AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - The Official Build and Build Advice Topic: Mark III

Well, I am level 19 right now, and I know I don't have five unarmed attacks per round. So it looks like I need 18 pre epic levesl of Monk to get 5. *Sigh.* Gotta go mess with my level arrangement again!

What other classes do you have, and are you wearing any sort of armour or shield?

What build would suit a pure monk feats and stats wise, with good AC and AB? I'd also like Epic Energy Resistance: Cold in the Epic levels too.

QPR, clothe and no shield. Unarmed str based, going for monk20/1sorc/9RDD. Decided to start taking the sorc/RDD pre-epic, because if I took them in epic and got my other AB point, I would waste all epic levels on them, and not end with 30 tumble from monk. So, I decided to take 16 monk, just enough for 1d20 fists, then start taking sorc/RDD, but I realized now that I would lose an attack per round..

So I basically just need to take 1 sorc/ 1RDD pre epic, but now I have to relevel. I am at 16 monk/1sorc/2RDD.

Quote:

What build would suit a pure monk feats and stats wise, with good AC and AB? I'd also like Epic Energy Resistance: Cold in the Epic levels too.

I'd vote dex based, make sure to have atleast a 14 wisdom. Take tumble and discipline, and whatever else you want.
As for feats.. I think pre-epic a monk would get about 7 feats?
Weapon focus (Unarmed strike)
Weapon finesse
Improved critical (Unarmed strike)
Dodge (Just for the extra ac)
Toughness or Circle Kick, if you want to just be annoying.
Great fortitude
Expertise

Epic feats
Epic weapon focus (Unarmed strike)
Epic Energy Resistance (Cold)
Epic Prowess
Great Dexterity I
Epic Fort
Epic Skill focus (Discipline)

Can I ask why it matters what order and when classes are taken (besides he obvious necessity of prerequisites) ... such as in this case, a number of monk levels needs to be taken pre-epic.

Can't get more attacks per round after level 20, 16 monk levels nets you 4 unarmed attacks, while 18 will net you 5, unless you take the 18th in epic, in which case you keep only 4 attacks.

Its because of your sorc and RDD levels you dont have 5 unarmed attackes, yes. You neeed a BAB of 13 to get the five attacks, while you only have 12.

As for a monk build: You can't really go wrong with a human str based. Mulan or Ffolk subrace allows you to start with something like 15 str, 14 dex, 12 con, 16 wis, 10 int and 8 cha. Spend all points in str, and you reach 22 at level 28.

Dex based gives better AC and AB, but puny damage. I'd go for str, straight 30 monk. No monster with magic can touch you, and your AC and saves will be sky high.

Actually, QPR, I just tested my build, and if I get one level removed, and take 18 levels of monk pre-epic I will get 5 attacks per round. Due to monks Unarmed stuff. :mrgreen:

Dervish wrote:

IronAngel wrote:

Take Called Shot! You'll have awesome AB.

Oh yea? I've never looked at Called Shot. Does it really work that well?

I figure my cleric's AB will be in the mid to high 40's. The -4 AB from Called Shot will knock it down to low to mid 40's. Is that good enough to make it effective? And does it work as advertised?

It's a choice between Expertise or Called Shot. Which will be the most useful? I've never taken either one.

Care to post your build, or is it secret?

High Wisdom should account for a decent AB. But I figure you might not have room for Weapon Foci.

I'd go for Called Shot, since that lets you slow the enemy down and make your escape. And it's good otherwise, too. You won't be tanking and thus getting swarmed by monsters - a ranged spellcaster is obviously in the back, and you can't use Expertise when you're casting Heal/GR spells anyway.

If you're not into EDK, you should have enough feats for some AB feats, anyway.

How much Search is necessary (base ranks and then total) to be useful in epic areas, if it's necessary at all?

BloodNAshes wrote:

How much Search is necessary (base ranks and then total) to be useful in epic areas, if it's necessary at all?

not necessary. get items with the "find traps" spell on them and just cast it every now and then.

for search dc's check this:
http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Set_trap#Notes

Good for finding PvP traps and that odd DM event though.

Last edited by BlackDahlya on Thu, Nov 26 2009, 7:47 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Is it possible to make work a Ranger/Wiz/AA build?

I tried one but while the AB turned out good, the average damage was awful (the most I got was 17/hit) and the end result, even as I scored some crits, was terrible.

