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[ 34 posts ] |
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Brighti
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 Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:25 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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Right, all monks on here seem warrior based. I want to play a monk, class and all but as i think they should be portrayed, peaceful yet not defenceless.
How would anyone suggest I do this? They still need to advance their martial arts/meditation (leveling). Any ideas?
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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Drannok
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:36 PM |
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Player
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
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The addition of the job system, on top of using Dream Coins for exp makes this more than possible. And honestly It's not any sort of stretch to be a temple monk, using their martial arts just as both a way of worship and relaxation in training only, never for combat unless it's forced upon them.
As long as you are willing to do your job and RP for all the exp the character will ever get, you have no need for any gear, any hunting, or anything at all except RP. Which, again, fits a monk very well.
Many monks on Amia are warriors because for most people, it's fun to be a warrior when you want to be one. But it's certianly no stretcc of the imagination for a capable and trained monk to also be a complete pacifist and never go out stompin goblins.
EDIT: This is fact opens up the possibilty of complete defense builds for you. If said monk is never interested in combat, he/she can be completely Dex/Wisdom based, allowing them to reach unbeliavable defensive levels and huge spell resistance. There's a certain point where their defense is so high, they win any conflict that involves violence simply by being totally untouchable, regardless of if they can inflict damage or not.
_________________
Drannok Stranvil - Mystran Loremaster
Rugnar Wildbrew - Dwarvern Scout
El'thanion Nuleaf - Wood Elf Shifter (Inactive)
Thayzin Goldenmaul - Gold Dwarf Paladin of Moradin (Inactive)
Last edited by Drannok on Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:39 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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Leggomi Eggolas
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:39 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Location: Oregon ('OR-ə-gən') [-8 GMT]
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Use the Market Gardener + Brewer Job as a monk to make ales.
_________________ 
Those trees won't burn themselves down. (by Maryn)
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Brighti
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:40 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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You explained exactly what I imagined in better words ^^ Awsome
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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IronAngel
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 20:49 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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I see no problems with this. I can't give you any tips just like that, because I have no idea about your character concept. The best advice I can give is to look into monastic and, in general, ascetic movements in real-world religion for plausible and authentic inspiration. Forget the nonsense in fantasy.
There are plenty of Jobs suitable for a Monk. Beggar is an obvious choice. (Though few real-world monks have ever been beggars; it is forbidden of Buddhist monks to ask for donations, for example. They just get them without asking, as far as I understand.) Western Christian monks have been particularly industrous in botany and all sorts of technology and literature stuff. Just pick a god or a philosophical outlook or basic thesis, and build on that.
The number one concern with monk RP is consistency, IMO. There are lots of stereotypes about monks, but they're really lame if you just drop them into the mix. The monk is defined by his systematic world view, and the rigorous, purposeful practice that comes with it. A monk doesn't meditate just because it's cool, a monk doesn't master his body just because it's the stereotype, a monk doesn't brew ale because he happens to like it. Everything in a monk's life is tied and devoted to his belief system, everything has a purpose. So figure out your ultimate purpose, and build a system around that. That's how I view monks, and it's what makes them such an interesting class.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Brighti
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 21:21 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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I know the mentality and how I wish my characters personality to be, but which deity would anyone say is a better choice for this, a Lathander follower or a Selune worshiper?
(Also I was thinking of farming animals, dairy hopefully. where can that be done?)
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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Herr Delta Houdini
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 21:37 PM |
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Player
Joined: 06 Jun 2008
Location: England
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I made a Monk quite recently, considered following Selune also, but instead went for Ilmater. I'd say go for the one you know most about already and/or find most interesting.
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Ael'thil Rilyn'tlithar
Previously known as: Anubis
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Gers
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Posted: Mon, Sep 14 2009, 23:31 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Apr 2005
Location: Kentucky, USA
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Oghma would probably be a good choice for a contemplative and non-violent monk as well. The historian, linguist, archaeologist and other academic jobs would fix in very well with a monk devoted to the discovery and preservation of knowledge as his/her focus. Given the existance of Candlekeep in the Realms, you even have a few good props for a backstory already present.
As for dairy farming, I don't know of any monkish orders of Chauntea or the like, though in RL cheesemaking has also been a common job performed by monks. In fact, many of the cheese varieties you see in stores today were originally created by them.
