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GreatPigeon
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 Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:17 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Hmmm, I dont know much about the great gears in this game, I know if I took martial weapon, I could use more weapons for gear setting and the 1(day) abilities and such, for losing a bit of damage per hit, I know I wont be the damage cannon in the group.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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If I were to build a Bard/PDK, I guess I might go for Bard/Fighter/PDK 25/4/1. Should net you 4 attacks/round, Epic Weapon Spec. and the second-to-last AC buff/nuke on Bard/Curse Song. 29 Bard isn't that much better than 25, so I'd get whatever goodies I could from multiclassing.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:28 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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It would definetley be stronger then a bard 30 for solo I think at least. Get me some summon monster scrolls.
I am probably gonna turn this into my main character, really like bards and creating a character more "like me".
Do like idea of playing a pure class though. What type of saves am I looking at with a Bard?
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Uberuce
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:30 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Location: Near the bar.
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Xaviera wrote: That's close to what Xavi's build used to be. The curse/bardsong is nice fluff, but yeah, the damage is mediocre. I always felt a bit leech-like, but she could get in there and duel with the succubi and other irritating small stuff while the tanks took down the big guys, so I didnt feel like I wasnt contributing anything. She was certainly the least effective party member overall. A now departed player once told me he was fed up of his n00b partymates disparaging his Bard's crappy damage output, so he let them run ahead to the next area and rested midspawn. They were all dead within three rounds.
The DPS of dead people is zero. Hence, the buffer/disabler has the biggest crits in the party.
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Uberuce
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:31 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Location: Near the bar.
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GreatPigeon wrote: What type of saves am I looking at with a Bard? Lower than a hooker's neckline.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:34 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Thats what I was afraid of, makes me tempted to almost just play as a BG and get bookooo saves in exhance for a bit loss on my my song. 26,3bg,1fighter? Not really sure if i wanna be evil though, but i dontwanna die every 3 minutes eihter from spells.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:40 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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You won't have much problems in PvM. Spawns don't have particularly deadly spells or special abilities. At least if you go prepared. No doubt, that BG version is much stronger, but rather lame. In PvP with mages, you're screwed, but you'll be screwed even with huge saves; they'll just use something that allows no save, and you have no tools to really hurt mages.
I can't say I've ever suffered much from low saves, as a pure bard or a bard/fighter. It's a bit inconvenienct, but not lethal 99% of the time.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
Last edited by IronAngel on Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:42 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Yeah Iron, wanting to make a character more like me, wish I could go pally/bard as its exactly what I am. I think the BG is out, I will suffer bad in PvP though I assume without the saves. Just surrounmyself with folks and hide behind the tanks.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:44 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Edited my post. Yeah, you'll suffer in PvP no matter what. Anything that will decimate you with spells or abilities that allow a saving throw can also do so with other means.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Sokar Rostau
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 18:55 PM |
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Player
Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Location: Australia
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GreatPigeon wrote: Rallying Cry is 3 times a day and it lasts one round
Inspire Courage is only 10 rounds 2 times a day
Oath of Wrath is only once a day so good for duels or bosses is all, it lasts only twice his level in rounds. so max is 10 rounds
Final stand is nice, but not worth a 5 level investment personally
Bard song with lasting inspiration is like 105 rounds i think, Id rather have 5 more levels of bard over 5 levles of PDK anyday, id consider 1 pdk 29 bard though
Rallying Cry is a Free Action. Meaning you can use it while doing something else.
Oath of Wrath doesn't actually work as per the in-game description. It works against all creatures of the same type as your target.
You missed the point about stacking songs.
Heroic Shield absolutely, 100%, stacks with itself meaning that 5 PDKs can keep a 6th party member at the 20 Dodge AC cap indefinately. If Final Stand stacks with itself that means that a full party of PDKs can give each other 100+ Bonus HP, on top of any Bardsong or Shapeshift Bonus they have.
Of course Lasting Inspiration is better, that's not the point. I could have gone 21 Bard/9 AA, but the point was to make use of full PDK levels.
My PDK will end at 16 Bard, 9 AA, 5 PDK. The PDK Songs are extra goodness to the Bard Songs that last for the same, or less, duration.
