Yeah, the type that attracts less players and ultimately results in less people playing on the server.

I couldn't care less about limelight. I'm more than happy for my character to be told -IC- that there's nothing she can do. It's the OOC ignoring and Elitism that spurn others.

Actually plots like these seem to effect the server in a larger sense. Sometimes it is not a large group of fully buffed people running around smashing encroaching evil forces that changes the server's face, but a few characters who shape a city's political structure.

I hate how we drive the DMs to run less and less events because of our negative attitudes about said events. I've been guilty of it myself and I've worried OOCly about what was going to happen to my character if something negative occurred.

Events are supposed to be fun for whoever may be involved. Why does it have to be anything more and why do we have to read into it to the point where it makes DMs hate running events?

Personally, I would firmly support smaller, more frequent events, with a big, server-wide event less frequently.

I doubt anybody really hates running events, even after getting flak many times. They're just looking for new people to run events for.

I thought that this was the case currently? Maybe the smaller events are less frequent but the huge events that shape the server happen very less often. (Which I agree is good.)

It's the events that "need" private circles that drive people away.

Yeah, the type that attracts less players and ultimately results in less people playing on the server.

Disco/nekh, has the rate of players with new accounts creating their first character decreased significantly? I doubt it Moshing, personally, I see new players all the time here. At roughly the same rate as always, to be honest. They leave because they are bored because nothing is happening, that is why they leave. They send tells to me "THIS IS SO BORING!"

Lack of a large scale plot happening is 'precisely' the biggest problem with amia.

Edit: Kjetta, come one, run with the idea I presented!

Disco/nekh, has the rate of players with new accounts creating their first character decreased significantly? I doubt it Moshing, personally, I see new players all the time here. At roughly the same rate as always, to be honest. They leave because they are bored because nothing is happening, that is why they leave. They send tells to me "THIS IS SO BORING!"

The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!

The only reason I am really posting in this thread is to push the general idea I set out earlier, tbh.

Recap:

*MacGuffin was once split into pieces, give to NPC and/or PC leaders

*Baddie wants MacGuffin back, because its a MacGuffin of great power only he/she can use

*Kick event off with baddie getting a piece of the MacGuffin by killing someone

*Send armies/assassins against cities to get other pieces. Involve as many PCs as possible.

*As numbers said, drop plot hooks EVERYWHERE. Make history books with detail aspects of the history, put them everywhere. Make that NPC that yells stuff out talk about it.

I've now mentioned a concept, which I've thought of for quite some time, in several places on the forum already. This, is that concept.

I made the following post in Cori's topic, which addresses the concers I belive Amia suffers from;

http://www.amiaworld.net/phpBB2/viewtop ... 225#423225


To summarise those concerns, and areas where Amia currently lacks:



# Many factions, including their leaders and members, feel as if there's nothing for them to do in the end. The goals they set for themself are often un-achievable, and many belive they lack purpose as Amia, and everything that does happen on the server is perceived as very static.

# There is no current main story on the server, and hasn't been for years. This is currently leaving a void where the players don't feel apart of the world. All epic adventures (Lord of the Rings, Star Wars etc) have one main storyline which all other plots can (but not nessecarily) relate to.

# The lack of RP conflict often results in lack of faction interraction. Most characters on Amia are involved within at least one faction, yet as it stands now, these factions are mostly just RP flavour than anything else.

# The current low-numbered DM staff leaves little room for 'ordinary' epic plots, and due to server lag and other obstacles these are often considered unrealistic and impossible to do.


What needs to be added/changed:

1. Main storyline.
2. Faction involvement and encouraged interraction between factions.
3. Purpose to characters and factions alike.
4. RP conflict to bring tensity and excitement to the module.
5. A plotline that's mostly independent of DMs to progress.
6. Clear set of rules and mutual agreements between DMs and players, to avoid as much OOC grief and bitching as possible.


My proposed solution:


As I mentioned in my other post, what I belive lacks the most is means of achievement past the point where you've reached level 30, and is active within a faction.

As it is now, factions often have strong pre-defined RP concepts which set the framework for how the factions works and what they are -meant- to do. Unfortunally, more than often, the factions on Amia reach a point where what they're suppose to do, can't be done.

Examples:

#1. Banites are meant to clense the isle of everyone who they perceive as heretics. Those who do not convert, are to be killed. This is impossible due to not having permadeath forced upon characters, and not being able to remove NPCs.

#2. Defenders are meant to protect the innocent, rid the isle of potential evil threats and keep peace. This is also impossible, due to the same reasons as above. Even if you kill an evil villain, the evil villain will just respawn and continue to cause havoc and hurt innocents.


The reasons as to why the factions can't achieve and strive for the goals they would normally have, varies for each faction. Though, from my personal experience, close to all factions except for a few (Black Flag, Amian Traders Federation for example) have little to nothing to do.


