AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

Maybe this is the right place to post this.

Since I have been harassed on Amia A on several occasions in the last couple of days about some things, and I failed to find any written rules or even recommendations about the matters, I would like some clarification for the following issues of area-trespassing:

If you're going around an area on a maxed character, killing things you spawn and looking for things such as gold/natural resources/loot, or just RPing....

1. Has someone the right to tell you to bugger off, because they're lower-lvls than you are and need to hunt?

2. Is XP-based hunting privileged compared to the other reasons of roaming mentioned above?

3. Are high-lvl/max-lvl characters automatically in an inferior position if they hunt/do whatever else in an area with easy spawns?

I would like someone with real knowledge and authority over these matters to answer these, not someone who argued about them with me earlier.

Generally:

First to a zone has rights to hunt there for 1 set of spawns.
Meaning: If you clear a zone or cave set, a new group may claim the next run.

I've never seen level have an importance. Although it can be polite that a higher level give up a zone to those after the XP, the "first to zone for 1 run" applies and the higher level may opt to finish their run first.

DM's will have a far better answer of course.

Well that's a known rule, I think I even saw it written somewhere once.

As to my latest experiences, it hasn't even been discussed who came there first or for how long everyone's been there. People told my character to sod off, entirely OOCly in most cases which is quite sad. The actual Rp was very limited in most cases.

And as to the details, I wish someone would tell these these people to use whole words instead of letters when going IC. AND the difference between 'recommendation' and 'restriction'.

Happened to me as well today. A random pc walked up took a loot asked my level then said go somewhere else to treasure hunt. I never bothered to screenie or even recall a name just because I was dumbfounded by how it was. Also this was the first spawn in the Spider Valley so no real way to mistake who was there first.

Quote:

1. Has someone the right to tell you to bugger off, because they're lower-lvls than you are and need to hunt?

No. First come, first serve, for ONE (1) "run" or "circle" or what-have you. One clearance of the area.

Quote:

2. Is XP-based hunting privileged compared to the other reasons of roaming mentioned above?

No. First come, first serve, for ONE (1) "run" or "circle" or what-have you. One clearance of the area.

Quote:

3. Are high-lvl/max-lvl characters automatically in an inferior position if they hunt/do whatever else in an area with easy spawns?

No. First come, first serve, for ONE (1) "run" or "circle" or what-have you. One clearance of the area.

Bear in mind that many people think that it is "common courtesy" to allow the lowbies to have the area. Many people also think it *should* be a rule. But it's not a rule. The rule is, in case it wasn't overly clear: First come, first serve, for ONE (1) "run" or "circle" or what-have you. One clearance of the area.

Restriction: Taking a long time clearing an area, to the point that at the end of your "circle" or whatever, the original spawns begin to respawn, does not mean you can do another circle if someone else comes along who wishes the area. If nobody else comes along, then no harm no foul.

Restriction: Upon killing a spawn or boss, you are required to continue forward/onward/around/whatever. To not continue along, is spawn/boss camping, which IS against the rules.

Torzy has the right of it AFAIK. If you're there first, you're there first. It's considered polite by some (including myself) for a high level to leave and let the low levels get xp, but that's entirely up to you and most certainly not a rule.

Charles1810 wrote:

Happened to me as well today. A random pc walked up took a loot asked my level then said go somewhere else to treasure hunt. I never bothered to screenie or even recall a name just because I was dumbfounded by how it was. Also this was the first spawn in the Spider Valley so no real way to mistake who was there first.

Screeny (I know you didn't, but something to keep in mind for later) and curbstomp him - he broke the rules and initiated PvP.

Cori is correct.

For some, it is a measure of courtesy for the level 30 to allow the lower XP getting players to travel through, but this is not a rule, we will not enforce it and we do not ask of it.

For an area like the Beholders, where I see way too many altercations occur, you have the zone for either one circle around or until you kill the Majesty. When you have done either then the zone is forfeit if there's another group behind you/around you/whatever and you can't peacefully co exist.

If you are truly having issues with harassment, screenshots and contacting a DM will do wonders. We can't do anything from complaining posts on the forum, I'm afraid. We need to go to the source.