You can't scoff at this and call it useless to your party in a Boss fight or PvP:
2d10 HP (Final Stand)
+2 AB, +2 Damage, +2 Saves, +2 Skills (Oath of Wrath)
+1 AB, +1 Damage, +2 Bonus against Mind Effecting (Inspire Courage)
+1 AB (Rallying Cry - 1 Round x 3)
+4 AC (Heroic Shield - 1 Round x unlimited)
+2 AB, +3 Damage, +3 Will, +2 Fort, +2 Reflex, +20 HP, +5 AC, +4 Skills (Level 16 Bard Song)
Combined with -2 AB, -3 Damage, -3 Will, -2 Fort, -2 Reflex, -20 HP, -5 AC, -4 Skills to your enemies (Level 16 Curse Song (which may help to make PDK Fear slightly useful)
If you go back to about page 3 of this thread, where I originally posted this build (twice, it was adjusted) you'll see that I said more levels of Bard would be better but that wasn't the point, the point was to find a viable build with 5 PDK. The same could be said of every Bard build that stops short of particular levels. Also, if you look, you'll find that 16 Bard is a very common component of builds because that is one of the major song levels.
Since 25 is the last major song level, 25 Bard/5 PDK could be an option. Heroic Shield would be a benefit to many builds, there's no inherent reason why Bards would make more use of it than anyone else. It's a shame that the Ranger's pet gets a boost at 27 because 26 Ranger/4 PDK with Bane would be a nice combo - sit there spamming HS on your pet all day and then get yourself an uberised Bane for the Bosses.
If you can find a more viable use of 5 PDK then please, show us.
_________________
"Where's my pony?"
"I'm sorry, baby, I had to feed that pony to a dragon."
"Oh. Whose horse is this?"
"It's a Warhorse, baby."
"Whose Warhorse is this?"
"Zed's"
"Who's Zed?"
"Zed's dead, baby. Zed's dead."
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 19:14 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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I didnt say i was bad, the lack of duration on those hurt though, They are good for boss fight and thats about it, or to use on one spawn. level 30 is actually the last song though. 25 and 5 would be fairly effective Im sure, 10 rounds is not long to invest 5 levels in something I think?
Im not 100pct sure never played as one
Edit: You miss out on 2 feats as well Bard 26 and Bard 29, and I was unaware of te oath of wrath being effective against more then one target. It says twice class level s max is still 10 rounds, or 1 minute.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 21:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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Quote: Also, if you look, you'll find that 16 Bard is a very common component of builds because that is one of the major song levels
Well, it's mostly a spellcaster thing in general: 16 is when GMw hits +5, and when turns/level spells last 8 hours, a.k.a. all day. But it's also an important bardsong level.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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maglorine
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 21:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Looking for ideas on a Hin Slinger build. I made one up once but I've lost it.
Lightfoot subrace. I like the thought of Hin using slings for ranged given they have the good aim feat - no bows needed here! I could be convinced to go Dart but Sling is where I'm leaning. I'm thinking heavy rogue for the sneakdice otherwise damage will be pitiful. Epic Dodge should be in the mix given the high DEX. Perhaps EWS for the nonsneak damage. Maybe Rogue/Fighter but open to ratios on the class mix or inclusion of prestige classes. A scout and cornersneak specialist who is handy with traps and hard to see. Ideas welcome.
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 21:40 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Would you consider 16 rogue, 10 sd, 4 fighter?
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 22:07 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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maglorine wrote: Looking for ideas on a Hin Slinger build. I made one up once but I've lost it.
Lightfoot subrace. I like the thought of Hin using slings for ranged given they have the good aim feat - no bows needed here! I could be convinced to go Dart but Sling is where I'm leaning. I'm thinking heavy rogue for the sneakdice otherwise damage will be pitiful. Epic Dodge should be in the mix given the high DEX. Perhaps EWS for the nonsneak damage. Maybe Rogue/Fighter but open to ratios on the class mix or inclusion of prestige classes. A scout and cornersneak specialist who is handy with traps and hard to see. Ideas welcome.
A Rogue 23/Ranger 1/Fighter 6 is great for a ranged cornersneak. You can swap to dual-wielding whenever you have the need to melee. The stats and feats are pretty plain and mundane. _________________  UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 22:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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You get 240 skill points (About)
8d6 sneak.
Epic skill focuses, hide, ms, and spot
28 dex base, hips, and epic dodge, you can use a shield with the sling, so good ac.