Ranger 18/Wiz 1/AA 9

DEX Based, topping it at 39 with gear.
Bow with Mighty and AB +5, plus extra damage bludgeoning, plus Massive Criticals 1d8

AB 50/45/40/35 (Longbow unequipped, it is only 23 >_>;;)
AC 45
Fort 20
Reflex 27
Will 14
BAB 23

FEATS
Blinding Speed
Called Shot
Dodge
Epic Prowess
Weapon Focus + Epic Weapon Focus (longbow)
Improved Critical
Point Blank Shot
Rapid Shot

EDIT: Forgot to mention the best results I got: 294 damage to the dummy with 17 hits, Average damage is 17 per attack

You can, but there's really no reason to. Rangers have nothing that helps archery, at all.

If you can live with not maxing tumble, there is no reason why a Ranger/Wiz/AA shouldnt work. Mine did.

Pros vs fighter:
- Rangers get trackless step and free dualwield feats
- Rangers get 4 skills per level and stealth skills + AE from the start. This helps immensly if you are making a sneaky one
- Until the Grove burned down, there were alot of Ranger-spesific items that are awesome in the hands of an AA. The best bows you get at the Ranger shop, not in Winya to put it tht way.
- Rangers have more style.

Cons vs fighter
- You dont get epic weapon spec
- Fewer feats

The extra six points of damage is ofcourse nice, but in no way essential when going Ranger 10/wiz 1 or 2/AA 18 or 19. The awesome AA only arrows more than make up for it, and the class restricted items you cant use as a fighter is enough reason to pick Ranger in my oppinion.

Though a better choice, the one I went for, is Ranger/bard/AA. Cant get much better than that really. Its much more versitale than a fighter/bardAA, and more funt to play. As an archer, i feel sneaking abilities are essential. And half-elves is the most stylish choice of race too.

Alright, Pale Masters. Thoughts on those.

Yes I know how much they absolutely SUCK as a caster choice. However I'm thinking of throwing it into melee.
Maybe 7 levels Wizard, 10 PM and the rest in a melee class. Any thoughts on the particulars?

Another Death Knight/Dread Pirate? I thought it was implimented that Necromancy spells would continue to act like "normal" spells for PMs? As in they'd add their PM levels to CL and damage of all necromancy spells, thereby still making them viable casters in that field. Was this only talk?

Anyway, to help you out, you pretty much have the idea right there. Enough PM to get crit immune, and then the rest fighter... that's how most melee PMs do it, from what I've seen. The "particulars" being just everything you'd take with a regular fighter: some weapon focus, KD, IKD, blindfight, etc etc.

I guess, of course, you could always go for an incredibly hard-to-kill build. Take 10 PM for crit immune. improved expertise, Epic DR and barb levels as your melee class. Like 10 off of every hit and non-devable/sneakable? Sounds like a melee-monster to me, although more of a defensive one.

Bard 4/Palemaster 16,RDD 10, Dev, Epic spells, 70-80AC, but probably 3 Attacks Per round and around 30 ab, MAX.

TormakSaber wrote:

You can, but there's really no reason to. Rangers have nothing that helps archery, at all.

Yes, the best thing about them is that you get dual-wield for free and it is just a waste to go archer rather than melee.

Still, the most I got in AB Melee going pure Ranger was 45. I do not remember the numbers exactly and I am at work now. But I will check it again.

I do remember getting Weapon Finesse and Epic Weapon Focus and the most naked DEX was 27.

What could I have done wrong to prevent the AB from going higher than 45?

BlackDahlya wrote:

Is it possible to make work a Ranger/Wiz/AA build?

I tried one but while the AB turned out good, the average damage was awful (the most I got was 17/hit) and the end result, even as I scored some crits, was terrible.

Ranger 18/Wiz 1/AA 9

DEX Based, topping it at 39 with gear.
Bow with Mighty and AB +5, plus extra damage bludgeoning, plus Massive Criticals 1d8

AB 50/45/40/35 (Longbow unequipped, it is only 23 >_>;;)
AC 45
Fort 20
Reflex 27
Will 14
BAB 23

FEATS
Blinding Speed
Called Shot
Dodge
Epic Prowess
Weapon Focus + Epic Weapon Focus (longbow)
Improved Critical
Point Blank Shot
Rapid Shot

EDIT: Forgot to mention the best results I got: 294 damage to the dummy with 17 hits, Average damage is 17 per attack

Dump Epic Prowess and get a Great Dex feat. Going from 39 to 40 Dex nets you 1 AB and 1 AC, as opposed to Epic Prowess giving just the 1 AB.

I only take epic prowess as a last resort for if I got all the AB feats and str/dex/wis is on an even number and I know i cannot get two great abilities.
Or if my char uses more than one weapon.

IronAngel wrote:

I'd go for Called Shot, since that lets you slow the enemy down and make your escape. And it's good otherwise, too. You won't be tanking and thus getting swarmed by monsters - a ranged spellcaster is obviously in the back, and you can't use Expertise when you're casting Heal/GR spells anyway..

