I was wondering if a drow female can be non-priest class? a warrior of sorts, or even a wizard, for example. as far as I have understood, she would be above all male no matter what, but below female clerics (99% of all other drow females, right?)
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Any female is by default 'morally' above a male in drow society.
But being a non priestess role would give you the the opportunity to be moulded and manipulated by the religious females. Should fit into exactly what your looking for.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
You can be any class, you don't have to be Yath. And when commanding males, it does come down to politics - you technically outrank them from your position of being female, but chances are they have a lot more experience and know what they're doing (and they could belong to someone else).
What drow female can order which also comes to politics - if you want to be bossed around, shouldn't be too much of a problem, and I'd suggest a melee class or a linthar (bard) rather than a yath or mage for that role. That said, being a rogue and an agent of the VDVM can put you publicly submissive as your cover while being an investigative person underneath, and gives you a good IC reason to be be submissive - you don't want anyone to know you're a spy.
That said, so long as you're able to pop out babies you'll always be in a reasonable position in drow society, unless you play really stupidly (which has been known to happen). But if you want to remain above males, again that's politics - if they see everyone walking over you, it can quite soon come to the point where the males do so too, and observing females may not interfere on your behalf (again, politics ... it's the best part about being drow).
You have to enforce your own social status, or you may find yourself a nice ornament (or toy) for some yath or another.
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Good stuff in here. I've been thinking of making a drowess and wish to go for the slightly less 'status' position and have her become an assassin. From my understanding, assassins are valued in drow society and so that, in itself, would help. Granted, her cover would have nothing to do with her assassin jobs, and so being more submissive to other females would help aid her in that task. Of course, she isn't going to be a pushover, just submit to those she really needs to (ie the high status drowesses). It's all just a cover until her power and skills build, until she can reasonably take down those that she truly despises.
*cackles*
I've even toyed with the idea of giving her come cleric levels every now and then, mostly giving her rogue and SD levels, though. Haven't given thought to actual assassin levels, as they are rather muted compared to PnP
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
If I recall correctly, Drow society frowns upon using ranged weapons in combat as it is considered 'cowardly'. They are known to use hand-crossbows before going into battle, but only as something to hit the enemy while they're charging towards them.
If I recall correctly, Drow society frowns upon using ranged weapons in combat as it is considered 'cowardly'. They are known to use hand-crossbows before going into battle, but only as something to hit the enemy while they're charging towards them.
drow use sleeping poison in their hand-crossbows, making the enemy go asleep before they can retaliate. then they either enslave or kill them while they are affected by the poison... not to mention they levitate hidden up in the ceiling and behind any cover and shoot from there.
and they send slaves first: kobolds and goblins, which breed fast and are best cannon fodder.
there's some "bravery" of the drow for you.
Uncle-Opustus wrote:
VDrow Vspy Macademy?
that is what I was wondering myself too.
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I don't want to participate into politics or anything.
If that's the case, I would strongly advise you not play a drow. The drow thrive on political intrigue and maneuvering. If you're not interested in that part of the RP, then you may very well become frustrated with your character as they're used as a pawn for other people's machinations.
_________________
"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
TeroSNS wrote:
to Yurell: wth is VTVM?
As Numbers said, the VDVM (Vel'xundessa Drow Velsharen Magthere) is the drow spy institute.
TeroSNS wrote:
and could you explain what you meant about playing stupidly?
Waltzing around with constant demands, trying to press yourself too far ahead of your station etc. Just think, if there's something you wouldn't do to your boss, don't do it around a priestess, with the added caution that your boss isn't allowed to flay you alive and make you dance.
TeroSNS wrote:
Could an archer be a reasonable option?
It could be, it just all boils down to how well you RP it, with the added note of caution that longbows are rarely used - although I'd presume this is because they're near-useless in narrow, winding caverns compared to the easy to move crossbows.
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As I see that if I make a warrior type of female, The highest leader of melee maghtere is always a male. ...getting slightly confused on the pecking order...
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so If I get BS inside the magthere, I could order him outside to whip him? and they would boss me around again in magthere. I would whip again. bossing. whipping. ...