_________________  Named Most Influential Character, Amia Awards 2011
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soundofastream
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 0:25 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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Choose Old Order or Ilmaterran's Order or for a small Yondalla one, Hin fist, for your kits I guess.
I might add that Eldath also had a monk order I think?
Illmater (suffering) makes a good choice or Oghma for a knowledge seeker monk.
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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Dark Immolation
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 0:31 AM |
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Developer
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Location: The downeaster "Alexa"
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Gah, Gers beat me to it with the Oghma advice. But yes, a monk of Oghma could be a very non-violent(though sitll capable), studious character. Think like the monks of dark ages who stayed "underground" so to speak, translating and preserving the writtings of old, literature, philosophy, science, and knowledge in general. It would actually seems very RP oriented, and reminds me of a homebrew class I saw a while ago called "Deviant". ( http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Deviant_%283.5e_Class%29).
But there are some monk players and orders already around that don't thrive on the "warrior" aspect of monkishness as well. One of my monks actually follows a style that studies just as much about botany and flower arrangements as self-defense, in the purest sense of the word.
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The Incognitos
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 0:38 AM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
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If you aiming for the Zen Monk image, look at things like scribe and linguist as a being the skill you attain expert rank in; but save the last rank for level 30.
Not to toot my own horn but I stayed in a Monastery on the Tibetan plateau in China back in 2001. The all trained in Kung Fu everyday but also worked to perfect their calligraphy everyday(the ones that choose calligraphy) as well as growing food and tending to livestock.
It was a surreal place to be. It wasn't a Shaolin Monastery but they have a similar way of life. You should go for a pure monk build in my opinion, and write books of contemplation and poetry(I don't know if that's exactly what the monks I was with wrote, I don't read Chinese, but it seems apt).
_________________ Jess Incognito:- Ah, but the phoenix may fly only when its feathers are grown...
Olaf Grudgebringer: Stroppy Cleric or Morradin
Krunk (Underdark): Stay back! He's a bit mad.
the_incognitos@live.com
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Gunz
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 1:11 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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For god, with what you've given (peaceful and agricultural), I would suggest Chauntea, Eldath or even Salandra. Selune and Lathander are great choices too, sure. Nobanion might be a nice twist.
For the whole peaceful side, so that you aren't running around killing to level, a combination of the job system and destroying undead might be good? Maybe even constructs? Which, by the way, if you worship any of the gods mentioned, you'd probably want to be killing undead anyway.
Food for thought.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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soundofastream
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 1:44 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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Most of those gods don't have monk orders (e.g., Chauntea).
Monk Orders of Faerun:
http://amiawiki.shatuga.com/index.php/M ... s_by_Deity
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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Brighti
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 11:49 AM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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I've read into the deities, and I like Eldath, As she clearly is fit strongly for both being a passifist and an agricultural lifestyle. Although she doesn't have a monk 'order' surely I could still play a monk of Eldath? Or even create an order as one doesnt yet exist?
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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Herr Delta Houdini
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:14 PM |
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Player
Joined: 06 Jun 2008
Location: England
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Dunno what other people think but sounds a good idea to me.
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Ael'thil Rilyn'tlithar
Previously known as: Anubis
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The Incognitos
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:38 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
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Bear in mind that your PCs monastic order doesn't have to have an affiliation with a god. It could just be a monk, living in a monastery, who happens to have their own little shrine to the god you choose. Something in the vein of the ascetic monk.
_________________ Jess Incognito:- Ah, but the phoenix may fly only when its feathers are grown...
Olaf Grudgebringer: Stroppy Cleric or Morradin
Krunk (Underdark): Stay back! He's a bit mad.
the_incognitos@live.com
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soundofastream
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:39 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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Brighti wrote: I've read into the deities, and I like Eldath, As she clearly is fit strongly for both being a passifist and an agricultural lifestyle. Although she doesn't have a monk 'order' surely I could still play a monk of Eldath? Or even create an order as one doesnt yet exist?
Actually, just to correct you, Eldath -does- have a monastic Order:
http://www.nj-pbem.com/data/Gods/humangods/Eldath.htm
Disciples of the Yielding Way
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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Kjetta
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 13:12 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Nov 2006
Location: A Clean, Well-Lighted Place
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I was under the impression that the "Monk Orders of Faerun" thing was just a list of some monk orders, not a complete list, enabling DMs/players to dream up their own.
