AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

In Game spelling errors are quite different to forum errors, due to sheer fact of instantaneous vs time lapse.

With any forum post or production, it will take you less than 10 seconds to use a spell checker. Most browsers have one built in. You can even do that before you post.

In Game, you do something and it's immedaitely done - you can't fix it, you can't edit it, and you can't stop it before completion to prevent the action. Two very different scenarios.

If someone misspells in chat, most will ignore it - I typically will unless it can be assumed to be some weird accent - but on the forums where you have hundreds of resources at hand to clear up any OOC diffusion for something you are posting to the entire server, it's typically expected that you would've at least checked for any embarassing errors.

I double this on posters, btw. If someone goes through an extreme effort to make a brilliant looking poster, and it's laden with errors, it's pretty safe to assume that the errors were left there intentionally. I mean, c'mon, you went through hours of effort in Photoshop to make a shiny poster, and never actually looked at the spelling (or, in the case of individuals suffering from dyslexia - had a friend check it for you), and never showed it to a mate to give it a look, or even show it off?

...Tch.

People need to be coddled far less and get spines, IMHO.

Just as you can insult me for stating my opinion on how to deal with a game, it is my right to ignore all RP stemming from simple spelling mistakes.

I wasn't insulting you, to my knowledge? Simply disagreeing. If it came off as insulting, that wasn't intentional - point out the line that comes out like that and I'll rephrase it.

That said, you can't ignore RP anymore. That was ditched long ago. In Character is In Character. No retconning, etc.

*sigh* We made it to the 2nd page until what I thought might be a helpful topic slipped. Actually more like halfway through the first page. WonWon brings out several interesting points, yes he is entirely a prick IC (on that character) But do you really think he is a prick?

I for one will just say 2 words. Black Caravan, that is all. thank you.

GreatPigeon wrote:

*sigh* We made it to the 2nd page until what I thought might be a helpful topic slipped. Actually more like halfway through the first page. WonWon brings out several interesting points, yes he is entirely a prick IC (on that character) But do you really think he is a prick?

I for one will just say 2 words. Black Caravan, that is all. thank you.

D'awww.

<3.

...sorry. Gotta keep a laugh going here and there.

Last edited by Yurell on Wed, Feb 03 2010, 3:50 AM, edited 1 time in total.

I am afraid I agree with Won, for all of his above posts. There is a bit of suspension of disbelief to pull, however, when the player doesn't know something the characters should (such as the names of the month).

Edit: And you think Won's not a big meany IRL?! He lured deMordrey and I to The Great Chicken Will Destroy You! with promise of lunch ... and made us pay!! The nerve of the man!

Damnit WonWon, you screwed it up.

You were suppoed to say something really nice about me, and then with all the candydrops and velvet and and rainbows and shit, we could have just kept doing it until we were both in blissful dreaminess of PCness!

Aye. Honestly, alot of issues can also be avoided by pre-emptive (instead of reactive) OOC notation. I don't know of anyone on this forum who will fault you if, at the end of an IC post on the forums, write this;

// Please ignore any spelling or grammar errors; English isn't my first language / My spellchecker doesn't work / I suffer from a writing disorder

Might even be worth putting it in a signature.

Most players here -are- adults, and given a note like that - will respect it. It's taking the initiative to admit that there is a problem that may affect your In Character presentation, and simply letting people know so they can react to it appropriately.

GreatPigeon wrote:

WonWon brings out several interesting points, yes he is entirely a prick IC (on that character) But do you really think he is a prick?

Yes, yes I do.

Also, I will now start a group: Amian Players Against Player Oversensitivity to Character Actions or APAPOCA. And our logo will be some native American dude, because I think it's somewhat native American sounding and we're racially insensitive. ::nod nod::

Join today, brothers and sisters! Let us join in solidarity against those who speak against free RP!

*Points at Gunz*

Listen to this man, he's encouraging you all to be more Australian.

*Flees*

MoshingChris wrote:

*Points at Gunz*

Listen to this man, he's encouraging you all to be more Australian.