Throw a round of slings, and hips away, rinse and repeat, just like shampoo. Im sure on of the true builders will say im way off though lol
I did 10 str, 20 dex, 12 con, 8 wis, 14 intel, 8 cha.
Dodge,Mobility,Weapon finesse, wf-sling, blindfight, imroved crit, stealthy, 2 more I didny know...
ws,ews, armor skin, epic ms, epic hide, epic spot, great dex, epic dodge.
took 10 sd pre epic, 7 rogue, and 3 fighter... in epic took 1 fighter and 9 rogue.
My estimate is right at 55-62ac fairly easy enough +hips, you will never ever die *sagenod* you have about 250 hp. Not really sure what the AB is though.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 22:12 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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I misunderstood sorry, thought he wanted to be superduper sneaky, so I put in the SD levels.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 23:18 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Im planning on making the a diplomat type of bard, trying to work out problems with both sides, be aquaintances with all peoples, will 26 bard,4bg work for this, Or would it make it a bullshit build? Just really like the idea of having Divine might, and was gonna take one extra level of it to get extra turning.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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ainjyll
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 23:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Jun 2006
Location: wilmington, nc
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GreatPigeon wrote: Im planning on making the a diplomat type of bard, trying to work out problems with both sides, be aquaintances with all peoples, will 26 bard,4bg work for this I'll politely point out this sentence.
BG... blackguard... sold his/her soul to some sort of evil entity for more power... that BG? If you wanna play friends go pally, not BG. Unless, you're just pretending to make friends in the hopes that you can manipulate someone into doing what you want of them later. _________________  "I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Tue, Jun 23 2009, 23:24 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Well he is kind of out to make everyone trust him. Cant go pally/bard
Bard is an essential. I keep debating the BG because of teh saves and divine might being so awesome.
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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maglorine
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 0:56 AM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Uncle-Opustus wrote: A Rogue 23/Ranger 1/Fighter 6 is great for a ranged cornersneak. You can swap to dual-wielding whenever you have the need to melee. The stats and feats are pretty plain and mundane.
Do you get an Epic Ranger Feat at Ranger 1 because Rogue 24 is a bonus feat and at least I'd keep an Epic Feat? I assume you would take an AE dump in late epic to pick up meat shields to setup sneaks?
I was initially thinking Rogue25/Fighter5 but that misses out on Dual Wield and your plan looks better - OR - Rogue16/F4/COT10 if I wanted to double up on EWS for melee and ranged and bag IKD and Imp 2 Weapon. I can still get Epic Dodge and Crippling Strike plus some save bonuses. ???
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 7:43 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Bard 26, BG 3, Fighter 1
Durpari
Str-15(14)
Dex-10
Con-13(12)
Wis-8
Intel-14
Cha-15(17)---24
Pre-Epic 16 bard,3bg, 1 fighter.
power attack, curse song, blind fight, cleave, knockdown, extend spell, max spell, max spell, improved crit
Epic-10bard
lasting inspriation, armor skin, ikd, epic prowess, epic perform, epic dis?
With maxed Charisma will get 16 casts of Divine Might a day lasting 1:36 each, granting +13 damage per hit, and +13 to saves woo!
Planned on using the bardic chain in triumvir max cats grace + sun soul boots.
Also considered using 8 dex instead, putting the difference ito STR and using the 0asf plate, allowing me to use soemthing other then sun soul boots.
Skipped extra music at tickets urging because 26 he said is enough, also i ran out of feats so no ewf, or wf, as it stands now unless someone can fix that.
Id consider going 4 fighter, but 26 bard nondispellable opposed to 23?
Edited to fix my misplaced numbers..
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
Last edited by GreatPigeon on Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:42 AM, edited 1 time in total.
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:37 AM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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maglorine wrote:
Do you get an Epic Ranger Feat at Ranger 1 because Rogue 24 is a bonus feat and at least I'd keep an Epic Feat? I assume you would take an AE dump in late epic to pick up meat shields to setup sneaks?
Yarp and yarp, although you don't really have to max AE, 20 and those rings should be a safe bet. Also, you pick the ranger level last because it gets you all the skills you need to max: MS, Hide, Discipline, Set trap etc. maglorine wrote: I was initially thinking Rogue25/Fighter5 but that misses out on Dual Wield and your plan looks better - OR - Rogue16/F4/COT10 if I wanted to double up on EWS for melee and ranged and bag IKD and Imp 2 Weapon. I can still get Epic Dodge and Crippling Strike plus some save bonuses. ???
