AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - The Official Build and Build Advice Topic: Mk. IV

Oh, and in terms of overcoming spell resistance, a level 10 wiz/20 pm would give you a caster level of 10. This doesn't affect you when summoning undead as a pm though. The more pm levels, the stronger your arm attacks. Got myself one of those builds. Think the DC for the arm attacks are 46 or so. Very funny, but you only get three death attacks and six paralyze attacks per day. The paralyze attacks can be switched to level drain, str drain, control undead etc. via widget you can ask for.

If you meet someone with spell resistance above 30, you are screwed spellwise. Thats where the arm comes in handy. :twisted:

Quote:

If you meet someone with spell resistance above 30, you are screwed spellwise. Thats where the arm comes in handy.

10+1d20+6(+10 for Mords)=27 to 46 for beating SR..

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz? Mords aside, since its troublesome to keep up and.. you only have limited spells and time.

I was thinking of a 10 wiz/20 palemaster WITHOUT sp and an insane amount of mords naturally.

If one were to try this shifter-thingy, but only for the vampire, nothing else, what would be a good build.
I was thinking I would pick the vampire picture in the creation (which could also just be a middelaged gentleman, though slightly pale), and only ever use the unshifted or the vampire form.
Its not to try to force others into the whole blood sucking RP, but theres a sweet area just under Cordor where I think some decent RP could be created.
So, any idears for a good build?, mainly PvM wice, I hate to be a party leech, but I would like to avoid shifting into various forms every second minute. It would be best to stay unshifted untill the vamp shift will be avaible.

Palemaster wrote:

Quote:

Some things cannot be fixed in a feasable way.

By your logic then, anyone casting any spell with BBOD summoned is using an exploit. Besides, an eight year old with a crayon could implement a script to change BBOD if it is infact considered an exploit. That said, I still disagree that its an exploit.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=48066

Go ahead and write a script for Terra if its so easy then.

what if someone would have 52 spell resistance?

Pose a nuisance to casters without epic spell penetration?

On a Bard8/SD6/AA16:

Bard7-SD6-AA7 Pre Epic
AA9-Bard1 Epic

STR - 10
DEX - 19
CON - 10
INT - 14
WIS - 8
CHA 13

Pre-Epic:
Dodge, Weapon Foc: L-Bow, Mobility, Point Blank, Rapid Shot, Called Shot + Imp Crit.

Epic:
Armor Skin, Epic Prowess, ESF: Spot, Epic weapon Focus + Blind fight (Couldn't take pre-epic and the available Epic feats were useless to me at this point.)

Should I keep the 13 CHA for spells to make the earlier lvls a bit easier to progress, or should I just put the two spare points into STR or CON?

CON or WIS

8 WIS base on a spotter?

Good point, I'll take WIS then. Thanks.

Ulir wrote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz? Mords aside, since its troublesome to keep up and.. you only have limited spells and time.

I was thinking of a 10 wiz/20 palemaster WITHOUT sp and an insane amount of mords naturally.

How does your palemaster get mord spells when he cannot even cast level 9 spells?
He's quite restricted to level 5 spells only.

Very_Svensk wrote:

Ulir wrote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz? Mords aside, since its troublesome to keep up and.. you only have limited spells and time.

I was thinking of a 10 wiz/20 palemaster WITHOUT sp and an insane amount of mords naturally.

How does your palemaster get mord spells when he cannot even cast level 9 spells?
He's quite restricted to level 5 spells only.

10Wiz/20PM has same spellslots as 20Wiz, doesnt it?

Just has crap caster level. Apart from on Epic Spells.

Now you made me unsure, cloak.

I'm pretty sure its only Sorc/Bard Palemasters that are gimped when it comes to getting new spells. Because they can never get new spells known unless they are levelling in the base class. Wizard/PMs are fine, just need some scrolls to learn from.

Anubis wrote:

On a Bard8/SD6/AA16

AA16 is useless, so it's either SD7 or Bard9.

Right, thanks, 7 SD it is then.

Quote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz?

Yes.. because with 3 feats you can raise your CL 6 levels... Unless your certain your going to use items with spellpen bonus feats (Even then I'd want the epic spell pen).. They are basically required for that build. With A LOT of SR gear on amia, you might as well just not memorize any spells if you dont bother with spell pen and stay at CL 10. As a PM you have to expect PvP quite often, why gimp yourself so your 99% ineffective in it?

