AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - Weight Watchers of Amia

Dwagin wrote:

Books are by far the worst offenders.

FYI, I made a book using the job system out of an Empty Tome with the scribe ds_j bio and ds_j append commands and managed to jam a fair amount of text into it, but it still only takes up about 5 KB as far as I can tell (the difference in size between two saved bic files). Not to say that other books currently in game and containing more text might not be larger.

I think Xavi's file size is in the 800-900 KB range, but I dont know where the majority of the weight is coming from. Probably either rings or clothing, or maybe it's those few bags stuffed with miscellaneous herbs.

Robert and I found a funny thing. It doesn't immediately appear to matter if you use the scribe commands to add a bio because it sticks the bio into... let's call it "Hammerspace". We found out when I grabbed Rob's common to Drow books which have GIGANTIC descriptions... I used our DM commands to blank the bio, but in his character file, the books still had the massive description.

Yes. The original text is kept.

// Set the description of oObject.
// - oObject: the object for which you are changing the description
// Can be a creature, placeable, item, door, or trigger.
// - sNewDescription: the new description that the object will use.
// - bIdentified: If oObject is an item, setting this to TRUE will set the identified description,
// setting this to FALSE will set the unidentified description. This flag has no
// effect on objects other than items.
// Note: Setting an object's description to "" will make the object
// revert to using the description it originally had before any
// SetDescription() calls were made on the object.
void SetDescription(object oObject, string sNewDescription="", int bIdentifiedDescription=TRUE)

Changing an item's or character's bio ingame just add more to the size.

Yeah, hence why I made teh post here asking people to ask a DM for a freshly imported, toolset made, cut down one.

Interesting... so everything that was there previously sticks around anyway? Just hidden from view in game? That's odd.

o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote:

Interesting... so everything that was there previously sticks around anyway? Just hidden from view in game? That's odd.

That way if you make a mistake you can have it back, which is a very go thing

Alright. I reinstalled the item counter on entry, so it's time for some questions.

Who has more than 500 items on a character?
Who has more than 600 items on a character?

I have more than 500 items on Illithira.

I know I'm over 500 kb but I dont know that I have more than 500 items - I dont think so, but I'll let you know in a month.

Thistlefoot has over 500 items.

Aer has over 500, under 600 - so says the loggin counter.

OK, I am going to put a block on 600 items on the entry. You got more? The trashcan is nearby.

Urrrr, didn't we agree in the DM forums that this was *not* the way to do it, Disco?

What about those of us who have PCs who hoard gems?

I know gem bags exist, but I've not been able to get any ICly, though I have tried. Nor Paid DCs to get an item storer for them.

Suppose that I'm suppose to you know just toss all those out when I log my PC on and lose an IC resource, simply for this, even when I specifically checked with Nekhy to make sure my PC was within the acceptable limits.

This does not make me happy.

This is the second time I've been forced/will be forced to retcon or make IC changes/losses because of dev decisions that change how my PC operates, or affects it from an OOC point of view, with no IC compensation, for an OOC action.

I have somewhere in the order of, I'd say around 800 items on Rras.

They're mostly stacks of gems though.

TormakSaber wrote:

Urrrr, didn't we agree in the DM forums that this was *not* the way to do it, Disco?

I dunno, I just remember that I had to reinstall the item counter, and I doubt I'd put that on my list just for generating numbers. Seems that there are only a few people with 600+ items, so I don't see the problem. Keeps 'em clean and hygienic, I'd say.

Dwagin, you're acting like a drama queen. All it takes is a PM to a DM asking for a few gem pouches. I am not sure how unreasonable you think we are, but I have the feeling that the average DM here isn't going to say "haha, I don't think so!".

Relax, I could make a GetFileSize() function instead.

my highest item count is 382.

i made sure the longest description was on a DC item, and even thats not too huge.

with any luck none of my characters will get anywhere near this, i've been keeping my packrat tendencies under control

turns out I got 691 items, but its not my fault its......Yoss

, yep if he did not stop playing his char I could gave given him all them stupid wands and scrolls I have.

I kind of dont trust the mythal tube yet, was waiting for people to find out all the bugs befor I cram like 80+ Intermediate mythals down its neck (if it can handle 80+ Intermediate, it should be able to deal with 50+ greaters.)

I can't see how people need any more than 200 items unless they're a merchant >.>

Eary sits at 143, and that's including a bag full of heal potions, another bag full of consumables/PvP Gear, three different gearsets, arrows, and a few extra weapons.

I've seen posts from DM's on the forums with directives to 'Handle it IC' when it comes to finding items for PCs in the past. Because of that it never entered my mind to consider asking a DM for gem bags. Such a request seemed even more of a taboo than those posts that were trying to set up an IC transaction.