_________________ To err is human; to forgive divine, but VENGEANCE IS MINE!
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Brighti
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 13:19 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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Yayness
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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IronAngel
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 14:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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soundofastream wrote: Most of those gods don't have monk orders (e.g., Chauntea). Monk Orders of Faerun: http://amiawiki.shatuga.com/index.php/M ... s_by_DeityFalse. (The page doesn't even list all the documented monastic orders of the Realms, let alone all the undocumented, possible ones.) Kjetta wrote: I was under the impression that the "Monk Orders of Faerun" thing was just a list of some monk orders, not a complete list, enabling DMs/players to dream up their own.
Correct.
Moreover, if we were to assume some deity didn't have a monastic order (which is probably very rare), individual monks could still be part of the clergy. Or monks could even be independent of both order and clergy. _________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Gunz
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 14:40 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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Brighti wrote: I've read into the deities, and I like Eldath, As she clearly is fit strongly for both being a passifist and an agricultural lifestyle. Although she doesn't have a monk 'order' surely I could still play a monk of Eldath? Or even create an order as one doesnt yet exist?
Her famously known order is: the Disciples of the Yielding Way. But, also, Monks are considered part of her normal clergy so you don't need to be in an "order" if you don't want to. Not that you'd really have to if they weren't anyway, just sayin'. That opens you up to joining existing nature factions instead of a monastic one if that's something that wound interest the character (I.E. The Hidden Glades or the "Grove", which is The Oakmist Vale). Don't think you have to go around killing "bad" people along with the rest of them. Eldathyn are charged with protecting Groves first and foremost. So you can simply be a grove protector for your faction, unless there were dire circumstances of course.
Take the information and come up with something fun and unique for yourself. That's the beauty of taking multiple pieces of lore, you make something all your own through it.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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Brighti
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 16:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2006
Location: Portmouth, England
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I've hit a nasty snag. After hours of searching... I found Eldath's idol. And Blam! She won't accept my lawful good alignment, which makes no sense to her characteristics at all! Can a DM maybe kindly...force me into her worship at all? >.<
_________________
Account: INSTINCT92
Current:
Lekssctun Krzlic
Makast Thix, The Rabbit
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maughter
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 18:37 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Location: Wales, the UK
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Gers wrote: As for dairy farming, I don't know of any monkish orders of Chauntea or the like,
though in RL cheesemaking has also been a common job performed by monks.
In fact, many of the cheese varieties you see in stores today were originally created by them.
An Example: Stinking Bishop
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IronAngel
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 19:03 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Brighti wrote: I've hit a nasty snag. After hours of searching... I found Eldath's idol. And Blam! She won't accept my lawful good alignment, which makes no sense to her characteristics at all! Can a DM maybe kindly...force me into her worship at all? >.<
The Deity System only works correctly for Clerics and other divine casters, and even then it's imperfect. Don't worry about it; it's just one fluff aspect. Lawful Good Monks can follow any deity just fine. Alignment is not a problem for patronship.
But Eldath is supposed to be NG and accept LG. So I guess that's a bug. _________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Gunz
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Posted: Tue, Sep 15 2009, 22:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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Odd... Eldath takes LG for Clerics. It should be there.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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soundofastream
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 0:24 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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IronAngel wrote: soundofastream wrote: Most of those gods don't have monk orders (e.g., Chauntea). Monk Orders of Faerun: http://amiawiki.shatuga.com/index.php/M ... s_by_DeityFalse. (The page doesn't even list all the documented monastic orders of the Realms, let alone all the undocumented, possible ones.)
Maybe something changed in 3rd Edition then? In 2nd Edition, it -was- certainly the case that only certain gods had monk orders and others didn't.
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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Dark Immolation
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 3:41 AM |
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Developer
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Location: The downeaster "Alexa"
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soundofastream wrote:
Maybe something changed in 3rd Edition then? In 2nd Edition, it -was- certainly the case that only certain gods had monk orders and others didn't.
If that was the case in 2nd edition, and it's no longer the case now, since Amia follows 3.0 and 3.5, I'd assume that's been overruled. Even if not, it's Amian house-rule, which makes it just as valid if not moreso anyway.