-Cloak-and-Dagger- wrote:

Very_Svensk wrote:

Ulir wrote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz? Mords aside, since its troublesome to keep up and.. you only have limited spells and time.

I was thinking of a 10 wiz/20 palemaster WITHOUT sp and an insane amount of mords naturally.

How does your palemaster get mord spells when he cannot even cast level 9 spells?
He's quite restricted to level 5 spells only.

10Wiz/20PM has same spellslots as 20Wiz, doesnt it?

Just has crap caster level. Apart from on Epic Spells.

10 wiz/20 pm gets the same amount of spells a level 30 wiz gets. You don't get the possibility to choose new spells when gaining a new level though, lest it be wizard. Its much more pokémon'ish, since you have to search for spells, or have others scribe them for you.

Palemaster wrote:

Quote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz?

Yes.. because with 3 feats you can raise your CL 6 levels... Unless your certain your going to use items with spellpen bonus feats (Even then I'd want the epic spell pen).. They are basically required for that build. With A LOT of SR gear on amia, you might as well just not memorize any spells if you dont bother with spell pen and stay at CL 10. As a PM you have to expect PvP quite often, why gimp yourself so your 99% ineffective in it?

I don't play my PM as an offensive caster, but a summoner with great touch attacks and AC. EDK, Mummy Dust, Winterwight, 2x greater Mummy Lord makes up for the lack of offensive casting when encountering someone with a mage foe item (there are many players without such an item), and of course the insane DC 46 touch attacks.
If bothering with the spell penetration, why not simply go 20 wiz/10 pm? Its the caster variant.
I was mentioning the 10 wiz/20 pm build, which really isn't worth using spell penetration on. Either the spell works (in many cases), or it doesn't. The alternative uses precious time, risking failure if rolling 1-4 with mords and spell penetration.

I prefer having hide/ms maximized, letting the summon nom on the enemies. If my spells don't work, I can thunderclap them, hellball them, or give them a nasty touch attack.

Ulir wrote:

Palemaster wrote:

Quote:

Would you really waste all those feats on spell penetration when you only can count as a level 16 wiz?

Yes.. because with 3 feats you can raise your CL 6 levels... Unless your certain your going to use items with spellpen bonus feats (Even then I'd want the epic spell pen).. They are basically required for that build. With A LOT of SR gear on amia, you might as well just not memorize any spells if you dont bother with spell pen and stay at CL 10. As a PM you have to expect PvP quite often, why gimp yourself so your 99% ineffective in it?

I don't play my PM as an offensive caster, but a summoner with great touch attacks and AC. EDK, Mummy Dust, Winterwight, 2x greater Mummy Lord makes up for the lack of offensive casting when encountering someone with a mage foe item (there are many players without such an item), and of course the insane DC 46 touch attacks.
If bothering with the spell penetration, why not simply go 20 wiz/10 pm? Its the caster variant.
I was mentioning the 10 wiz/20 pm build, which really isn't worth using spell penetration on. Either the spell works (in many cases), or it doesn't. The alternative uses precious time, risking failure if rolling 1-4 with mords and spell penetration.

I prefer having hide/ms maximized, letting the summon nom on the enemies. If my spells don't work, I can thunderclap them, hellball them, or give them a nasty touch attack.

If I recall correctly and you setup the 10wiz/20pm right you can have sooo much ac that you can basically mele so you aren't flat footed >.> And be completely ok. Then either poke em or let the summons chew on their arm for a bit.

16PM 14 Wizard has the most AC, Since it get access to Epic Spells, Like Epic mage armor.

Zifon wrote:

If one were to try this shifter-thingy, but only for the vampire, nothing else, what would be a good build.
I was thinking I would pick the vampire picture in the creation (which could also just be a middelaged gentleman, though slightly pale), and only ever use the unshifted or the vampire form.
Its not to try to force others into the whole blood sucking RP, but theres a sweet area just under Cordor where I think some decent RP could be created.
So, any idears for a good build?, mainly PvM wice, I hate to be a party leech, but I would like to avoid shifting into various forms every second minute. It would be best to stay unshifted untill the vamp shift will be avaible.