*Flees*

Only in Bondi

On other notes, I actually have a problem when I can randomly think i type the right thing, but it will be a phentic, a word that sounds simular but compeltely different meaning and such, even though I am quite a good speller, but that was due to an car accident I had with rather heavy head and neck injuries, to the point you will notice it commonly one hand lags behind the other, even though I am ambidexterious.

Thats why Great Pigeons are better then Evil Pigeons

Really Evil Pigeon wrote:

MoshingChris wrote:

*Points at Gunz*

Listen to this man, he's encouraging you all to be more Australian.

*Flees*

Only in Bondi

On other notes, I actually have a problem when I can randomly think i type the right thing, but it will be a phentic, a word that sounds simular but compeltely different meaning and such, even though I am quite a good speller, but that was due to an car accident I had with rather heavy head and neck injuries, to the point you will notice it commonly one hand lags behind the other, even though I am ambidexterious.

Same as me, though in my case it is not a car crash that makes me do that, it is the fact I am not a native english speaker and if I am distracted or sleepy or in a hurry, I will make a typo because while thinking the right word, I wrote another that sounded exactly the same.

Two - Too
Rope - Hope
Hole -Whole
EDIT: And I just noticed this one: "write word", when I was meaning to say "right word". -.-

And so on.

As for being IC jerks... believe me when I say that Auron annoys even myself but... gods, that is how he ~currently~ is. He might or might not become a better person. Until then, he will be an arse to anyone, about anything, at all.

Apologies in advance! It is not me being a jerk, it is him. My other two characters are completely opposites of him.

I swear that I even get a queasy stomach when he is being an arse to people because I know if I was treated like that in real life, I would feel hurt.

People make mistaes with homophones all the time. If it's a written poster, someone may comment, but if you're in a hurry chances are you're in game .. and if someone comments outside of a polite tell, chances are that they are being a jerk OOCly as there is no way the character could hear the difference in the words.

My brain moves so fast that my hands can't keep up. So I'll end up with words that are missing letters because I moved past it ages ago. To the point where sometimes words that make no sense will suddenly appear in something I've typed, correctly spelt and everything. Real odd.

The difference between the OOC Nice Guys and the OOC Douche-bags, while playing an IC asshole, is that the OOC Nice Guys feels bad for having the character do the things it does, and say the things it says, while the Douche-bag either doesn't care or gets satisfaction from it.

Keep that in the back of your head, if you ever want to figure out what type of player you're actually sharing the game play with.

For the most part, I completely agree about the spelling errors being completely relative to the environment. If we happen to be IG, I'll forgive almost anything from spelling to grammar to almost complete babble, as long as I can decipher what it means without taking too much trouble. When on the forums, though.... it's a different story. As Ron said, there are spellcheckers galore out there that things can get run through to ensure that they're correct. Grammar errors are a bit tougher, but as long as they're not glaring I don't have a problem with them. I mean, I'm sure my posts are loaded with small ones that I don't realize, due to my writing the way I talk. I'm a pretty horrible speller naturally, to be honest. If it wasn't for the spellchecker in Mozilla, I'd be screwed on some words that I use all the time.

BTW....When I play with some people like Dri or any of the other non-native English speakers, I can sometimes tell it immediately from the way things are phrased. It's not that it's wrong per se.... just archaic. It reminds me of Yoda for some reason. Not that it bothers me either, just an observation. My only real pet peeve that bothers the hell outta me for some reason is the use of double negatives...... grrrr....... I get frustrated just thinking about their doublely negativeness.

ainjyll wrote:

BTW....When I play with some people like Dri or any of the other non-native English speakers, I can sometimes tell it immediately from the way things are phrased. It's not that it's wrong per se.... just archaic. It reminds me of Yoda for some reason. Not that it bothers me either, just an observation. My only real pet peeve that bothers the hell outta me for some reason is the use of double negatives...... grrrr....... I get frustrated just thinking about their doublely negativeness.

