AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

The title is pretty self explanatory. What does everyone think about epic levels hanging around in definately-too-low-for-them-areas? Specifically, players whose characters are attempting to start PvP situations and kill said lowbies...? Just trying to get a popular opinion.

If there's someone actually doing this, take screenies and PM a DM. There's not really going to be any response to this topic except 'Yeah, they suck!'

But lowbies are easier to kill!

I appreciate the suggestion, but I'm just trying to get a feel for how common this is and whats peoples' reasonings are for it. Mavek used to linger in the Temple of Malar, but he was the Huntmaster of the Malarites, soo.... he had a pretty good excuse to be chilling in his own Temple.

What about everyone else?

I'm going to guess something happened and this is your vague attempt to rally support. Just get a DM, there's no need for this topic.

EDIT: In any case, you posted while I was locking it. Neus is right though, there's no real answer but "hey, it sucks." If there's an epic fucking with people in the lowbie zones, and there's rules being broken, get a DM. Do try to stay IC, though.

I'll unlock it, I suppose. I expect it to stay civil.

Will do. And I can understand why some people would be in certain areas - a Desert-themed character in Khem, say a desert-esque ranger or somesuch; or a Malarite in the Temple of Malar, or whatever. But civility, IC and OOC, and OOC courtesy... is a must.

I think the agreement is that it obviously sucks / is lame. Screeny, tell DM, go about your merry way.

I personally am not above a basically OOC walk-away if someone is being an utter d-rocket. No area is worth my RL time being wasted by some clown.

I have to admit: I'm one of those people who hang out in low-leveled areas. However, it's not for PvP purposes. I mostly do it to collect Mythals, blank scrolls/wands, or simple items so I can use them for crafting purposes...

There's nothing wrong with that, right? Of course, if lowbie(s) come on by...I am required to surrender the area to him/her/them, correct?

Champion of Helm wrote:

Mavek used to linger in the Temple of Malar, but he was the Huntmaster of the Malarites, soo.... he had a pretty good excuse to be chilling in his own Temple.

There's pretty good excuses for seeking out and killing Malarites too, so um.

Jan wrote:

Champion of Helm wrote:

Mavek used to linger in the Temple of Malar, but he was the Huntmaster of the Malarites, soo.... he had a pretty good excuse to be chilling in his own Temple.

There's pretty good excuses for seeking out and killing Malarites too, so um.

Precisely.

EDIT: And what I mean by that is - if my actions caused repercussions, that was fine... because to find my character, all you had to do was go back to the Temple. He'd be there, or in the surrounding forest (back before the Temple was moved). It wasn't a simple "I like to skip through untended pastures", but a purposeful, intentional, RP-based action that was, at least in my mind, common sense. I can see how a lot of that would/could happen.

However, what about those who simply find random low-level locations to travel through? For example... if a level 20 pops into the Trogs one day - just for kicks and giggles - what's the use? The purpose? The intention?

I used to walk around lowby areas as my Salandran, but obviously, not for PvP reasons. The IC reason was keeping an eye out for possibly injured people, while in GS, help passers by and give directions, as to RP him out as best i could, since one of the Salandran books encouraged travelling to other cities or villages, as not everyone requiring aid would be able to find/get to a Salandran or the temple.

And with one of my Mages, i would sometimes give parties a few buffers if i came across them, was good for starting off RP sometimes.

Yeah if someone is doing that purely because they are looking for pvp, screenie it, thats uber lame. I know I sometimes follow groups around in the shadows, observing, learning what I can about certain characters. Of course, if they are just hunting and there is minimal RP, I lose my interest quickly.

CoH wrote:

Specifically, players whose characters are attempting to start PvP situations and kill said lowbies...?

Can't stand it when people do that. But, I have a good response: go find the 10 or so bored epics standing around in Cordor Square, and get them to go clean their clock. :twisted:

Gers wrote:

CoH wrote:

Specifically, players whose characters are attempting to start PvP situations and kill said lowbies...?

Can't stand it when people do that. But, I have a good response: go find the 10 or so bored epics standing around in Cordor Square, and get them to go clean their clock. :twisted:

That's always fun, true. Happened plenty of times to Mavek, and he didn't even PvP - just scared people out of their hunting grounds.

And yes, traveling Salandrans looking to heal and Mages looking for components are more excellent reasons, in my mind. As is spying, as an SD.

Or converting members to a faith, looking to trade with the adventurers, spreading propaganda, recruiting members or interacting with them through other means.

I find it very enjoyable to meet lowbies in hunting grounds. Most of the time, they put more effort into the the RP than the old epics who frankly don't give a fuck 90% of the time.