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Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
Eh, no. I suggest not trying that. You need to get a feel for it yourself. He outranks you, but your exact position therein is nebulous. It all boils down to your RP. Step to far and you will probably get burned so quickly you'll learn where the line is.
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Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
not gonna lie, the first line i read "i wanna be above males" just oozes of a female who my male will give absolutely no respect to, and will get away with it.
i hope im wrong though, but it seems like all the wrong reasons to play a female drow. If you really want to be above males but not run the town, play a male and work your way up the ranks, dont take the easy way out.
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
not gonna lie, the first line i read "i wanna be above males" just oozes of a female who my male will give absolutely no respect to, and will get away with it.
i hope im wrong though, but it seems like all the wrong reasons to play a female drow. If you really want to be above males but not run the town, play a male and work your way up the ranks, dont take the easy way out.
That is why do not ever read only one part. I indeed said "as far as I understand". I am new to this whole drow thing. it is even said in the bible "there is no God" or something like that. but if you look bigger picture, it says something like "Oh woe is to that who says There is no God"
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Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
oh i understand that. just remember, while you might technically be higher rank socially than any males, pick your battles wisely. I've known females to be totally and completely ruined in the past for going against the wrong male.
edit - also, my post came off a little bit more confrontational than i intended... was going for a semi sarcastic tone that didn't translate at all into typing.
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
just dont whip the wrong ones ;p
you never know who has the bite to back up their bark. or if they'll choose to use it.
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
Seriously, though.... if I could teach one lesson to every new female drow player, it would be this:
Just because you've got the power doesn't mean you have to use it.
Technically, yes.... you would whip the tar out of the leader of the MM, but you probably won't like the outcome very much. I strongly suggest learning about that lovely fictional "culture" of the drow as much as possible and then going IG with your character. You'll get the ropes of how it all works a lot easier if you watch the interactions of others.
_________________
"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III
My suggestion for the Drow newcomer: Start of as a male and try the waters for some time. Then you can make a female to go further than before.
*coughs* Besides, who says you can't have any power as a male? Spiderguard, hellooooo!
_________________ "Most assume that all the followers of Lathander are great morning people. They're very wrong." "I think we are the only group where AD&D stands for Attention Deficit Disorder."
Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
only as powerful as they pretend to be, you mean.
back in ultrinnan i didnt take crap from nobody, and it suited me just fine. Here, however, with the lack of a formal setup for everything and such, its a little harder to invoke spiderguard rights. I'm working on it though, slowly but surely.
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
You didn't take crap because I invented an organisation of thugs who only took my crap instead of everyones. When I amskrayed, nobody had the galbas to tell you lot what to do.
_________________
Man, this account is over 10 years old. Where do I get my old man beard?
Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
true dat.
btw play more. i miss my numbers
*and that filthy abomination you like to call a jabbress.
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
Being a drow priestess is like having a permanent +1 to your authority.
No matter how high or accomplished your mage is her voice would never really hold as much weight as that of a religious calling.
I don't want to participate into politics or anything. I just want to be above males, but below other females
not to mention cleric as a class... is not one I would call my "own" if you know what I mean.
I want to order some, but also be the one ordered. . . . that sounded sorta wrong.
1. I'd assume you are talking about the current state of the drow city in Amia, because there are some places (Sshamath, the City of Dark Weavings, for example) where mage females actually higher rank in society than yaths, but only because magic is the prime focus of the place and yaths are outnumbered, which technically could happen in any drow city
2. As far as playing a sub drow of other females, that's easy enough: don't join a house, then you are a commoner and your words don't count for squat and virtually every other female is above your rank. I wouldn't go around whipping males just for the hell of it, specially if they are claimed (unless you are doing it to initiate some interesting RP). Drow society that thrives on the yath's of Lolth, even though evil and chaotic, still followed the priestesses' ~wisdom~. So I'd have to agree with the posts that say, learn the lore and play smart. If politics, malicious outsmarting and wise backstabing of your fellows isn't your game, then drow is probably not for you. Remember drow that are able to do those things are considered strong, and if you are a stupid drow you were probably murdered by your own mother as a child.