Not so much archaic as unusually formal. A complaint I often get about my spoken language from the girls at uni >.>

I try to figure out if the mistake is IC or OOC but it can get hard to tell sometimes. It's a gray area that's hard to decipher sometimes. Like a lot of people have said, I usually only make IC note of things like that if they're posted on the forums, not in real time, IG. It's tons easier to make OOC mistakes while you're IG.

Point is, make a OOC note if it was an OOC mistake so people know (if you find it). Otherwise, there's little room to get mad at people responding ICly to your OOC mistake. We all make mistakes.

Non-native speakers often think in two languages at the same time when speaking a foreign language. That leads to phrasing things the way you'd phrase them in your native language... only using English words, for example.

I do that a lot. I also do it the other way around, though: when speaking/writing Finnish, I phrase things in a very odd way for Finnish language sometimes... :roll:

I blame Disco for ruining my Finnish.

Yurell wrote:

ainjyll wrote:

BTW....When I play with some people like Dri or any of the other non-native English speakers, I can sometimes tell it immediately from the way things are phrased. It's not that it's wrong per se.... just archaic. It reminds me of Yoda for some reason. Not that it bothers me either, just an observation. My only real pet peeve that bothers the hell outta me for some reason is the use of double negatives...... grrrr....... I get frustrated just thinking about their doublely negativeness.

Not so much archaic as unusually formal. A complaint I often get about my spoken language from the girls at uni >.>

That's not the only complaint he gets from women. :twisted:

I stand by my rp creed, for this entire topic. Rp is rp. Period. What happens ICly, should stay IC, unless it's a clear violation of the rules. Y'know what you should do if someone's a prick to you ICly?

Uhh...be a prick back ICly?

Chances are, their player will find that hilarious. ...Or string you from a tree. But hey, what's a little tree stringing amongst friends?

PS: I'll pay someone whatever fee they want to string Eary up in a tree. Ron knows why. *grmbl*

Most of the PC's my characters dislike IC, I actually enjoy interacting with them OoC.

Maybe I just like playing grumpy characters, though. That, or I enjoy conflict when there's actually good reason and rhyme behind it. *shrug*

I can't believe how much, uh stuff, this topic has generated.
Is it really that hard of a concept to grasp to ROLE-PLAY your character?

I find as I am here longer and get to know more people, that I am drawn to those that are regular players of D&D (paper and pencil if you will). This is because these people, generally speaking, understand the principals behind role-playing.
When you sit across the table from someone and can see their face and hear their tone of voice, you can tell when things begin to get personal. And it happens too, we are all human, don't forget this, no matter how bad you want to be that arrogant Elf, you are not and never will be.

I find that a lot of video-gamers are not entirely familiar with real role-playing, and have a difficult time NOT incorporating their own thoughts or feelings into what their character should be doing instead.

NOTE: I am not putting down all non-D&D players.

I do have a suggestion though, to those that have not tried Dungeons and Dragons, check it out sometime.
I believe it will help you not only understand the reason behind some of the rules, but also how to role-play without letting 'you' be an interference.

And also: read, read, read.

This is the one great way to discover the many vast ways in which the multitude of races interact with each other, and also some insight as to how these different races view themselves as well.

Anyway, back to the top, heheh *dry chuckle*

If you, in real life, saw someone fairly often and knew they were a jerk (and didn't like it), then most likely you wouldn't interact with them, yes?
Then don't interact with those that feel they have to be a jerk IC.
It's that simple.
If that type of role-play is your thing, then have at it.
It's that simple.