Personal opinion of this is that a level 30 only really needs to go to a lowbie area for two things. Need a mythal of that grade or for RP.

If the first turn it into RP and see if they have one that you can give some of the ungodly amount of gold you likely have and if you're there for a RP reason then deal with it by RPing.

Not all level 30s are millionaires btw.

Also, not all PCs are in the area to hunt for mythals or gold. My wilderness characters or Underdark characters often hang around wilderness areas, or caverns, because, that's where they patrol or live or whatever.

You know, they actually RP, being a Ranger or whatever...

Some people are there, to protect an area, against Undead roaming around in a forest, etc...likely, they're going to confront you, if your presence there, contradicts what they're there to stop. They don't care if your "hunting" for XP, they care that there's this wraith following you, in a forest, that they're there to protect and it seems to be aiding you.

They might be level 10 or level 30, but its their right to roleplay their characters doing what their characters believe in. It might inconvenience you in your hunting, but like anything big and nasty, if you don't like their stance on things, then avoid them and go elsewhere.

Edit: Or they might be a friendly level 30 and aid you by casting spells on you, they happen to just be in the area for a stroll for instance...

The point is, most level 30s don't need XP, they're desperate for RP opportunities however. Entertain them!

I've had a few occurrences where a pair of evil-aligned characters barged into a dungeon where my team was and demanded access to certain mobs (in particular, the fire giant king). Because my character is fairly good-natured about it, he didn't mind, but hearing all this makes me wonder if it was against the rules.

I'm fairly sure that denying them would have resulted in pvp and most likely my lower-levelled team losing.

I is quite illegal on an OOC level to steal areas from people and even in the event of PvP, you cannot take the area from the losers.

I'd appreicate screens in my inbox or names, etc.

Seconded. This trend of "Not bothering the dm's" is the reason this stuff keeps happening. It's not whining if someone is genuinely breaking rules, even if you're not sure we'd rather be told so we can do our jobs and keep the server fun and (relatively) issue free. Please. BOTHER US.

I'll check to see if I saved screenshots of that exchange, though I doubt I did, since at the time I thought it was legal. Also, there were no DMs around at the time.

Ah, looks like I don't have any after all. I can't remember the names either, though I remember the characters making a point of being Banites, and at least one was level 30. Perhaps if I can find whoever plays Vrirg again that person will know...

Oh well, guess it's my fault for not taking screenshots.

Nah, you just didn't know better. Not your fault at all. Its rather theirs for not following the rules/abusing your lack of knowledge about the rules.

Hmm...they sound like new Banites then...in the past, most Banites have been very well trained, in what they can and can't get away with, with regards to the rules.

I've been out of the Banites for too long now to know what their induction procedures are and what their quality control methods are like. However, in the past, they were exceptionally good at staying IC and acting within the rules.

In the event of Pvp I'm not sure how I'd react, it's happened surprisingly seldom to me on Amia. As to the RP-reasons for someone claiming an area from my character.....well, there wasn't any. There wasn't really RP at all, just telling him to bugger off because he happened to lvl 30 in search of resources for RP-purposes as well as gold.

Only in the latest case he was confronted with unprovoked hostility (from a mua-ha-ha -evil character). The fight never broke out after a brief exchange of IC-insults, and then my char decided to continue his work. He is also not a millionaire, far from it these days.

As to the DM-issue, I called on one for several moments, but no answer came. as did the other party, swearing to get me in trouble for not leaving the entire forest to lower-lvls. I have the name and will likely recognise the earlier incident's belligerent side as well if I see them. I have screenshots but haven't sent them in lack of a proper program for it.

Oh...and in this latest incident I got called 'an ass' and a million other things for making him prove his newly-invented rules and in a nutshell I got a whole heap of dung in my face, then the next moment he says he didn't say such. That's not only rude but outright stupid seeing as I got the screenshots.

I may have to take steps with this, seeing as the matter was clear as daylight. This person was so convinced about there being rules such as he claims that I started doubting myself, that is why I posted.

Well, instead of publicly airing your dirty laundry which only gets you bad looks from the DMs, send the screenshots to a DM.

How about 'asking important questions' instead of 'dirty laundry'?

In time, I will. Trust in that. Once I get a necessary program from somewhere.