I read your post as saying: "If you got over 600 items, pitch out stuff, or you can't play your character till you do."

I was basing my response on those bits of info off the assumption of that. I don't think its irrational to consider that your post could be taken in that way, if reading it literally. I also shared my displeasure on the percieved situation, with taking both of those things into account.

It isn't like I made a "This sucks, I quit Amia FOREVARS!111' post.

I'm glad though if one of the DMs will be willing to help me with that, when I return to playing.

I'm not sure what to do about this atm.

Darth's item count is 470-ish, and according to Nekhy earlier in this thread, his file size is 800kb.

I honestly don't know what's making his file size so heavy.

I guess I could dump the excessive amount of BoT pages I'm carrying around.

And if you have one of those gem pouches, I wouldn't mind those either.

If you have over 600 items, there -must- be something you can give away. The rubbish bin is nearby, so why not? And you could just RP the gems, it wouldn't be a sin.

Until you have to ICly use the gems for something and prove you have X number of them.

The gem pouches work marvellously well.

Up next: Heal tubes?

Could I also get a new file size count on Darthy poo?

I have the feeling rebuilding itself is adding weight. It's not just the amount of items. Incidentally: Leto jobs also increase filesize.

That said: dragging over 600 items along isn't a good plan, and I don't think that putting a stop there is a bad idea. Mind that stacked items are counted as ONE.

Well.. I just got rid of 35 stacks and about 50-60 other items (read: BoT pages).

So Darth's down to 391 items atm. And, that sounds like a rather reasonable amount.

Does the list of quests in the journal add to the file size as well?

Everything does, but not a lot. The text of the quests is in the module, not on your character. You just store a few numbers.

I just tested something with a character of 491 KB and 391 items. Level 25ish, I think. Took all the items away: 48 Kb. Mind that I never took a rebuild or went back levels with this character. Need to try a rebuildaholic (Mr Mago, are you there?) as well.

Shoot.

EDIT:

Right, tried it with Darthy poo. Saved him to zhe local vault. He weight in at 654 kB with 391 items.

Removed all items except for the plot ones (can't be arsed to actually get rid of those). Aka 18 items left.

File size went down to 67 kB.

SetLocal<Data> on items also stacks up the filesize, might not be much but a few bytes at each time on all items to track them adds up alot too. Then the more data the item needs to hold the bigger the file that holds the item gets, description and probably number of item properties.

SetName and SetDescription is two evil functions because they overwrite the original text thus they keep the original for the purpose of restoring them by feeding in an empty string into the string parameter along with the new one.

Leto does not do this for the perpose of playername. But at the moment SetDescription runs on a PC the game adds a /DescriptionOverr string field to the bicfile that is filled with the overriden description while the /Description still holds the bio that was made at character creation.

Then the size of the bic data arrays vary on what type of character you are. Things such as spells, memorized spellbooks, quickslot setup, familiar, animal companions, levelup list and item lists. NWN adds or subtracts entries within the gff datastructure as they are needed.

If this goes through, how about sticking a standard, non-racially-biased merchant in the entry so that those who might have excess items but dont log in until after this is in force can sell that excess rather than trashing it?

"Hello, I'm Murgatroyd the Merchant. I buy stuff. My prices are no better than you'll get from my colleagues in-game, but if you have more than 500 items you might want to unload some of those on me"

Oh, and a 5000 gp cap. You shouldnt have so many items that you'll need to get rid of those that are worth more, I would hope.

I'm still in favor of just removing bags of holding. You shouldn't be allowed to carry all this crap in teh first place. And the str penalty on Fey should hurt more than it does.

Me too, but I guess Amia will have haks before that happens.

The weight reduction is a itemproperty, item properties can be swapped out.

So its possible to make a oneshot script that turns all 100% weight reduction to 50% or something. I think?

Yes. That's how I dealt with the SF items.

I've actually got more than fivehundred items on Eir. <.< I wonder where they came from.

Kjetta wrote:

I'm still in favor of just removing bags of holding. You shouldn't be allowed to carry all this crap in teh first place. And the str penalty on Fey should hurt more than it does.

bags of holding are part of FR, we have allready said this afew times, we own houses,castles,rooms...ect we cant store all our stuff where we live so unless you want players making mule chars the only option is bag of holding.

also mythal tubes, can we overfill them or have a max, I will tube up my mythals if its safe because I would hate to lose a ton of mythals(well like 1615+ wight of them)

Last edited by AlphaWaves on Fri, Oct 02 2009, 22:35 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Kjetta wrote:

I'm still in favor of just removing bags of holding. You shouldn't be allowed to carry all this crap in teh first place. And the str penalty on Fey should hurt more than it does.