Just try and remember to stay in character. (it helps to really know your character as well)
(and that characterly is not a word) *shakes his head* *another dry chuckle* kids, lol

Selvec Darkon wrote:

My brain moves so fast that my hands can't keep up. So I'll end up with words that are missing letters because I moved past it ages ago. To the point where sometimes words that make no sense will suddenly appear in something I've typed, correctly spelt and everything. Real odd.

today my friend meant to ask me how my program was going... He asked how my hotdog was doing.... I asked him if he wanted to see for himself but he declined.

so yeah... if you pronounce "too" correctly, it sounds completely identical to "two". "they're" does, in fact, sound identical to "there" and "their" in speech, and is they'refore indifferentiable. Posters, I can understand IC loling at. Some characters would do that... if I saw ((please excuse my errors, I have hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia)) and knew the character was some 20+ int wizard, I would let it slide, even if that particular phobia only slightly relates to grammar and is just fun two say.

EDIT: to get back on topic...

if you "..." me, I will be pissed OOCly, and ignore you ICly. It shows a complete disregard for whatever I just typed out and a complete lack of effort to muster a response composed of any words at all. If you RP your arseholishness well, I will enjoy it too. If it takes away from my character, I won't enjoy it and will probably try to avoid that character in RP in the future.

EXAMPLE: you could think that a character that hates your own and that your character hates would be a nasty experience, but it doesn't have to be. I play Ubee, who hates all scalers with a passion. Kurchin happens to be one of these. Our characters want nothing more that to stick an arrow into the other's back, but we both love the experience OOCly. We build on each other's IC insults and anger instead of just muffling the experience, which some evil characters might do.

sorry if it sounds disjointed. good luck reading it, even if reading this means you already read the rest of the post!

^^ Thats actually caleld a freudian slip mate... Your friend likes you a tad too much!

blackvswhite wrote:

"they're" does, in fact, sound identical to "there" and "their" in speech, and is they'refore indifferentiable. Posters, I can understand IC loling at.

Not sure about that. 'Their' and 'there' should sound identical, but 'they're' can be pronounced in a manner that distinguishes it (i.e. 'pronounce' the apostrophe).

blackvswhite wrote:

if you "..." me, I will be pissed OOCly, and ignore you ICly. It shows a complete disregard for whatever I just typed out and a complete lack of effort to muster a response composed of any words at all.

I disagree. I think '...' shows that your character can't come up with a response, yet looks like she's trying t. A sort of dumbfounded expression, if you will.

Quote:

if you "..." me, I will be pissed OOCly, and ignore you ICly. It shows a complete disregard for whatever I just typed out and a complete lack of effort to muster a response composed of any words at all. If you RP your arseholishness well, I will enjoy it too. If it takes away from my character, I won't enjoy it and will probably try to avoid that character in RP in the future.

Wow, man. Don't overreact just because someone uses a common literary/RPG cliche, alright?

IMHO "..." leaves you nothing to build on. I'm in improv club at school and a lot of the stuff we do relates to RP, because that is pretty much what improvisational acting is. A generalized version of the main rule is don't put all the work on one person, like saying no too much or asking too many questions, which just deflect the focus back on the other person and avoid doing any thought yourself. It can make the RP a chore, or at least for one line of text, you are forced to redirect yourself.

Or you can think "How would my character respond if someone she was speaking to looks dumbstruck at something she said/did?"

blackvswhite wrote:

IMHO "..." leaves you nothing to build on. I'm in improv club at school and a lot of the stuff we do relates to RP, because that is pretty much what improvisational acting is. A generalized version of the main rule is don't put all the work on one person, like saying no too much or asking too many questions, which just deflect the focus back on the other person and avoid doing any thought yourself. It can make the RP a chore, or at least for one line of text, you are forced to redirect yourself.

Not everyone does improv, though IRL. Take it for what it is in context and keep RPing. It's really not worth getting worked up over. I doubt the person is trying to belittle you just because their character doesn't say anything and the player types an ellipsis.

I don't mean to sound worked up. I just don't like it, and I know how to make it known a bit too well.

blackvswhite wrote:

if you "..." me, I will be pissed OOCly, and ignore you ICly. It shows a complete disregard for whatever I just typed out and a complete lack of effort to muster a response composed of any words at all.

What's your opinion of "..." for use as a time-buying technique? I tend to use a "..." at least every five minutes, either to put emphasis on the next thing I'm going to say, or because I'm buying time before I say something.