The solution is quite simple: Adding something alternative, which lies within the boundries of what is deemed possible on the server, for the factions to achieve.


It has been suggested in the past that areas should be added to the module that could be conquered. I agree with the skeptics in this matter, as such a change would encourage too much PvP, with in many instances, little to no RP behind it.


The solution I have relies on items.

The idea is to add a specific item ('artifact'), for each faction, that would relate to the RP goal and ambition of that specific faction, thereby make it lucrative for the faction to hold it in its possession.

I don't know the exact number of active factions on Amia, but I guess it's in the 20's at least.

These items would then make the foundation for a new main story line. A storyline which will be entirely new, and written from scratch. I expect the DM staff to handle that part.

The DMs function in this would be;

1. To write the beginning of the new main storyline, meant to include the entire isle, the characters, the NPCs and the factions.

2. To kick off "The never ending Plot" by introducing the items ('artifacts') through various minor plots, or simply dropping them into the module progressively and randomly.

3. To spontaneously make small twists to the main storyline, which will otherwise foremost be pushed forward and progressed by the players and their characters.

By allowing the characters to define what happens next in the plot/storyline, the DMs workload becomes minimal. Even though the DMs can be as active as they want in contributing to storylines with events and unexpected changes/happenings.


These items/'artifacts' aren't meant to be all-powering items. They won't be "Ear of Epic World Domination" that can spontaneously tear down a whole city by itself.

Each item is meant to have a specific RP purpose for each faction, in combination with a slight party-orientated function that improves the factions ability to do well in battle (or any other area where they would draw benefits).

Examples of what these items could be like;



Black Hand of Bane (Church of Bane): A right-handed black gauntlet, rumoured to have been invoked with divine energy by Bane himself. This item, unique within its kind, causes terror and fear upon its enemies, and raises the strife for battle and tyranny among its wielders.

+3 str, Pulse Effect 3x / day (+1 AB, +2 AC, +2 saves to allies), Fear Pulse 1x / day (Barbarian Terrifying Rage Pulse, stuns enemies who fail th save.


Floating Orb of Mystra (Mystra's Tower / Arcanists): This well known artifact is been sought by many. A magical device, said to have been created by the Goddess of the weave, Mystra, that lies within every arcanists desire to possess.

Pulse Effect 3x / day (+1 AB, +2 AC, +2 saves to allies), Hellball 1x / day, "Call upon the Weave" (Pulse Effect, All allies regenerate +2 HP/round for x rounds).


Holy Sword of the Defender (Defenders / Paladins): A majestic sword, crafted by a true master out of the finest materials, which holds a divine holy essence unlike any other. This sword is legendary to cause evil foes to flee, at the mere sight of it.

Bastard Sword; +6 vs Evil, 1d8 Divine, Keen, On Hit: Fear DC 22, Pulse Effect 3x / day (+1 AB, +2 AC, +2 saves to allies)


Legendary Dagger of the Criminal Network (Black Flag / Other criminals): This infamous dagger, known to have slit more throats than any mortal can count, is a true blessing to anyone who wants to manifest themself as a true criminal overlord.

Dagger, +6 AB, +2d6 sneaks, +8 hide, +8 ms, +1d8 slashing, Pulse Effect 3x / day (+1 AB, +2 AC, +2 saves to allies), Pulse Effect 2x/day (All allies gain +10 hide and +10 MS for x rounds).




Again. These are ONLY examples, of what could be done. It would be entirely up to the DMs and the staff to determine what would be deemed reasonable to give to these items.

But... the key factor here, is that each item has very, very high RP value to the faction it is meant for, while still making it useful to the wielder, but more so to the allies within the faction.

By focusing on the item to give a boost to its faction members as a whole (pulse effects ), rather than just the one who has it in its possession, there becomes less grief within the faction of who should have the item in his/her possession. It also encourages the entire faction to actually obtain it, since everyone would benefit from it.


Another major thing in this, is that... a faction isn't meant to hold onto their specific faction 'artifact' forever, once they finally achieve it.

What creates conflict, RP, intrigues, tension, excitement is the fact that these 'artifacts' will move around. As the items are introduced, the Grove might end up with "The Black Hand of Bane", the Black Flag suddenly gets ahold of "Floating Orb of Mystra", and so forth. This causes the players to start interract with each other, trying to get ahold of their specific item from other factions.

Once a faction has gotten ahold of their item, the idea is for it to not hold onto it for any longer than about a month. Otherwise things become stagnant. The idea is to keep the plot going forever, causing the factions to constantly have something achieve, a goal to strive for.

I would also add OOC limitations to such items. Aka, only followers of Bane can use the "Black Hand of Bane" and only arcanists / followers of Mystra can use the Orb, and so forth.