Dirty laundry was a hint to you describing in-game events, I'm guessing, when saying that they were banites and such. That's a no-no in public discussions. :wink:

Banites? I don't recall mentioning anything about Banites. I said some 'muahaha -evil character' in the last case, I haven't the foggiest whether it was a Banite.

XnView and IrfanView are excellent programs for viewing, and in XnView's case, converting .tgas to .jpgs or etc

Pithecus Underdarkhus wrote:

Banites? I don't recall mentioning anything about Banites. I said some 'muahaha -evil character' in the last case, I haven't the foggiest whether it was a Banite.

Oh, misread something. It was Sound's comment I got mixed up. My bad, carry on!

Uhh alright. Trying to find those next, now I only need to learn the basics about formats and I'm ready to descend upon everyone who happens to be in my shots bugging Glothar.

So... I've had some clarification in regards to the Banites who supposedly would have violated server rules.

Basically, what happened was that the Banites showed up at the scene (being: Spires), made IC threats of being allowed to pass to get to the Fire Giant King.

The adventurers already there, ICly allowed them to, and then the Banites strolled along.

Now... make IC threats or demands, isn't against the rules.

However.

The adventurers in the Spires, who were already there, in this instance, could have made the same IC response, while stating OOCly that it wasn't OK for the Banites to go ahead of them, in which case the Banites would have to... either wait, or head back the way they came from.

It is proper OOC courtesy to ask the party who's already there, for allowance, OOCly, to venture ahead, even if the encounter has come to conclude an IC "allowance".

Basically:

It is within your right to OOCly deny another party who arrived at the area after you did, to venture ahead of you. Always.

And it is appropiate for the ones coming into the area, with a party already in it, to ask for OOC allowance to proceed, in order to not cause any unnecessary bad feelings.

So, from that instance, both the Banites and the adventurers (Spyonline8000 included) have something to learn.

Um... Darth, as amicably as I know you tried to get that across, we do have the whole "please do not discuss specific incidents on the forums" thingie....

Everything after "Baiscally:" is quite peachy keen though.

I didn't see this one as being very iffy.

I spoke to Spyonline8000 about it in game, and there doesn't seem to be any hard feelings to it.

If it turns into a flame fest, I suppose you can put the blame on me.

The example was relevant though, in clarifying how the rules apply, I tihnk.

Well, I have no intention of flaming anyone, and I DID say that I didn't know about that section of rules until I'd read this topic. I mainly wanted to find screenshots for verification purposes, though the events themselves didn't bother me too much.

That said, I would attribute that development mostly to diplomacy, as the events were quickly headed towards PvP until we struck a deal IC. Given that this would have been PvP related to control/access to an area, I would imagine that would have been against the rules. Fortunately, it didn't come to that, so I think we can put that behind us. Or I can, at least.

Furthermore, I just read in another thread that taking screenshots in B doesn't work? I guess even if I HAD taken any screenshots, they'd have been useless then...

In regards to PvP:

A party that arrives at an area which has already been "taken" by another party can initiate PvP, granted that the PvP rules are abided.

However. Should the party that comes into the already "taken" area come out victorious, they are not allowed to leave the dead behind and then proceed to "take over" the area.

Good to know as well, as being part of your civil rights of Amia.

The only Issue I've ever had with this was when joining a party in an area after one member ran back to town to get a raise scroll. I went back with him, we raised his dead friend, did some minor introduction RP and... someone appeared right next to us, ran off, cast invisablity and then followed us invisable and snagged all our loot while we killed stuff. He continued to follow us for a few moer spawns and eventualy after some more Where did the loot go playing I had to call them on their OOC jerkness. We then went seperate ways through the same dungeon and again at the end, while I was fighting the last thing he simply ran up and attacked my target, slaughtering it in 2 hits, grabbing the loot, and running off to let me deal with the rest of the fight. I sent him a tell or two in the time firstly asking what was up with his actions, and he said he's just trying to get gold, after the incident with the "boss" I sent him another tell and his only reply was that I had broken mor eserver rules than him, by "Cutting off his path" since I went around him once...

