinders.

Also, having a 'cheesy' build doesnt magically make one a worse off RPer. Similarly, gimping one's build doesn't make them better suddenly. They're two separate issues.


 
      
maglorine
 
PostPosted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 2:41 AM 

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PaladinOfSune wrote:
maglorine wrote:
Dragonshape Druid - need improved unarmed strike? I'm thinking of all the potential Attacks of Opportunity. Looked at the builds on page 58 and didn't see it mentioned.

Don't need Improved Unarmed Strike, it's treated as a creature weapon (except for Improved Critical) so you won't trigger Attacks of Opportunity.


That is good. Now the question is:

Imp crit unarmed

Or

Greater Spell focus Evocation - just for the improved save DC while he's getting by as a caster Druid/zen ranger before getting Dragon Shape. He doesn't have the feat slots to get ESF Evoke by the way.

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TormakSaber
 
PostPosted: Tue, Feb 08 2011, 4:21 AM 

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Vaul Tarrith wrote:
I believe this is the 3rd time this conversation has come up in this thread: the classic conundrum of Acceptable Cheese vs. Nasty Dirty Shame-On-You Cheese. That's usually when Tormak locks it off and starts a new one.

Take her away, boys! :twisted:


To be fair, 81 pages is quite a bit, in any case.

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