That 16/4/10 works too, 20/4/6 is an alternative of that. Lots of feats, less skill points. _________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:44 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Durpari are Indian Hindu, basically. Seems an odd background for a BG. Their culture doesn't seem to encourage such fanaticism.
You can get Divine Might with cleric levels, too. It's much more elegant.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:46 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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IronAngel wrote: Durpari are Indian Hindu, basically. Seems an odd background for a BG. Their culture doesn't seem to encourage such fanaticism.
You can get Divine Might with cleric levels, too. It's much more elegant.
Thank you come again!
I didnt know this, gah *cries*. Dont get dark blessing though. I wanna make a me character damnit lol... They dont make pally bards  _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:48 AM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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Bard/Cleric! Do it! *whipslash*
29/1 and everyone will worship you for your kewlness.
_________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:49 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Uncle-Opustus wrote: Bard/Cleric! Do it! *whipslash*
29/1 and everyone will worship you for your kewlness.
I sense sarcasm *sticks tongue back in mouth* Yes it does taste like saracasm.
Besides they already do *scoff and tosses hair* _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:51 AM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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0 sarcasm found in the DNA test.
_________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:53 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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The point of dipping BG was to gimme decent saves. Is Dev crit a viable option for Bard/Cleric of course would have to use 8 dex for that, and still have enough cha, to pwn with divine might?
Or 25 bard/4fighter/1cleric?
Bard/PDK/cleric? XD
Requests special permission to be A Singing Bard/Paladin  _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:58 AM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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What fits your character the best is more important than some silly saves.
25 bard/4fighter/1cleric works, 29/1 works. You won't get Dev. with that, it's possible, but I'd never do it myself.
_________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 8:59 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Uncle-Opustus wrote: What fits your character the best is more important than some silly saves.
25 bard/4fighter/1cleric works, 29/1 works. You won't get Dev. with that, it's possible, but I'd never do it myself.
Isnt 25 bard dispellable though? _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Ts_
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 9:02 AM |
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Player
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
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@GreatPigeon:
Durparis are of course very evil when you want them to be. Just make up some horrible childhood background. (You shouldn't listen to the RPers in this thread, they're offtopic anyway. ;)
Your list has 2 max spell, but no Divine Might ...
For feat choices: Improved Crit + Epic Prowess is weird. I would think about these 3 feats again: Imp Crit, Epic Prowess, IKD in epic.
My options would be:
* Weapon Focus, Epic Weapon focus, Imp Crit for getting the most out of one weapon (or the ever-handy IKD instead of ImpCrit).
* IKD, Epic Prowess and one more epic feat (Epic Listen?). Your strength isn't the highest, so maybe you should go with the first route, which gives you a bit more AB.
Other than that, you seem to have a decent bard/bg.
Regards, Ts
_________________
Ralghok & Hazamir "The Weasel"
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 9:13 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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GAH i been up for 20 hours! Its 4am here damn insomnia. Feel like zombie. I appreciate you folks help, but I just cant help, Im not very good with buidling, have a hard time thinking of everything at a time. I just cant decide what im gonna make, Ive yet to make anything because i cnt get it laid out and have what I want all at one time.
Eventually I will make one of this characters lol. Either the Ranger or the Bard that i been asking about. Someday lol. Just trying to find a character with enjoyable rp that I wont have problems leveling solo or partying up either. Thanks for everyones help. Think im gonna take 4 apsirins and sleep.
Have a hard time picking starting stats and such, my highest character is 29 and I realized all the times while lelveling him how a pwoerbuild makes it better. I just need a sheet to miracuosly arrive in the mail and tell me everything step by steps so i dont screw it up lol...
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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ticket
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 9:46 AM |
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Player
Joined: 02 Jan 2009
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Ts_ wrote: Durparis are of course very evil when you want them to be. Just make up some horrible childhood background. (You shouldn't listen to the RPers in this thread, they're offtopic anyway.  
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 9:49 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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When the RPers are in the habit of forcing rebuilds or corrected backgrounds on your human subrace PCs, I guess it's good to listen even if it's off-topic.  _________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Uberuce
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 9:56 AM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Location: Near the bar.