Isn't Druid 5/Shifter 10/Barbarian 15 a decent build? Damage reduction II, four attacks per round, four greater rages, increased movement speed, and taunt for that extra AB. You can use barbarian's rage and taunt in shifted forms, as far as I recall.

You should try making a Druid/Shifter/DD or Druid/Shifter/Fighter, playing an easily angered dwarf, when upset begins to ignite (turning into an Azer) and fly into a frenzy "Flame on!". Gives "hot-tempered" a new meaning.

Very_Svensk wrote:

16PM 14 Wizard has the most AC, Since it get access to Epic Spells, Like Epic mage armor.

But.. when going 20 pm you get +12 AC & the opportunity to get epic mage armor. Req is 16+ pm levels. So +2 armor.

*Sticks out tongue*

Next Build challenge - To make a Hipsing Dev.critting Arcane Archer with epic Dodge...!

*le sigh* Not doable... But Bard+ AA + Fighter or COT is. But it isn't halfway as fun.

10 WIZ/20 PM would have problems getting epic spells unless the Wiz levels are taken at 1-5, and then again at 25-30. Your non-epic spells would suffer, and your last 5 levels wouldn't really do much of anything.

20/10 would NOT be able to get epic spells.

Quote:

In Neverwinter Nights, epic spells are implemented as feats that are selected while gaining levels. These feats can be chosen upon reaching level 21 in an appropriate spellcasting class or level 15 in pale master. Each epic spell can be chosen once, and each epic spell is usable once per day.

Very_Svensk wrote:

20/10 would NOT be able to get epic spells.

Quote:

In Neverwinter Nights, epic spells are implemented as feats that are selected while gaining levels. These feats can be chosen upon reaching level 21 in an appropriate spellcasting class or level 15 in pale master. Each epic spell can be chosen once, and each epic spell is usable once per day.

You lost me with this. At L5 Wiz+16 PM (L21) epic spells can be chosen.

I read 20Wizard/10PM, My bad

You can't take more than 10 levels of PM pre-epic. Much like the other special classes. Otherwise you could grab 25 pm levels. You receive seven epic feats with 10 wiz/20 pm though.

But you need 15 PM levels before 21 to be able to get epic spells.

10 wiz/10 pm pre-epic. 11 pm is epic pm. So you get a pm bonus feat at 13, 16 and 19 pm and then another four epic feats at level 21, 24, 27 and 30. Of course you can only take epic spells from level 26, which means you can take four epic spells, which should be good enough for EMA, Mummy Dust/EDK, Greater Ruin and Hellball.

A long... long... time ago in a galaxy far far aw- Err... I mean a long... long time ago someone posted a 1000 HP build. Anyone happen to have that saved somewhere? >.> I cannot locate it using the search and I do not want to go through all 4 build topics.

Something with Dwarven Defender, Barbarian and... such.. Think it was Opustus or Ruce who made it. Perhaps they know more.

Do neither of them even look at this topic anymore? >.>

It's rather easy.
Just go Pure barbarian, and focus in CON. Simple.

Edit - You can cross over to more than 1000HP, I believe... Pick Thoughtless, And 3x Great Constitution, Then the barbarian rages will do the rest.
That's as far as i'd go, Without totally crippling the build.

Gotta re-do Brax. I had him down as taking more than 10 PM levels pre-epic. I re-worked his build. Help me out with the feats.

Brax-

Half Orc Male

5 Wizard
16 Pale Master
9 Fighter

STR: 15
DEX: 13
CON: 12
WIS: 8
INT: 16
CHA: 8

1. (W) +1 Dodge
2. (W)
3. (W) +1 Expertise
4. (W) +1 INT
5. (W) +(1)
6. (PM) +1 Exotic Weapons
7. (F) +1 Weapon Focus: Dwarven Waraxe
8. (F) +1 Toughness +1 INT
9. (F) +1
10. (F) +1 Weapon Specialization: Dwarven Waraxe
11. (F)
12. (PM) +1 Improved Critical +1 INT
13. (PM)
14. (PM)
15. (PM)+1
16. (PM) +1 INT
17. (PM)
18. (PM) +1
19. (PM)
20. (PM) +1 STR
21. (F) +2 Armor Skin, Epic Weapon Focus
22. (PM)
23. (PM)
24. (PM) +1 Epic Weapon Specialization +1 STR
25. (PM)
26. (F)
27. (PM) +1 Mummy Dust
28. (F) +1 Epic Prowess +1 STR
29. (F)
30. (PM) +2 Epic Mage Armor, Greater Ruin

1.140 HP, Pure Barbarian, CON based.

Note - This is only with +15CON Modifier and Mighty Rage

Switch armor skin with epic weapon spec, since you can only take EWS on a fighter level.
You can't grab mummy dust until level 16 pm, so you might want to switch it out for greater ruin, if you prefer the summon.