I have an odd question that this involves. Many of my characters have one or more then one location that is specific towards them and role playing. For an example A elf patrolling amia forest area directly looking for possible drow and other vile creatures. A dwarf constantly raiding the kolbold, orc caves. A human patrolling forest of despair. Is this a sorta of meta gaming by a epic level in a low level area or is it considered okay due to role playing reasons?

There's -nothing- that states you can't walk around freely in all areas, no matter what level you are.

Would be retarded if a rule was implemented that stated that only level 3-7 characters could enter the troll caves, and that only level 11-16 could enter Forest of Despair.

I've have 2 epics, both run lowbie areas for scrolls/wands minors on occasion. One has no trouble. She sees a scary looking level 3 or a nice level 5 and she leaves.

The other is a beast. She runs those areas and I always find a reason for her to leave. HOWEVER. If said low level charrie gives her crud enough to PVP,(which would be a lot...i'm not a really mean meanie.) it's going to happen.

Sitting in a lowbie area and killing people off is just tacky, and I think everyone would outwardly agree with that.

Lowbie areas are prime faction recruitment territory. They also have a lot of 'traffic', if someone is there looking for nasty RP (sacrifice victims and the like) then it is perhaps a fine line to draw, so long as they still offer you the required 'out' from PvP then it's not really a wrong thing to do.

Sometimes if I want a sacrafice i'll check lowbie areas but I OOC'ly give people the option to say "Hey no I don't want to do that." That being said, if I can I preffer to send low level drow after low level pcs when I want my sacrafices. It's better, gives a chance for failure (Which amuses me cause I get to scold the losers) and generally can spark some interesting rp.

CTX wrote:

I have to admit: I'm one of those people who hang out in low-leveled areas. However, it's not for PvP purposes. I mostly do it to collect Mythals, blank scrolls/wands, or simple items so I can use them for crafting purposes...

There's nothing wrong with that, right? Of course, if lowbie(s) come on by...I am required to surrender the area to him/her/them, correct? :?

I don't think you have to ever surrender a hunting zone, but I usually think it's polite and so so anyway when I'm just mythal farming.
A lot of lowbie areas are areas that must be passed through if you actually want to walk anywhere , and they are great places to recruit followers due to high traffic.

Epic players doing their things in lowbie huntings areas should be just fine and dandy as long as they give the grounds up to the lowbie hunters.* But players that are aggressively looking for a fight pvp against characters that are out of his league is beyond lame.

I avoid PvP against lowbies, unless the character really used some strong language and leaves my character no choice. Even then, I would often just use the grapple check and force him/her to submission with roll play.

*That includes epic areas too! ECLs 23&up on Yuan-Ti and ECLs 27&up on Spires. Please, please do hunt elsewhere and give grounds if you meet lower levels wishing to hunt there.

Mr Mago wrote:

Or converting members to a faith, looking to trade with the adventurers, spreading propaganda, recruiting members or interacting with them through other means.

This.
Quite often with one of my characters I find that she will walk around lowbie areas to get wands, scroll and mythals. If she is found by any other player while killing the creatures that drop the loot she will bring them to a shrine to be sacrificed/converted into her faction. After a few given outs and chances to escape, of course.

I don't see the problem. You are recquired by our rules to give a reasonable IC out of PvP. This holds true no matter the level of the involved parties, and you can't take people's hunting grounds by force (IC/OOC).

So what if you meet some EPIC drow in the Troll Caves and have to run away (one possible IC out)?

Kjetta wrote:

So what if you meet some EPIC drow in the Troll Caves and have to run away (one possible IC out)?

I agree. But players are comfortable and lazy, perceiving their OOC hunting as sacred.

Having to interact and be part of a dynamic RP setting is most often something players choose not to integrate while grinding for xp.

Hunting should never be ooc, epics need non epic loot to, if they are there just to PvP lowbies get a DM.

thats all i have to say on the matter.

There's a fine line between I'm here for a reason and I just happened to run across you and my reason for being here is you, dear lowbie *cracks knuckles*.

That's all there is to it. It'll be pretty easy to say which camp he belongs to simply by his habits. And if that tends too much towards B, he'll get spanked for it. Innocent until proven guilty.

Mr Mago wrote:

Or converting members to a faith, looking to trade with the adventurers, spreading propaganda, recruiting members or interacting with them through other means.

I find it very enjoyable to meet lowbies in hunting grounds. Most of the time, they put more effort into the the RP than the old epics who frankly don't give a (censored) 90% of the time.

I agree with this

Isn't it a question of sensibility? There's no problem with a huge level difference. You see low and high level characters on Cordor square, it's not like that causes any problems either.

The problem is players being arses.

The solution is simple: don't be an arse.

I think it's a complicated issue, actually. Because we are two things at once. A somewhat linear (in terms of areas and progression) arcade game and a dynamic RP world. These two mindsets collide and infringe upon people's expectations all the time, and it can be quite difficult to find a balance, especially as a player of an evil char.

