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Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 8 posts ] 
Zante
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:17 PM 

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This is about the event that took place last night, which I think has been handled unfairly by the dm team. Posting it in gen chat instead of a pm as the call has apparently been made by several dms and I would like to hear the reasoning of each.

Quote:
The second method is far more insidious, for it tricks the subject into accepting a trigger object inscribed with the final spell word, automatically placing the creature’s soul in the trap. To use this method, both the creature’s name and the trigger word must be inscribed on the trigger object when the gem is enspelled. A sympathy spell can also be placed on the trigger object. As soon as the subject picks up or accepts the trigger object, its life force is automatically transferred to the gem without the benefit of spell resistance or a save.


http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/trapthesoul.htm

Which part of the spell description would make yesterday attempt not count? Picks up or accepts. Even if you are going to claim that Mylthar did not accept the dagger when he claimed Valas (the wording was deliberate, Valas said he offers his mind, his body and his blade, an offer Mylthar accepted), he also did pick it up, knowingly. Mylthar should have been trapped.

I want to know what the DM team based their decision to make the spell fail off.

No flames, I am trying to discus this in a civil manner.

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Last edited by Zante on Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:22 PM, edited 1 time in total.

 
      
Gravemaskin
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:21 PM 

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Quote:
Before the actual casting of trap the soul, you must procure a gem of at least 1,000 gp value for every Hit Die possessed by the creature to be trapped.


You found a gem that was worth the 30,000+(assuming the Mylthar is just level 30, which I doubt) gold coins? That's one large gem....

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Zante
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:22 PM 

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Gravemaskin wrote:
Quote:
Before the actual casting of trap the soul, you must procure a gem of at least 1,000 gp value for every Hit Die possessed by the creature to be trapped.


You found a gem that was worth the 30,000+(assuming the Mylthar is just level 30, which I doubt) gold coins? That's one large gem....


Yep, we did. Happens we had an old plot item that was worth far more than that.

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Gravemaskin
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:33 PM 

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Won't work if the soul is missing and such though. Since it's Justice's bones whom are possessed in a way, trying to use that spell on the animated remains would probably not suck out the soul of another creature possessing the body. I'm guessing the Mylthar is like a soul-jar scenario.

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Zante
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 16:36 PM 

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The spell would work, was approved and researched by 40+ int wizards with 100+ spellcraft and lore. Was the spell not to work they would have found out in advance during their research.

The spell was declared void because Mylthar taking the dagger was decided not to be suficient, aka... the dm running the event pressed that him accepting the offer and taking it did not count as him accepting and taking it. I want to know what that was based off, since the spell description clearly states that merely picking the trigger up would cause it to activate.

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Sven
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 17:26 PM 



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Wouldn't it be best if the DMs replied as per the request of the OP? oO


 
      
IronAngel
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 17:40 PM 

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Well, if this requires several DMs to respond, I am sure they can compile an answer for you in private. These kind of discussions don't really belong in public, IMO, because they ruin the immersion and fun even for those who aren't involved. Some people would just prefer not to know what goes on behind the scenes. Discussing IC events should always be kept to an absolute minimum.

Hence, I'm locking this. If the DMs involved feel it's appropriate to continue this here, of course, feel free to open it.

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TormakSaber
 
PostPosted: Thu, Jul 09 2009, 20:23 PM 

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As the DM who ran this event and spent three hours in AtR addressing near every concern you could come up with last night, I want to say I'm incredibly dissapointed in you for attempting to make this a public thing in order to sway people to your side in what you must feel is a way to get me to take your side in the situation via a fancy guilt trip, instea dof just coming to me for yet again another talk session.

It has failed spectacularly. When you have issues with events, you bring them up with the DM running the event. You do not post them in the public forum to air out your problems to try to get people on your side.

But hey, too late for that, right?

~~~

Trap the Soul failed because the spell is incredibly specific in tis wording. The Trigger Object must be given to the target, physically handed over to them, in a willing and aware manner. The target but understand that this object being handed to them is theirs now, and they must be willing to accept the object and take it. The dagger never once left Valas' hand to be given to Mylthar. Your character did not understand the inner workings of the spepll, which is fine, because your character is a 14 int, level 5 wizards that pretends to be able to understand magickal workings far, far beyond his ken. It's okay, he can pretend, but sometimes things get lost in the shuffle.

Quote:
The spell would work, was approved and researched by 40+ int wizards with 100+ spellcraft and lore. Was the spell not to work they would have found out in advance during their research.


The spell would have worked. .... Had the dagger actually been given to Mylthar, in the midst of all the didactic antics.

Mylthar did not want the dagger, does not want the dagger and will never want the dagger. Your wording is clever but ultimately not heartfelt and sincere (You did not truly wish to sacrifice yourself, as stated later, nor did you truly wish to give the object up, as you explained to me as well. You cannot "Lie" to Magic.), nor within the realms of activating the spell, since you explained to me later that you did not wish Valas to be captured and in fact would not have done so if you had known OOC that the spell wouldn't have worked! But you don't get to know OOC. That's really how things work. Your character, all the characters, made judgement calls based on what they knew as a character. To inform you beforehand of the situation is to ruin all suspense, all sense of excitement.

Over the course of this plot, I have stayed my hand from directing actions. Like in Nes'ek, your actions alone have determined the success or failure of your actions. You told me that you "did not know you were giving up". I emoted several lead in statements, and asked you if you wanted to forgo Epic Dodge. Given that this was the second time Mylthar had snatched at you in the encounter, it becomes immediately obvious that he is attempting it again, but you chose to forsake the Epic Dodge and allow him to grab you. I also explained to you and several others that to simply kill you over and over is no fun for anyone involved and is basically tantamount to DM griefing. I chose not to do that and so here we are.

No. I, by technicalities cannot force you to permadeath, as you seem so keen on bragging to other people. I cannot force you to do anything unless you "play along". Right. I will tell you right now that the only reason Valas is not permadead due to his own actions is because of that rule and my own good graces. It's not because you don't want it to happen. But don't you dare go bragging to other people about how you have beaten the system, beaten the DM, that he has to let you go, whether he agrees with it or not, because "That's the Rules", like you are a giddy lawyer over finding a loophole.

I have never regretted running a plot, and I will not do so now. However, I no longer run this plot as a favor to you, like I did in the beginning to help further your character's story. No, I run this plot for the players who are interested, who care, who stay IC, and most of all understand the biggest rule of roleplay and the essence of DnD: That by your character's actions in the gameworld, for good or for bad, your characters experience success, failure, or even death.

You abused the trust between a DM and a player that we will not "force you to permadie" to color your decisions, knowing that no matter the outcome, I as a DM would be, 'by the rules' forced to let you go. You chose to rub that in my face... .and that is highly unsporting.

Rest assured, the DM team is discussing your "situation."

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