I am new to drow rp, that is true, but I have read many novels and rulebooks about drow and their cultures. Also talked it with my rl rp pnp friends. (in my opinion amia drow rp is a little off of that, but what the heck) I think I can manage. and I gotta tell you, these last few days of drow rp have made my return to amia enjoyable ^^
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Forget technicalities. There's only one rule that applies in Drow RP: do anything you can get away with. In the glory days of my male warrior, he overruled matrons without consultation. And then later, when his support had waned and some were starting to smoke him out, he stepped out of the limelight before he could be violently overthrown. It wasn't glorious for him, but he lived and could continue to achieve things. And that's what matters in drow society, and what makes it fun: favor waxes and wanes, but always play your cards so that you're breathing at the end of the day.
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On Joon, Kjetta wrote:
The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
My female Drow, Riz'rae, is a mage. The Ul'faeruk of Sorcere and the Faern obviously still have rank above her, but because she's female she doesn't get bossed around as much. Simple as that..
Playing a Drow Female -properly-, by the way, doesn't mean going around as some no-name commoner and commanding all the male characters to do as you please. That's rather abusing power you don't actually have. In Drow Lore, a noble male is actually above a female commoner of no rank, even if women are the superior sex of their race.
Riz tries to get on the good side with most men she doesn't abhor and puts her foot down only when the situation actually calls for it, and I'd say she does pretty successfully in the Underdark. It's never a bad thing for the male populace to not hate your female enough to assassinate her, or perhaps like her enough to aide her.
Joined: 26 May 2006 Location: Down Under, calculating your demise with blunt expressions.
The short answer: Anything is possible.
The long answer:
The Amian Drow playerbase are extreme Menzoberanzen fanatics. We're really talking extreme here. They'll find any excuse to and try their absolute hardest to enforce Lolth's way or the highway on you. What they forget is that Lolthite Drow are not the only organised group in the Underdark: the Underdark on B caters for Drow and other Underdark races to be whatever the hell they want. If you want a Drow monk, noone can tell you that you can't. If you want to make a Drow Druid, noone can stop you either. Bloody hell if you wanted to make a male Lolth worshipping Goblin cleric who smoked shrooms all day who peed on people as a form of worship, you could get away with it too (right until the pitchforks come raining down on you followed by pages of discussions on the forums by angry players.)
For starters, you don't have to be a Lolthite. There's a ton of deities you can worship as a Drow:
Shar, Ghaunadar, Selvetarm, Kiaransalee and Malar are safe, alternative choices you can choose because they are openly tolerated by Lolthites for several reasons: the deities are allied to Lolth or indebted to her (Selvetarm, Malar and Kiaransalee) or Lolth may not even be aware that her children are worshipping other deities or relishes in the chaos caused by worshipping them (Shar and Ghaunadar).
Not to mention the other deities you'd find worshipped in the Underdark that Drow could be swayed to: Asmodeus, Orcus, powerful demons and devils, Tiamat, Garagos, Gruumsh, Illneval, Shargaas, Luthic, Garm Glittergold, Deep Duerra, Vhaeraun, Velsharoon, Bhaal, Cyric, Bane and Mask to name but a few. Hell you could even play as an Eilistraeean down there if you were smart enough.
But the issue is that 99.99% of Drow in Amia's Underdark are Lolthites and over-zealous ones at that. They'll prosecute you or whine if you don't do what they want you to do... so do what Iron says: don't get caught. Play what you want to play, you have the opportunity to.. but be smart about it.
It's been well-known Galenson's long-standing less than appreciative attitude towards Lolthite drow. While, he's entitled to his opinions and view points. I have to politely disagree with his logic. Drow -ARE- zealots. They -ARE- xenophobic. They -ARE- bigots. To say that the drow playerbase is such things is either a very highly paid compliment or a slap in the face, depending on whether it was intended as their IC actions and attitudes or their OOC actions and attitudes. I took it more as the latter and think the tone of the post to be rather deconstructive and passive aggressive.