Called Shot functions well with a ranged weapon. Sorry if I'm just re-iterating that point. Obviously being able to slow your enemy down when he's far off means you get even more shots at him if he does run towards you.

If you use the Defensive Spellcasting toggle (pass a Concentration check to avoid Attacks of Opportunity when casting spells) then I'm reasonably sure that Called Shot itself won't toggle that off.

It seems to me that most spawn trigger when I'm practically on top of them. It's hard to get many ranged attacks before I'm in melee. So using Called Shot to slow enemy down before they reach me doesn't seem all that practical.

And I'm not that fast at pushing the right buttons in the throws of battle, so I wonder how effectively I could use Called Shot. I'm better with a less intense style of fighting. I guess I can take it, kick the tires and take it for a spin. If it doesn't work for me, just retake that level and try Expertise instead.

Um.. you're not actually soloing, are you? I suppose you can build for that, but it's not very sensible. And if you do, it's certainly a poor choice to take a ranged weapon anyway. If you suspect you constantly end up in melee, you should take a melee weapon in the first place.

A spellcasting priest's place is behind your tanks, buffing them, healing them, and supporting them with your ranged weapons and awesome disabler buffs. You won't be dealing any notable damage with that build in any case, so you'd better use your AB to hamper the enemy any way you can. Depending on your build, you'll have AC well in the 50s anyway.

A melee PM with Dev and Epic spells. . .

The minmaxing would make even Mago cry tears of blood.

It's not THAT hard but it sucks ass.

IronAngel wrote:

Um.. you're not actually soloing, are you?... And if you do, it's certainly a poor choice to take a ranged weapon anyway. If you suspect you constantly end up in melee, you should take a melee weapon in the first place.

I probably solo 90% of the time. Just works out that way. It's only rarely I run into someone with whom my char is level-wise compatible. I'd rather hunt in a party, so much easier and faster, but it's more wishful thinking than anything else.

The way I see it, my guy needs a high AB stat: STR, DEX or WIS. For my cleric, that's WIS with Zen Archery. I can't see a way around it. I'm fine with him doing minuscule damage with his sling. At least he'll hit the target more often than not even if it just stings.

And on the lucky occasion he gets to party, he'll hang back, heal and cast a few zingers.

.. Heard of the party ball? It works 89.76% of the time.

Muspelkvist wrote:

Bard 4/Palemaster 16,RDD 10, Dev, Epic spells, 70-80AC, but probably 3 Attacks Per round and around 30 ab, MAX.

75 AC max, self-buffed. 38-39 AB, usually. Depends on how knowledgeable you are of the module.

Melee PM's suck. At least the ones all you guys seem intent on getting. And the ones that are actually omfgzwth I won't be sharing, since they're as balance breaking as boots of speed.

To make it short: Get something else, if you can.

Working on a tiefling concept, and trying to decide between three different paths to set him on:

Str/Con barb with devcrit, Con barb with DR, or barb/wiz ragemage.

Tips, opinions, insults?

Swashbuckler:

Rogue 16 / Fighter 6 / Weapon Master 7 (Tiefling)?

Rapier. Go for Epic Dodge and Crippling strike.

Yes, no, maybe? Suggestions?

Falling Spider wrote:

Working on a tiefling concept, and trying to decide between three different paths to set him on:

Str/Con barb with devcrit, Con barb with DR, or barb/wiz ragemage.

Tips, opinions, insults?

D'you like apples?

Swashbuckler

Human (Tiefling)

Rogue 16 / Fighter 6 / WM 7

Ability Statistics:
STR 13
DEX 17 (19) --> 26
CON 14
WIS 8
INT 14 (16)
CHA 8

1Rogue1 Feat: Dodge, Feat: Expertise
2Fight1 Feat: Weapon Focus Rapier
3Fight2 Feat: Mobility, Feat: Spring Attack
4Fight3 Dex +1
5Fight4 Feat: Whirlwind Attack
6Fight5 Feat: Weapon Specialization Rapier
7Rogue2
8WM1 Dex +1
9WM2 Feat: Improved Critical Rapier
10WM3
11WM4
12WM5 Feat: Knockdown, Dex +1
13WM6
14WM7
15Rogue3 Feat: Blindfight
16Rogue4 Dex +1
17Rogue5
18Rogue6 Feat: Improved Knockdown
19Rogue7
20Rogue8 Dex +1
21Rogue9 Feat: Epic Weapon Focus Rapier
22Fight6 Feat: Epic Weapon Specialization Rapier
23Rogue10 Feat: Improved Evasion
24Rogue11 Feat: Armor Skin, Dex +1
25Rogue12
26Rogue13 Feat: Defensive Roll
27Rogue14 Feat: Epic Dodge
28Rogue15 Dex +1
29Rogue16 Feat: Crippling Strike/ Epic Skill Focus Discipline

------

Also, I'm curious: How well does the parry skill work? What would a dexer who had Improved Parry, Skill Focus, and Epic Skill Focus parry with the max'd out base skill be able to do? Just curious.