Is this suppose to be a spellblade build btw? Because 9 fighter levels is not necessary, and Tenser's will only give you +2 ab and last 10 rounds with extend spell, which you don't have (yet).

Very_Svensk wrote:

1.140 HP, Pure Barbarian, CON based.

Note - This is only with +15CON Modifier.

Lies! >.> Show me the numbers. I was aiming more for a solid 1000 hps... not the additional hp added on top but that might have to do if I do not want to hamper the build more.

1d12 HP = Barbarian.

15CON modifier + 12HD = 27 + Thoughtness = 28 HP per Level. Then 30 Barb levels = 30x 28 =840 + Mighty rage = 10HP per level of Barbarian = 1.140

You need 21 strength for Mighty Rage which you wont get with your builds 15 con modifier

How are you getting mighty rage with 15 CON?

The 1000 HP build was a 19 Barb/ 10 CoT/ 1 Fighter I think. Taking epic toughness non stop.

Yeah, a spellblade-type character. Going for lots of AC, decent AB, and a couple epic spells. I don't want less than 16 PM levles.

Brax-

Half Orc Male

5 Wizard
16 Pale Master
9 Fighter

STR: 15
DEX: 13
CON: 12
WIS: 8
INT: 16
CHA: 8

1. (W) +1 Dodge
2. (W)
3. (W) +1 Expertise
4. (W) +1 INT
5. (W) +(1)
6. (PM) +1 Exotic Weapons
7. (F) +1 Weapon Focus: Dwarven Waraxe
8. (F) +1 Toughness +1 INT
9. (F) +1
10. (F) +1 Weapon Specialization: Dwarven Waraxe
11. (F)
12. (PM) +1 Improved Critical +1 INT
13. (PM)
14. (PM)
15. (PM)+1
16. (PM) +1 INT
17. (PM)
18. (PM) +1
19. (PM)
20. (PM) +1 STR
21. (F) +2, Epic Weapon Focus, Epic Weapon Specialization
22. (PM)
23. (PM)
24. (PM) +1 Armor Skin +1 STR
25. (PM)
26. (F)
27. (PM) +1
28. (F) +1 Epic Prowess +1 STR
29. (F)
30. (PM) +2 Epic Mage Armor, Greater Ruin

MoshingChris wrote:

You need 21 strength for Mighty Rage which you wont get with your builds 15 con modifier

Sure you do, Take Dwarf or Half-orc as Race, Max STR, Then attempt to Max out con as much as possible, Then you grab 3 Great CON feats as i said.
Quite sure it works, but don't take me for granted - it's late

Why would you give such shitty advice?

Dwarf
22 Strength
21 Con

11 Con Modifier + 12 + 1
24 x 30 = 720 + 300 Mighty Rage = 1020

Hell take a level of Rogue or Harper Scout for a tumble dump and you'll still break one thousand.

Nets EDR III stacks with Barb reduction and resistance on that build to effectively double the amount of HP it has in PvM

You can't get a 15 Con Modifier and 21 strength

15 con mod = 28 base con/21 base strength. That is 12 ability raises. Since you can only get Strength (Con) to 17 at character creation and at best a Pure Barb gets 6 epic feats.

Its late isn't an excuse either, if its late and your tired don't post XD

Hmm, actually you can Mosh. Earth Genasi 20/19.

*Sticks tongue out at mosh*

ticket wrote:

Hmm, actually you can Mosh. Earth Genasi 20/19.

I know since I was the one that balanced the Mighty Rage. If you look into the Salvage Defensive Stance and Mighty Rage topics that Svensk can't see, you'll find I make that abundantly clear XD.

Edit: Nope you can't because its in another forum

Basically its all about the Tri-Rage Barbarian, horribly gimped but fun anyway.

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