It is also highly important to make rules, conditions and regulations perfectly clear by the DMs before this starts.

Something along the lines with what Yossarin has suggested in various parts of the forum; A mutual contract, which everyone 'signs' to get involved with the plot.

This is to make sure that the players who are involved understand the rules, that their faction item might be 'taken' from the during the storyline, and that everyone plays nicely and have fun, rather than OOC grief just because they can't win in the end.



Short summary:


Items of very high RP value to each faction is put into the module/world, and are included in a big main storyline which the DMs create and kick off.

The players then decide the destiny of the plot, who interracts with who and what conflicts might errupt as different factions get ahold of other factions desired 'artifacts'.

Crystal clear OOC rules and regulations regarding this plot is signed and agreed upon by everyone who participates, to keep the enjoyment of the plot free from OOC grief and bitching.




Uhm. I think that's all.

Thanks for reading it all


Disclaimer: This is an idea of a PW RP interracting concept between factions primarily, which I had. This idea/concept is by no means perfect, and is up for discussion regarding details and what aspects of it might be improved.

Nothing I wrote here is meant to be an absolute definitive, and everything is suggested with the intention to bring more fun and enjoyment into the module.

The biggest glaring problem that I've seen is the "Win Mentality". This server tends to promote it heavily. With the "UBER POWERBUILD" thread, it just goes to show that people would rather make the character that can plow through anything than someone who may, just may, need to rely on others to get a task done. In this same vein, that breeds a type of player that hates to lose. And these people rage when they do. I've seen PvP brawls where someone dies, gets raised, rebuffs, then rejoins the fray.

--

Moral of the story, stop trying for MOAR POWAH and start trying to enjoy interacting with unique people.

The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!

I agree with most of your post; I love to lose, myself. I disagree with your analysis here, though. There's no overwhelming correlation between builders and win mentality. Many of the regular contributors in that thread are among the best role-players on Amia, and I've never seen them have a hissy fit when they lose. I design all my new characters with that thread's help, myself.

The reasons (and manifestations) go deeper than whether you enjoy the challenge of building, or even the kind of server you're used to - normal people can learn new behaviour. It's too easily written off as something so superficial, but I reckon it has to do with psychological factors that go far further into your personality and world view than anything you could define in the context of NWN.

I do not think my idea would require many hours, really. I dont see what you are getting at yoss, it would not be a single DM running it but multiple.

There is a lot of conflict, actually, these days.

I think, that there should be a limit to your deaths before you perma-die. Say, 10-20. That would rock.

Should be more circumstantial. Problem is on a big server its a bit harder to keep track of. I've had servers that had perma-death systems where you had a listed number of lives, I think it was 6, and certain types of deaths could cost you a life. One of the most common ways was execution by a city for violation of the law, another was someone collecting a bounty offered by a city on you, or by initiating a blood feud against someone.

Unfortunately on a server this big, that doesn't work easily as you had to keep track of the lives people had by basically writing them down.

The death thing, as anyone I talked to this server about outside the server will tell you, is about my only major complaint on this server. When I can log in and literally have people be saying "death means nothing here" in character, I notice a distinct problem. Death becomes useless as a tool to motivate RP because most people, and by extension their characters, are not afraid of death. I won't say everyone acts this way, I know some that don't, and my own character tends to avoid situations that get him killed because I reason that even if death ain't final, its probably not very fun so one owuld try to avoid it anyway. But honestly not having a solid, well worked out, and viable perma-death system you remove a lot of the stops that prevent some of the stupid PvP and wanton criminalism that sometimes crop up here, because whats the worst that can be done if you break the law? You get killed and just come back and laugh at the guards for being so stupid to think that would fix anything.

As it stands death seems to have little point or value on Amia, though maybe I'm just missing it. This doesn't stop me from logging in but I think, correction I KNOW that it can be a deterrent to some really good RPers. As it stands the consequences for bad (and also good in many cases) actions are not matching up with the severity of the action because death really just isn't a strong punishment.




I think I just ranted. Oh well.

People should stop treating death as Death, and play Knocked Out instead.

Once you realise that little trick and make your brain think it's good, you never have to worry about Death being meaningless again. Unless the situation calls for Meaningful Death.

It was a very good rant.

People should stop treating death as Death, and play Knocked Out instead.

Once you realise that little trick and make your brain think it's good, you never have to worry about Death being meaningless again. Unless the situation calls for Meaningful Death.

And when I try to counter with "You only come back as long as your god wants you back", I have gotten replies along the lines of "I don't have a god." --Well....-some- power is bringing you back.

I, too, suspect that DM events have little to do with the drop of players.

I think, that there should be a limit to your deaths before you perma-die. Say, 10-20. That would rock.

And when I try to counter with "You only come back as long as your god wants you back"