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Ts_ wrote: @GreatPigeon: Durparis are of course very evil when you want them to be. Just make up some horrible childhood background. (You shouldn't listen to the RPers in this thread, they're offtopic anyway. And you don't get to pull the My Family Emigrated to Amia When I Was Young And I Grew Up Influenced By My New Home card. I bagsied that one first with Frank.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 10:14 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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I must say, that was so cheap that I couldn't help but laugh when I first met him.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Ts_
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 11:11 AM |
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Player
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
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IronAngel wrote: When the RPers are in the habit of forcing rebuilds or corrected backgrounds on your human subrace PCs, I guess it's good to listen even if it's off-topic. That's just the beginning of an arms race. Eventually, the powerbuilders will make a powerRP thread with 1001 lore-proof ways to make evil dwarven Aasimar half-dragons. *looks deep into your eyes* Do you really want to take the responsibility for that? Joking aside: GreatPigeon wrote: Just trying to find a character with enjoyable rp that I wont have problems leveling solo or partying up either. In that case you could consider playing a character that is more open-ended than an utmost evil Blackguard. Evil can have fun, too, but personally I don't know how to portray a BG properly (which hinders the progress of my "great builds" once I'm one step in front of a BG level and don't dare to take it ... ). The mentioned Bard / Cleric (if you want the divine might) is still less restricted than a Bard / BG and let's you choose among many deities and alignments. Durpari & Hinduism probably fit the "a little bit of spirituality" theme perfectly. ;) (NB: I have no clue.) And with an epic bard, you really can't go that wrong and summon scrolls are good replacements for a party up to level 20. One of the dirty powerbuilders already said it nice and shortly: Uncle-Opustus wrote: What fits your character the best is more important than some silly saves.
Regards, Ts
_________________
Ralghok & Hazamir "The Weasel"
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Deku
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 13:20 PM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Jun 2009
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I just made a Bard/ftr/BG on a simmilar kind of lines as yours but with less bard lvls.
20/6/4.
Feats are a real problem, it seems you always need to drop something. I had to drop curse song and Divine shield. I got lasting inspiration, Dev crit, Divine might. If I were to remake i'd probably drop Dev crit.
I'm not yet 30 but if I remember correctly my ab will be 47/48 at 30. All my saves are over 30 and got spellcraft, and I hit for over 50 damage a hit with divine might. Ac is 65 with +5 items.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 14:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Deku wrote: I just made a Bard/ftr/BG on a simmilar kind of lines as yours but with less bard lvls.
20/6/4.
Feats are a real problem, it seems you always need to drop something. I had to drop curse song and Divine shield. I got lasting inspiration, Dev crit, Divine might. If I were to remake i'd probably drop Dev crit.
I'm not yet 30 but if I remember correctly my ab will be 47/48 at 30. All my saves are over 30 and got spellcraft, and I hit for over 50 damage a hit with divine might. Ac is 65 with +5 items.
You don need divine shield, But ewww on losing curse song...mega ewww. to me thats like losing half your effectiveness _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 14:39 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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Deku wrote: I just made a Bard/ftr/BG on a simmilar kind of lines as yours but with less bard lvls.
20/6/4.
Feats are a real problem, it seems you always need to drop something. I had to drop curse song and Divine shield. I got lasting inspiration, Dev crit, Divine might. If I were to remake i'd probably drop Dev crit.
I'm not yet 30 but if I remember correctly my ab will be 47/48 at 30. All my saves are over 30 and got spellcraft, and I hit for over 50 damage a hit with divine might. Ac is 65 with +5 items.
Well amias Bard items for one aren't +5's. Your looking at a +3/+4 mix
Secondly you can achieve Dev Critic on a human w/ 26 Bard 1 Fighter 3BG.
Thirdly Divine Shield is a bit of a waste since its dodge AC.
Song +5, Haste +4, Mage Armor +1, Boots +4/5, Shadow Conjuration Variant Mage Armor +1 = 15/16. 26 Bard = 16/17. Means your expending an entire feat for 3 AC.
Fifth if you lack Curse Song then a pure Bard w/ 45 AB has an effective AB 3 points higher than yours.
Fourth if your not aiming for Devlick then you want IKD. Curse + IKD means Knockdowns in Abyss and Boss KD's.