Galenson is right, though. There are plenty of other options for a drow player to pick as a patron god for his new drow character other than Lolth. Yet, in the grand scope of drow, Lolthites outnumber all the other drow on Faerun by far and even the followers of other gods often give lip service to Lolth and reside in a Lolthite society, even if they do follow a different god in secret. There are a few drow cities that do not have Lolth as their patron god. The only one I could really find off the a quick search of the Forgotten Realms Wiki was Chaulssin. That's one out of the eight listed there.
This is not to say that Amia shouldn't be different, but the way to make that change come about is to get in game and play. Complaining here will do nothing.
_________________
"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III
It's been well-known Galenson's long-standing less than appreciative attitude towards Lolthite drow. While, he's entitled to his opinions and view points. I have to politely disagree with his logic. Drow -ARE- zealots. They -ARE- xenophobic. They -ARE- bigots. To say that the drow playerbase is such things is either a very highly paid compliment or a slap in the face, depending on whether it was intended as their IC actions and attitudes or their OOC actions and attitudes. I took it more as the latter and think the tone of the post to be rather deconstructive and passive aggressive.
Galenson is right, though. There are plenty of other options for a drow player to pick as a patron god for his new drow character other than Lolth. Yet, in the grand scope of drow, Lolthites outnumber all the other drow on Faerun by far and even the followers of other gods often give lip service to Lolth and reside in a Lolthite society, even if they do follow a different god in secret. There are a few drow cities that do not have Lolth as their patron god. The only one I could really find off the a quick search of the Forgotten Realms Wiki was Chaulssin. That's one out of the eight listed there.
This is not to say that Amia shouldn't be different, but the way to make that change come about is to get in game and play. Complaining here will do nothing.
He's not complaining. HE's stating a fact. A fact that has been made very apparent by players on the Underdark forums lately.
_________________ Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Location: [st]Ultrinnan[/st] [st]Edonil[/st] Nec'perya
hey! not all of us are menzoborranzan fanatics!
In fact, all i know if it is that its a city!
_________________ Slander [Zanthair Akarupa of the Horsemen of the Apcalypse] - Sorcerer 'Mediocreare' Isendu't'tar Ussen'd'Vhid d'My'ana'd'Xull'd'Vharcan - possibly the longest name in Amia Tiffany Seagrass - weak and fragile weaver of words
Yet, in the grand scope of drow, Lolthites outnumber all the other drow on Faerun by far
Can you provide a link? I thought the Ghaunadarian population was higher.
That was a conclusion based upon the largest cities I could find reference to being Lolthite and 7 of the 8 cities listed on the Wiki as being Lolthite. I don't have the source books handy, mind. I also did say that it was a quick search on the Forgotten Realms Wiki, too.
TormakSaber wrote:
He's not complaining. HE's stating a fact. A fact that has been made very apparent by players on the Underdark forums lately.
Seemed to me like he was. Perhaps I read it wrong, but when a person has a history of reacting to certain topics in a certain way, then anything said will be taken in a certain light. You of all people should understand that fact having fallen victim to just such a phenomena before.
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"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Location: On a Disk, carried by four elephants, which stand on a gigantic turtle.
While the sorcere and its wizards may never be as pubically authoritive as a priestess, the Clerics of Lolth would have to be completely daft to actively anger and seek out conflict with the sorcere. Wizards have as much, if not more, potential for power as clerics in most cases. Its why in a lot of lore you see leader of the sorcere always having a lot of influence in how things happen in the city. Not offically or publically, but more offering "advice", with that tone that suggests if you ignore it bad things may happen.
_________________ I keels u with my axe!
"Do ye know where the Holy-Flamin' Frost-brand Gronk-slayin' Vorpal Hammer o' woundin' an' returnin' an' Shootin'-Lightnin'-out-yer-bum is?"
you would whip the tar out of the leader of the MM.
Buwahahahah. Good luck doing that to Mal!
Though, my honest opinion:
It all comes down to Role-Play. All actions have consequences, either they be negative or positive to your situation. If a drow female thinks she could whip the Ul'saruk or Ul'faeruk? Well, then, so be it! The Role-play that'd develop out of it would be amazing either way.
In the end consequence, just play the game and see what happens.
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The Spiderguard is only as powerful as their Ulath'tallar.