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soundofastream
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 3:52 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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Dark Immolation wrote: soundofastream wrote:
Maybe something changed in 3rd Edition then? In 2nd Edition, it -was- certainly the case that only certain gods had monk orders and others didn't.
If that was the case in 2nd edition, and it's no longer the case now, since Amia follows 3.0 and 3.5, I'd assume that's been overruled. Even if not, it's Amian house-rule, which makes it just as valid if not moreso anyway. Well my question is, did this change in 3rd Edition? It certainly was the case in 2nd Edition. As for House Rule, I don't see it written anywhere that all Gods may have monk orders so I was asking the DM team if this is now the Amian rule?
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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FA_Frey_XC
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 3:56 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 May 2005
Location: XC HQ Alpha, Sol System, Sirius Sector.
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Again, seems to be a answer that is applicable cross-posts:
The DM's overseeing the campaign rule on this, not the Players Handbook or DM's guide.
I don't see why people keep pointing to the PH or DMG and going "here here!".
DM's rule over the campaign they have created. Accept it.
Regards,
_________________ 
"Come under the flag of truce, and brook no treason... for mineself is Death, and care not whom knows mine touch."
- Frey Asaid'De Majere
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soundofastream
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 4:17 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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well, what we have here, is a couple of players calling it a "House rule", making it up as they go along and no official ruling from the DM team. Doesn't sound like a foregone conclusion to me.
You see, there was even a table in 2nd Edition, stating which gods had monk orders and which ones didn't. In 3rd Edition, it may have changed and on top of that, no DM team has yet given a ruling on it, which means, by default, 3rd Edition rules would apply.
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 6:01 AM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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Any god could plausibly have a monk order.
Deal w/ it.
Can't believe that argument spanned a dozen posts.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 10:14 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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In 2e, monks were divine spellcasters. In 3e, they're oriental martial artists. It's not the same class anymore.
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting clearly says, before introducing some of the monastic orders: "Dozens of monastic orders exist in Faerûn. Most are small circles of no more than a dozen or so members, living in isolated monasteries in the wilderness. A few orders include hundreds of members and influence events across entire nations. Some of the prominent orders include: [eight orders follow]" And that's only about the Faerûnian orders, while monks are even more common in Kara-Tur.
Not every god necessarily sponsors a monk order, no. But every god could; or rather, since it requires no participation from the god, there could be monks among every god's followers who decided to set up a monastic order. New monastic orders are introduced all the time, in web enhancements and articles as well as game supplements. (The Underdark, for example, introduced a Lolthite monastic order.) It doesn't mean that the basis of the universe has changed to allow new monastic orders, it just means someone happened to start or document a new order.
It's a matter of politics, not the divine. Some churches do not regard monks as clergy, while others do. Some churches happen to have monastic orders associated with them, while others don't. This is completely subject to change as players and DMs make up stories. It's the same as the case with any PC: there's no Driarry Earthshaker in canon lore either, but it doesn't mean there couldn't be. And because it's possible, you can play such a PC.
There's no contradiction, whatever 3e says. You're just reading the lore wrong.
P.S. Where did you find that info on 2e Monks, by the way? 2e FRCS and Forgotten Realms Adventures state there are no monks in the 2e Realms. Faiths & Avatars introduces them again, but mentions nothing about a limited number of orders.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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soundofastream
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 12:42 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
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I think its listed in the main 2e deity book:
Which is mostly replicated for instance here:
http://www.nj-pbem.com/data/Gods/humangods/Eldath.htm
Although there was also a table that listed each god and whether or not they had a monastic order in that book (or was it in Powers and Pantheons?).
_________________
Illithira Frostmaiden (Snow Elf) Guardian of the Frostfell
Elithiel Issatheerin (Shadow Elf) She who Lurks
Isolia Oussea'lylth (Sun Elf) Apprentice Wizardess
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Sep 16 2009, 17:16 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Faiths & Avatars has no such table (as far as I can see). In fact, it makes very few mentions of monastic orders to begin with. Its deity descriptions list the kind of divine classes that are part of the clergy in question, including monks. I've already addressed this above, though. The most important thing to note is that Monks in F&A are a Priest kit, not the mundane Ki-powered warriors they are in 3e. Therefore, not all information is relevant anymore.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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