After alll, It makes perfectly sense for drow of all levels to raid human slaves from the troglodyte caves, if you consider Amia to be a "RP world", but it clashes with the expectations of those who are there to face a balanced challenge for their level in accordance to the rules of the genre.

Kjetta wrote:

I don't see the problem. You are recquired by our rules to give a reasonable IC out of PvP. This holds true no matter the level of the involved parties, and you can't take people's hunting grounds by force (IC/OOC).

So what if you meet some EPIC drow in the Troll Caves and have to run away (one possible IC out)?

I agree with this.

I hang out in front of Ultrinnan on occasions to find some Drow and I can't imagine that being rule breaking.

Every so often I run across this kind of situation. One of my drowsie will be coming up to the surface for this or that and because I'm a cheapskate with my ports now that it costs mythals to recharge. So I'll walk whenever possible. But, every now and then I'll be coming up and going through the trolls and run across a group hunting. Sometimes, the group moves on and nothing happens. Then, sometimes... the group decides to be aggressive and abrasive and PvP ensues. I've been lucky to never really be griefed too much. The most I've really gotten was a tell saying something like, "Oh, we thought you were our level. Boy were we wrong. =)".

I usually won't attack lowbies unless they attack me first. That said, I don't have any problem ICly scaring the heck out of them. It's all in good fun, and it's great (though rare) when someone actually RPs being afraid of a drow.

Often the lowbie areas are on the way to somewhere else, especially for people who dont hunt much so are mythal-poor and tend to avoid porting. Xavi often runs from Cordor to Bendir Dale, to give one minor example.

Also, since she can't kill anything worthwhile - anywhere in Brogendenstein is dangerous for her to solo even though she's 30th - I run her through low to mid areas on occasion for cash or boredom. The highest I might usually do with her would be Minos or Kohl manor, which are probably ~1/3 her level.

I've tried to prove that epic levels can have antagonistic RP with low levels with some initial failure but some later success. I think it's pretty lazy RP if people let their respective character levels determine who they RP with.

Antagonistic RP is like any other kind, it can be done well or otherwise. Of course it takes practice and making mistakes, which usually turn's people off the idea, but it can be done, and when it's done right it's as enjoyable for all parties as anything else.

I think I may have inadvertently done what this thread is complaining about.

My current character will rob almost anything he see's, and it seems a little silly to not rob someone because they're lower level otherwise, well, he wouldn't be much of a highwayman.
It's not that I hang around in lower area's, whenever I go to train, I begin in Tarkuul, my home spawn, make my way through the swamps, and that little T-junction from them to the bramble woods and outskirts, catch the cart to the forests, and head to the valley.
So yes, I came across a lower levelled character on my way and yes I tried to rob him (Unsuccessfully I might add) but this was simply because I, or they, was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
The people who I tried to rob didn't seem too happy (Either because I was too high-a level or because I apparently didn't have sufficient reason. and sorry if you're reading this) but they might have seen this as me hanging round at lower levelled area's ( I -was- afk, so it might have seemed that way)

Summed up, I think alot of these cases are simply people being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Almost an accident

hircine wrote:

I think I may have inadvertently done what this thread is complaining about.

My current character will rob almost anything he see's, and it seems a little silly to not rob someone because they're lower level otherwise, well, he wouldn't be much of a highwayman.
It's not that I hang around in lower area's, whenever I go to train, I begin in Tarkuul, my home spawn, make my way through the swamps, and that little T-junction from them to the bramble woods and outskirts, catch the cart to the forests, and head to the valley.
So yes, I came across a lower levelled character on my way and yes I tried to rob him (Unsuccessfully I might add) but this was simply because I, or they, was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
The people who I tried to rob didn't seem too happy (Either because I was too high-a level or because I apparently didn't have sufficient reason. and sorry if you're reading this) but they might have seen this as me hanging round at lower levelled area's ( I -was- afk, so it might have seemed that way)

Summed up, I think alot of these cases are simply people being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Almost an accident

Except this thread isn't complaining. It's a discussion. And no, I've never been robbed on Amia.

*discussed about

9 times out of 10 higher level players should know better.
There aint any reason why high level characters -shouldn't- be allowed in said areas. So the first part of your topic is just a little bit of a waste of time otherwise guess what. Alright high levels your not allowed to venture outside Tarkull, Cordor, Church of Bane, Armageddon. Wait just about everywhere.

Just randomly attacking people is against server rules and it matters absolutly nothing what level you are. Oh and guess what if your level 2 and you wanna play your character the big alpha dog pm the block who'd never bacl down from a fight well hes gonna get his shite ruined.

Epic Levels in Lowbie Areas

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