I noticed that when you're parrying, it's pretty useful against many enemies so this build may suck in one on one battles. But, you never know. Parrying isn't all that used on AMia unfortunatly, but I did have my thoughts about the parrying skill earlier today and was thinking on whether or not it was useful.

Try building up this build and see if it's good or not.

My brain keeps telling me that I heard somewhere that Parry is a broken skill on NWN.

I am not sure if it was ever changed with 1.69

Also, are DEX-based with Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus, Ambidex/Imp 2-Weapon or Dual-wield builds always doomed to fail?

The most AB I can get out of those is 46. >.<

BlackDahlya wrote:

My brain keeps telling me that I heard somewhere that Parry is a broken skill on NWN.

I am not sure if it was ever changed with 1.69

Still broken AFAIK

I was wondering if a rogue/bard/sd would be a viable build for amia being that you can only go to lvl 30. If so, I would go dex base, dual-wield shortswords. As for race I was thinking of using a drow and playing as a surface drow. Anyways, if someone could get back to me and maybe discuss possible builds that would be great.

My starting stats would be

Str: 10
Dex: 14+2
Con: 16-2
Wis: 8
Int: 12+2
Cha: 12 + 2

Im not sure what I would do for skills or feats. I would need help with that

Any insight would be great. Thanks

Yurell wrote:

BlackDahlya wrote:

My brain keeps telling me that I heard somewhere that Parry is a broken skill on NWN.

I am not sure if it was ever changed with 1.69

Still broken AFAIK

No its not.

Champion of Helm wrote:

Swashbuckler

Human (Tiefling)

Rogue 16 / Fighter 6 / WM 7

Thats the frank. Frank does 95 - 120 criticals in the abyss with his x3 Handjobs.

Its not a Bad build, i've got a similiar one on an Air Genasi. Its a bitch not haivng that very last feat though. Epic Fort would be a life saver.

If it was me though i'd drop the fighter levels in favor of Champion of Torm levels. 8 of them in this case. Ergo the build would be a Chultan 17 Rogue 8 CoT 5 WM. Why would I do such a crazy thing? To wield short swords, and take all three dual wielding feats, rather than weapon spec and epic weapon spec.

MoshingChris wrote:

Yurell wrote:

BlackDahlya wrote:

My brain keeps telling me that I heard somewhere that Parry is a broken skill on NWN.

I am not sure if it was ever changed with 1.69

Still broken AFAIK

No its not.

nwnwiki wrote:

This skill was reduced from its original (pre-release) state and is considerably less effective than it may sound. Parry can only deflect the first attack in each of the three flurries in a round (for example, parrying an opponent with 5 attacks per round will only attempt to block the first, third, and fifth attacks).

that was always a turn off for me... it can block a maximum of 3 attacks per round.

2 questions though: does it only parry attacks from your target, or all enemies attacking you?
and does it parry attacks that would miss anyways due to AC?

..Though, wouldn't some godly parrying skills coupled with epic dodge make you pretty untouchable, assuming you're only fighting one guy?

no.

My monk has 50+Parry, 60ac, and epic dodge.

If you have 50+AB; you still hit every second attack, easily.

Also. It parries all incoming blows.

A monk with Haste, Dual wield improved, etc has about 9-10Attacks Per round.

He can parry 5 attacks @ round. from all sources

Muspelkvist wrote:

Also. It parries all incoming blows.

A monk with Haste, Dual wield improved, etc has about 9-10Attacks Per round.

He can parry 5 attacks @ round. from all sources

No, it doesn't. It does one a flurry. Trust me.

I was searching for builds. I was wondering if this would work as a build on this server. Also, if so, I was thinking that the skills should probably be changed. I just dont know to what.

http://nwn.bioware.com/guilds_registry/ ... &gid=13568

Quick easy question, if you were making a Cleric25/ftr4/rogue1, and you could max out 1 and a half skills by dumping them on the last couple of levels, would you dump them in Discipline, Spot or Tumble?

I'm thinking max Spot and 15 in Tumble, but how much will I be kicking myself when I'm on my butt getting pwned by knockdown?

I could jsut drop the skills that are supposed to go in PP and dump them into discpline from the start

2d6 Sneak Attacks or Epic Shadow Lord? <.<

Epic Shadow Lord.

Figured that'd be the one. Thanks!

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