F) 20 Bard gets dispelled far too easily and dispel hurts on a Bard because your running your gear pretty tight to get the perform you need to excel.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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maglorine
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 15:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Uncle-Opustus wrote: maglorine wrote: maglorine wrote: I was initially thinking Rogue25/Fighter5 but that misses out on Dual Wield and your plan looks better - OR - Rogue16/F4/COT10 if I wanted to double up on EWS for melee and ranged and bag IKD and Imp 2 Weapon. I can still get Epic Dodge and Crippling Strike plus some save bonuses. ??? That 16/4/10 works too, 20/4/6 is an alternative of that. Lots of feats, less skill points. Right so I mapped something out for 16/4/10 with Epic Dodge, EWSpec for both Sling and Dagger, Crippling, Maxed Disc, Hide with ESF, Move with ESF, Spot, and enough Disable/Set to handle Epic Traps easily.
Looks like I can also squeeze in EITHER
1) Ambi/2Weapon/Imp2Weapon
OR
2) KD/IKD/Something
I didn't bother with Imp Crit on anything but could use it for the "something". Both these extras are melee focused and I already have point blank and rapid shot figured in. I always thought dual wielding was dangerous due to the AC loss from dropping your shield but I've never played an Epic Dodger so maybe that compensates enough to make them worthwhile. On the other hand IKD let's you setup sneaks, assuming you can can get past their discipline. Not sure.
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:01 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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maglorine wrote: Uncle-Opustus wrote: maglorine wrote: maglorine wrote: I was initially thinking Rogue25/Fighter5 but that misses out on Dual Wield and your plan looks better - OR - Rogue16/F4/COT10 if I wanted to double up on EWS for melee and ranged and bag IKD and Imp 2 Weapon. I can still get Epic Dodge and Crippling Strike plus some save bonuses. ??? That 16/4/10 works too, 20/4/6 is an alternative of that. Lots of feats, less skill points. Right so I mapped something out for 16/4/10 with Epic Dodge, EWSpec for both Sling and Dagger, Crippling, Maxed Disc, Hide with ESF, Move with ESF, Spot, and enough Disable/Set to handle Epic Traps easily. Looks like I can also squeeze in EITHER 1) Ambi/2Weapon/Imp2Weapon OR 2) KD/IKD/Something I didn't bother with Imp Crit on anything but could use it for the "something". Both these extras are melee focused and I already have point blank and rapid shot figured in. I always thought dual wielding was dangerous due to the AC loss from dropping your shield but I've never played an Epic Dodger so maybe that compensates enough to make them worthwhile. On the other hand IKD let's you setup sneaks, assuming you can can get past their discipline. Not sure. Errr you figured weapon finesse in right?
If you take melee feats its a near guarantee you'll never use your sling.
Dual wielding is out mind. Your far far better of using the faux dual wield gloves and settling for two top attacks. My Choice would be KD, IKD and Blindfight if you don't already have it.
If you don't already have Blindfight your kicking yourself in the nutsack due to Blindfight being to a Rogue what curse song is to a Bard.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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Deku
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:13 PM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Jun 2009
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Quote: Well amias Bard items for one aren't +5's. Your looking at a +3/+4 mix
What you talking about? +5 items are available to everyone. You can mythal items to +5.
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Deku
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:31 PM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Jun 2009
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Quote: Fifth if you lack Curse Song then a pure Bard w/ 45 AB has an effective AB 3 points higher than yours. 3? How exctly? Firstly they only have 15 bab, as opposed to 16 bab. That's 1 down, and they gain in effect 2 ab from curse song if they happen to curse every single creature they fight. I'd rather have divine might, Epic weapon spec, 16 bab, CHA bonus to saves than 1 ab to be honest. Quote: F) 20 Bard gets dispelled far too easily and dispel hurts on a Bard because your running your gear pretty tight to get the perform you need to excel. Nothing of any note that I've encountered dispels very often. Mindflayers do but with 50+ per hit and 120 crits on 12-20 threat range they die really quick. Dispel is only an issue in pvp and I don't take part in pvp here. If I want to build chars for pvp I'd play on a proper pvp server like BoW. Also only mords really hurts a 20 caster. In addition your way off in regards to gear. I don't wear a single perform Item. You only need 30 perform to get the +5 ac and everythign else maxed except skills and bonus hp. I'm not wearing items for 20 more perform to get +4 to my skills. Quote: Thirdly Divine Shield is a bit of a waste since its dodge AC.