... -> My character just doesn't know what to say but I am letting you know the silence isn't occ, the equivalent of *says nothing*. Seeing if I didn't type anything you may end up thinking I went afk or that I am still typing a reply that isn't comming.

Dear Pigeon,

My advice is that you refrain from sending OOC tells that you don’t want to waste your (beep beep) time with a player. This behavior does not help your “I’m really a nice guy.” case.

*huggles* Fi

PS. I’m assuming you were having a bad day and weren’t interested in hearing my thoughts on server rules regarding our encounter. I will say what you said was not the worst thing I (me the player) have been called when I’m running my drow however. A Triadic Knight called me the C word after being pwnd by my little drowsie. Since the knight was dead, it was a player to player comment. And I thought they were all run by decent folk *sighs* I do try to remember to send a Tell after an encounter thanking the other player(s) for the RP. However, I play a nasty drow so from time to time it’s assumed that I’m nasty too *innocent delicate girly look, bats eyelashes*

These incidence aside I think Amia is a wonderful place for an Aspergers (high functioning autistic) guy I know to practice social interactions without the stress of it being “for real”. When they make an odd comment, as they are wont to do, it’s not the end of the world. They get to participate in interactions with nice characters and mean characters and this allows them to learn things that can help tremendously in RL.

So, Pigeon, don’t stress about being misunderstood from time to time. Everybody gets to have a bad day, even in Amia.

I'm intrigued that the topic went to the spelling mistakes business. I've watched it happen regularly (most of you know I trawl the PC Notice Board because it is the place where your characters actually speak when they aren't IG), but I've always had a personal rule about it. I'm not going to hold a PC's spelling errors against him unless I believe that the player intends for that PC to be a poor speller. Just look at any IC writing I've had to do with one of my own off-track PCs, Diane Arbor. She's woefully uneducated and really only writes based upon what she's seen and an attempt to recapture what she's heard with the alphabet. Which is what most elementary schoolers do.

Yes, I apply this logic even to the 14-year-old player playing a 40 Int wizard that is supposed to comprehend the mysteries of the universe and have at least a working academic knowledge of how to properly communicate a fraction of those ideas. If your PC is supposed to be intelligent and the player's lack of intelligence shines through boldly to me, I struggle (and usually succeed) in giving you the benefit of the doubt, regardless, and treating the PC like the PC should or would be treated in the fictional realism of human interaction.

But I agree that a lot of the massive dogpile on a PC over the player's poor communication skills reads to me like someone else in this thread put it: the player taking their opportunity to play the jerk. My God, I know how beautiful it is, I have done it.

A secret confession? It is one of the minor joys I have in DM'ing on Amia. I can play the bad guys and they can say and do things that piss people off because villains and antagonists should illicit an emotional response of dislike or hatred in certain instances, and OMG it feels so good...and it is, also, a struggle not to fall into the DM trap of being the mighty asshole.

I do not condone picking on other people for spelling errors or logic mistakes like getting a name wrong (we can't all remember the name of the forty-third ship in the second chapter of The Iliad) unless you are certain it was an IC mistake and not an OOC mistake.

Also, blackvswhite, don't be too hasty to hate on the ellipse as a response. Accept it for the cliché it is and appreciate the fact that it is less arrogant and ostentatious than writing out an emote that communicates the fact that nothing is being communicated. There are certain NPCs who exist right now that belong to a sect of highly secretive magicians and a few PCs have encountered them. When they are asked questions or interacted with, they fall back on their "rules" of their secret society, practically their way of life - reveal nothing, keep people wondering and guessing, and remember that the hidden side of the pyramid is Silence.

Therefore, they respond quite a lot with an ellipse. And it is literally the NPC looking at you, staring, and not saying anything, not because you said something wrong, or because you sound weird, or because they don't know what to say, but because they're not going to say anything that gives you knowledge - knowledge with which you can overcome or defeat them.