Bags of holding are a savior. ICly, my characters aren't physically carrying around enough furniture to decorate three rooms, enough drinks for a continual party for a week, parts of a golem, 10 different sets of clothes including accessories... etc.

They're in a house usually, or a hostel or inn. Maybe even a cart or packs on a donkey.

Morgan & Son's can only accept so much and are in no way good enough to accommodate for that.

From 550 items down to roughly 500. Once I get my costume-jewelery-bedazzled fingers on some gem pouches, that'll drop well below 500. And then I still have to do some downsizing.

Kjetta, I will defend my bags of holding to the death, or until Morgan & Sons gives me an executive level storage contract.

I am a little concerned about the 600 item limit. Thistlefoot is a merchant & he had 535 items after he had limited his stock. I wonder if there any merchants out there with over 600.

Yes, there are.

A laged server is'nt very IC, neither a crashed one is....

I would do what other popular servers does: Restricted it 150 items max. If you have more, you are teleported when entering the server to a "void place" with a merchant so you could sell your stuff till you have 150 again. People will learn to store their items in the bank.
To don't shock all veterans, I would reduce the max. items by 50 per week from now 600 till 150. And give some dire warnings in the announcements. AND you must be sure that your bank system works properly.

Yours
Torin

150 items is tiny, and the bank can't store many items so it's not really a viable alternative in that regard.

Having to parse down the inventory conflicts with an IC motto: "be prepared for anything". Having strong points that are only social skills with zero use with fellow players and limited use with DMs, gifts and gadgets and toys become adequate problem-solving tools when used in unique or clever ways.

However, getting the inventory down to a sensible number (below 500) is reasonable to me.

Yossarin, I read the first paragraph 3 times and it still fails to make any connection with the parts of my brain thta deal with understanding language.

Wait! Is that my bollocks alert going off?

Yeah, it is a terribly constructed sentence. I'll rephrase.

The only PC I really play has only one useful feature for problem-solving: social skills. Unfortunately, social skills see extremely limited use. You cannot use them at all with fellow players, and it is rare that a DM needs or will allow their use in an event. Therefore, facing challenges and puzzles I find comes down to having the right items or tools at my disposal at the right time. A sudden and adequate use for that Eye of Newt, being the ingredient you can barter with a witch for in order to gain Love Potion No. 9 so that you can make the generalissimo fall in love with the woman who plans to kill him. Or that spiked drow matron catsuit which you can don on the fly when you need to "fit in" to a strange and seedy S&M atmosphere.

Having to cut down my inventory naturally threatens my motto of being prepared. It means I have less and less and less tools at my disposal to face a wide variety of challenges, because I cannot simply claim to have them or say, "Hold on, I need to go and get X."

But that's just my IC motto, and it falls to the wayside in light of the needs of the entire playerbase - that being, getting a stupid huge inventory under control. Which mine still is.

Torin wrote:

A laged server is'nt very IC, neither a crashed one is....

I would do what other popular servers does: Restricted it 150 items max. If you have more, you are teleported when entering the server to a "void place" with a merchant so you could sell your stuff till you have 150 again. People will learn to store their items in the bank.
To don't shock all veterans, I would reduce the max. items by 50 per week from now 600 till 150. And give some dire warnings in the announcements. AND you must be sure that your bank system works properly.

Yours
Torin

I highly disagree with my namesake. 150 is *not* enough. Especially because the bank can only hold 20 individual items. Now if that bank could hold hundreds of things....

Yossarin wrote:

Having to parse down the inventory conflicts with an IC motto: "be prepared for anything". Having strong points that are only social skills with zero use with fellow players and limited use with DMs, gifts and gadgets and toys become adequate problem-solving tools when used in unique or clever ways.

However, getting the inventory down to a sensible number (below 500) is reasonable to me.

yeah less items mean less options means players will pull more crazy stuff like, that big bad golem who is crushing a city I open my portal wand to Manor of Mourn and now we dont care because the undead will IC kill it or all die so no matter what its a win for us.

now change Manor of Mourn to any city you dont like Tarkuul,Ultrinnan...ect and yees DMs could say it would not work when it clearly could/would and all it would cause is OOC fighting.

Portal wands don't function like that. Your example is moot because portal wands aren't 'optional', generally speaking, as part of an inventory.

players and DMs throw in unwilling people and dead people in portals and it works IC all the time, just steping on the portal warps you IC (OOC you have to click it) so it would if you open it under them.

tormak the point of them not being optional would not matter my point was more talking about that guy who said lets all have a max of 150 items so our options would be so limited lets bring out the cheese way to win.

Weight Watchers of Amia - for people with large file sizes

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