Song +5, Haste +4, Mage Armor +1, Boots +4/5, Shadow Conjuration Variant Mage Armor +1 = 15/16. 26 Bard = 16/17. Means your expending an entire feat for 3 AC.
This partly why I didn't take it, but it's still a miss. Every char I make takes Armour skin and that's a feat for 2 ac.
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maglorine
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:32 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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MoshingChris wrote: Errr you figured weapon finesse in right? If you take melee feats its a near guarantee you'll never use your sling. AWW, well I figured in a party that has tanks it would be nice to set back a bit at 20 feet or so and just target whoever is bothering someone with sneaked up bullets. I also like it in tight spaces where you get the "cannot reach" message but you can sling bullets right thru a crowd to something on the other side. It has it's uses if you plan attack strategy and makes him more party flexible. Plus I like it so I'll use it.  Dual wielding is out mind. Your far far better of using the faux dual wield gloves and settling for two top attacks. My Choice would be KD, IKD and Blindfight if you don't already have it. I can take KD/IKD and have an open pre-epic - already have blind fight, w finesse, called shot, point blank, rapid shot, the 2 WFocus and 2 WSpec pre-epic. I could go Toughness, a Saves Feat, Stealthy for that little extra sneaking edge, Skill Focus, or even Expertise for that matter. If you don't already have Blindfight your kicking yourself in the nutsack due to Blindfight being to a Rogue what curse song is to a Bard.
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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maglorine
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:36 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Deku wrote: Nothing of any note that I've encountered dispels very often. Mindflayers do but with 50+ per hit and 120 crits on 12-20 threat range they die really quick.
Dispel is only an issue in pvp and I don't take part in pvp here.
Pretty sure there are some places where you will get spammed with Greater Dispelling and you aren't immune to that until you have 25 caster levels. Been a long time since I played a high level spellcaster but that's what I seem to remember.
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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hendrack
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 16:37 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Location: Vienna
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Getting a summon dispelled can hurt sometimes.
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 18:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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maglorine wrote: MoshingChris wrote: Errr you figured weapon finesse in right? If you take melee feats its a near guarantee you'll never use your sling. AWW, well I figured in a party that has tanks it would be nice to set back a bit at 20 feet or so and just target whoever is bothering someone with sneaked up bullets. I also like it in tight spaces where you get the "cannot reach" message but you can sling bullets right thru a crowd to something on the other side. It has it's uses if you plan attack strategy and makes him more party flexible. Plus I like it so I'll use it. You need to be within 15 feet for a ranged sneak mind. AS i said its a near guarnatee not an abolsute guarantee. Sadly melee is just that much more efficient than ranged. Blame Failware.Dual wielding is out mind. Your far far better of using the faux dual wield gloves and settling for two top attacks. My Choice would be KD, IKD and Blindfight if you don't already have it. I can take KD/IKD and have an open pre-epic - already have blind fight, w finesse, called shot, point blank, rapid shot, the 2 WFocus and 2 WSpec pre-epic. I could go Toughness, a Saves Feat, Stealthy for that little extra sneaking edge, Skill Focus, or even Expertise for that matter. Toughness would be my choice, but my point on dual wielding stands especially given your a Hin and that IKD is flarkin handy. If you don't already have Blindfight your kicking yourself in the nutsack due to Blindfight being to a Rogue what curse song is to a Bard.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Jun 24 2009, 18:46 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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Deku wrote:
What you wrote.
Well i'll put it another way in a comparitive fashion since comparing a Pure Bard to a multiclass is somewhat unfair considering ones a party buffer the other a soloist. At a guestimate My Chap (Bard 26, BG 3 Fighter 1) has 3 more AC, 5 more AB, does more damage due to a curse, gets lasting inspiration earlier, is immune to dispelling. I also self sing my discipline to 60. My Party mates get 3 more AC, 6 more AB and all day haste if we lack a wizard. Edit: Missed this Deku wrote: Quote: Well amias Bard items for one aren't +5's. Your looking at a +3/+4 mix
What you talking about? +5 items are available to everyone. You can mythal items to +5. +5 requires a flawless mythal which is an epic drop.
+5 also soaks up three mythal slots in every case Bar Boots and Attack Bonus (as opposed to enhancement).
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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