So you see, there are plenty of reasons for it and getting hot and bothered about it OOC is a personal problem for you to work out, because it is almost never anything personal.

Quote:

I do not condone picking on other people for spelling errors or logic mistakes like getting a name wrong (we can't all remember the name of the forty-third ship in the second chapter of The Iliad) unless you are certain it was an IC mistake and not an OOC mistake.

Imperator, Imperceptor, it's all the same thing, right?

I am free game, because with me it is just laziness!

blackvswhite wrote:

Selvec Darkon wrote:

My brain moves so fast that my hands can't keep up. So I'll end up with words that are missing letters because I moved past it ages ago. To the point where sometimes words that make no sense will suddenly appear in something I've typed, correctly spelt and everything. Real odd.

today my friend meant to ask me how my program was going... He asked how my hotdog was doing.... I asked him if he wanted to see for himself but he declined.

so yeah... if you pronounce "too" correctly, it sounds completely identical to "two". "they're" does, in fact, sound identical to "there" and "their" in speech, and is they'refore indifferentiable. Posters, I can understand IC loling at. Some characters would do that... if I saw ((please excuse my errors, I have hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia)) and knew the character was some 20+ int wizard, I would let it slide, even if that particular phobia only slightly relates to grammar and is just fun two say.

EDIT: to get back on topic...

if you "..." me, I will be pissed OOCly, and ignore you ICly. It shows a complete disregard for whatever I just typed out and a complete lack of effort to muster a response composed of any words at all. If you RP your arseholishness well, I will enjoy it too. If it takes away from my character, I won't enjoy it and will probably try to avoid that character in RP in the future.

EXAMPLE: you could think that a character that hates your own and that your character hates would be a nasty experience, but it doesn't have to be. I play Ubee, who hates all scalers with a passion. Kurchin happens to be one of these. Our characters want nothing more that to stick an arrow into the other's back, but we both love the experience OOCly. We build on each other's IC insults and anger instead of just muffling the experience, which some evil characters might do.

sorry if it sounds disjointed. good luck reading it, even if reading this means you already read the rest of the post!

No mines weirder. Stuff like "Xal leapt over the water onto the ship, his feet hitting the deck suddenly and causing him to caculator his way across the deck."

Yea, weird.

Sounds like Xal has his calculator set to swashbuckler.

Most scientific calculators these days come with a swashbuckler setting.

Yossarin wrote:

Sounds like Xal has his calculator set to swashbuckler.

I must own that calculator.

The "..." thing kinda gets to me, too, though. I know it's something to reflect awestruck/dumbstruck, but seriously? Why not type *gapes like a fish at {whatever}* or even *simply stares at {whatever}*? It shows a little bit of effort other than pressing the period key three times and then the enter key, but I'm not a big fan of one word responses in general and try to use them as little as possible.

Yossarin wrote:

Sounds like Xal has his calculator set to swashbuckler.

Who bloody know's. I type the weirdest things.

Does anyone ELSE remember Eary taking the red Sharpie to Valkin's posters ?

I laaaaaughed and laughed.

AxlLeigh wrote:

Does anyone ELSE remember Eary taking the red Sharpie to Valkin's posters ?

I laaaaaughed and laughed.

*hand up* Seconded

Drop it. IT's clear it's a point of contention and causes people to get upset. There was absolutely no reason to bring it back up no matter what your reasons are.

TormakSaber wrote:

Drop it. IT's clear it's a point of contention and causes people to get upset. There was absolutely no reason to bring it back up no matter what your reasons are.

agreed, that was an uncalled for insult, ooc reasons have already been established about it. And I thought you ha a 3 day ban from the forums axl from uncalled for insults on another thread?

AxlLeigh wrote:

Does anyone ELSE remember Eary taking the red Sharpie to Valkin's posters ?

I laaaaaughed and laughed.

This was sooo low of you. Dont ever bring it up again.

And yet, after I say to drop it, more people feel like they have to give their two cents.

This topic's done.

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