I realy don't know what sorta ruleing would have been made here, but apparently we both just decided to drop it and move on. It does give you sorta a bad taste though when it's your first weekend on the server. Other that that though, I haven't seen too much issue even with shareing especialy in a circular area, one group goes left, one goes right, you Rp a bit with eachother, and both get some xp an fun.

Wilagins wrote:

The only Issue I've ever had with this was when joining a party in an area after one member ran back to town to get a raise scroll. I went back with him, we raised his dead friend, did some minor introduction RP and... someone appeared right next to us, ran off, cast invisablity and then followed us invisable and snagged all our loot while we killed stuff. He continued to follow us for a few moer spawns and eventualy after some more Where did the loot go playing I had to call them on their OOC jerkness. We then went seperate ways through the same dungeon and again at the end, while I was fighting the last thing he simply ran up and attacked my target, slaughtering it in 2 hits, grabbing the loot, and running off to let me deal with the rest of the fight. I sent him a tell or two in the time firstly asking what was up with his actions, and he said he's just trying to get gold, after the incident with the "boss" I sent him another tell and his only reply was that I had broken mor eserver rules than him, by "Cutting off his path" since I went around him once...

I realy don't know what sorta ruleing would have been made here, but apparently we both just decided to drop it and move on. It does give you sorta a bad taste though when it's your first weekend on the server. Other that that though, I haven't seen too much issue even with shareing especialy in a circular area, one group goes left, one goes right, you Rp a bit with eachother, and both get some xp an fun.

Next time, take screen shots and send them to a DM. That is -not- okay. At all. And a total douche bag move of whoever did that too.

There are rules and then there are just plain polite ways to treat people OoC'ly. While not against the rules to go into an area behind another group, get into some sort of altercation and initiate PvP, kill the lead group and then leave... it is rather asshatish in my eyes.

I do think it's rather funny when a mage or cleric runs past your group invisible and all you see is a summon jogging past your group like nobody can tell that a beholder doesn't just cruise through random areas of Amia on a regular basis.

I usualy expect atleast in the first few lvls even on an RP server to run into people who just don't get it. There's always the new transplant from somewhere that just has never Rpd before and is used to the large number of servers where it's prety much everyone for themselves. Especialy in the world today, where the attitude is alot different than when I started playing games online (even when not online) and MEMEME is about all alot of people can think of. I've never been a "rules nazi" and I generly let stuff slide aslong as it's a one time thing. Be sure if I see the same person do the same thing twice I WILL take a screenshot of every line of the descussion and send it to atleast one DM. Fun is fun and stuff happens but even character alignment shouldn't override the fact that it's supposed to be fun for EVERYONE... which is why I sometimes cut back the paladin hardline for the sake of everyone's fun and leave it at "I'll keep my eye on you"

A general rule of thumb - if someone is being an arsehat, chances are they're the ones doing something wrong. Screeny, and check the rules later. If they're just an arse, you wasted two minutes and a hundred kibibytes of hard drive space. I they're doing something wrong, you have the satisfaction of reporting them ... being rude and cheating just make people that little bit more dislikable.

Just on the issue of invisible mages. Since, I've been playing one, believe me, its just as frustrating for my invisible mage (and often summons, since, I -always- use invisibility sphere as standard operating procedure), when a group runs right past me and ahead. I'd love to interact with them, but...they can't even see me. By the time you find the right spell or ball with see invis. on it, they're long gone ahead already.

Basically, invisibility works both ways in terms of people running ahead and getting confused as to who was there first...

Chances are, if you have enough time to run ahead and /then/ go invisible...

You weren't there first. In Wilagins' instance, the person appeared, ran ahead, then cast.

She meant "I'm already here invisible, but the party came by and iddin't have see invis."

Actualy, they appeared in monstrous form right where we had ressed a party member, ran back toward the enterance/exit, then invised and followed us in and eventualy went another dirrection after grabbing several of our loots.

It's not so much a rule, but it's pretty much just good manners to let lower levels who are hunting for XP have an area when your clearly far to high leveled to benefit from any XP.

Mostly because you can always go some place else, and these low levels are usually restricted to a few places they can benefit from without running into groups of their own level already occupying an area.

So yea, I don't think there is any rule, but it is just good ettiquette.

Hunting/Trespassing rights

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