Just wanted to put this thread up for FAQ or situations about PvP Rules and proper conduct. If you have a situation you need clarification on, please post for a DM to answer. Please do not mention specific incidents with names, etc, only the general situation. This is not a place to take a shot at people, it's just to better our understanding of what is acceptable.
I'll go first. I've been in this sort of situation a few times, and playing a character who is a little proud and hot-headed, it tends to put you in this position a little more often.
Scenario:
You are a high level (20+) character, minding your own business, chatting to friends, etc. A low level (Anywhere below 15) character comes up to you. They harass you, your friends, and make crude remarks. You warn them to stop. They don't. You warn them again, they still don't. You now draw your blades and say it one more time, and they respond with the same lack of sense that put them into this situation.
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you assholes." , or words to that effect.
What is the appropriate response? I've heard mixed opinions from people I've spoken to. Some say to just ignore the other person, discount their RP. Others are saying kill him anyway and let him deal with it. And some are also saying tell a DM.
_________________ Aravain, Champion of Song. Anar, a dark elf. Giovanni, Blood Knight.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
Screeney then beat the crap out of them?
If you've done the RP and they're taunting you, you have given them a way out, and they taut you, you draw your blades and threaten to kill them, then thy taunt you, they are not getting away for it.
Hmmm, perhaps send a tell back "I've given you an IC way out, you can still take it" before you kill them may also be appreciated.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
Simply put, actions have consequences. Doesn't matter what level you are, doesn't matter what level they are, if you go basically asking someone to beat the crap out of ya, don't be surprised when that's what actually happens.
Your response:
Cite the instances of offensive in-character behaviour, and remind them of the tolerance your character showed the first second and third times.
Remind them that after any of your character's given warnings, their character could have walked away.
Remind them that if their character is brainless enough to goad someone meaner and nastier than they are into a one-on-one fight, they deserve whatever's coming to them.
It's not personal. When two characters fight, there's usually a winner and a loser, so if you can't take losing, don't get in a fight in the first place.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
Selmak wrote:
It's not personal. When two characters fight, there's usually a winner and a loser, so if you can't take losing, don't get in a fight in the first place.
And especially don't start it.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
What they said, and if they wanna continue causing conflict IC'ly and not taking the IC consequences, try avoiding having to RP with them, if they continuue beyond that, it may be considered harrassment.
If you don't want to get into PvP, or don't want to lose, then just don't do it, simple as...
And if you do want to get into PvP and you want to win, thenyou have to be prepared to lose also, winning isn't guaranteed after all.
_________________ Ael'thil Rilyn'tlithar Previously known as: Anubis
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you (censored)." , or words to that effect.
What is the appropriate response? I've heard mixed opinions from people I've spoken to. Some say to just ignore the other person, discount their RP. Others are saying kill him anyway and let him deal with it. And some are also saying tell a DM.
If they use abusive language in Tells, screenshot it and report them. Otherwise just ignore their whining, and kill their PC if that's IC for you.
I'm not sure how this is a rules question since there isn't any rule, "You can't kill someone's character if they whine OOC," regardless of whether they're 10 levels lower than you or 10 levels higher.
Here's one, can't help but point the recieving end to myself, but no one else will be mentioned.
Out alone hunting a few creatures with undead summons, about half way through any give dungeon, a group of 3 + adventurers come up from behind.
I speak afew words to them, one comes forward to tell me to destroy my summons, while the rest buff behind him.
In response to this, Instead of trying to speak with them, I simply start taking them out, including the one speaking. Or on the other end, being killed and overtaken in the dungeon.
I've had some harsh words sent my way in tells for simply attacking in these situations, would that put me in the wrong?
_________________ I sleep with the Libris Mortis under my pillow.
---Carstina Blackweave--- Speaker of Tarkuul Headmistress of the Magisterium Mortis
I've had some harsh words sent my way in tells for simply attacking in these situations, would that put me in the wrong?
Nope, Hostile buffering this is. If someone asks you to get rid of a summon, because it's undead, and they or the other's with them begin to buffer, it's a hostile action, because it's a possible outcome of PvP depending on whether you chose to unsummon or not.
It's not exactly going to be a smart idea to stand there while the others prepare, when you feel it could come to you and the opposition bashing heads in a fight.
Same with resting.
Though, don't take my word for it, i'd rather someone confirmed what i was saying is right, this is justhow i percieved that/those particular rules.
_________________ Ael'thil Rilyn'tlithar Previously known as: Anubis
7. If you do not give the other party time to observe the usual protocol, you can't expect them to stick to the protocol. This means that by resting, buffing or other such preperations to hostility, you forfeit your right to a warning: The other party may attack you immediately to stop you. If you have not set them to Hostile before, you can't blame them for having to act without it. Both parties should strive to set eachother to Hostile after the immediate reaction, however.
If you start buffing, the other person has the right to immediately attack you without setting Hostile. Sometimes I buff in a hostile situation, but I consider it the IC equivalent of drawing a weapon and starting to load it. At best it's an open declaration of my willingness and ability to try to kill them, and at worst it means I'm about to actually do it.
If someone else starts buffing in front of me, it makes me decide right then whether the confrontation will end in violence or not.
Last edited by StandingBehindYou on Sun, Apr 26 2009, 0:57 AM, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: 02 Feb 2009 Location: Netherlands, Schoonhoven
Well here's one I've been encoutering more and more with characters.
I'm in a town, surrounded by guards and a player wants to kill me. There is no DM or players acting as guards. And the player is intend on killing me with little warning and certainly no way out (except if I started running faster then him, which well... I don't intend on/have need to)
Is he allowed to attack me? And what if it comes to blows and I end up killing him?
I'm in a town, surrounded by guards and a player wants to kill me. There is no DM or players acting as guards. And the player is intend on killing me with little warning and certainly no way out (except if I started running faster then him, which well... I don't intend on/have need to)
3. You must give the other party a reasonable chance to back down from the PvP In Character. [...] 5. You must give the other party clear IC indication of your intentions to attack, and make sure they have reasonable time to react and possibly back down IC.
That by itself would mean no, he is not allowed to attack you without giving you clear notice of his intention, an IC out, and reasonable time in which to take it.
As to whether attacking you would count as metagaming the guards, I would be inclined to think so, but can't immediately point to a post saying that.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
If he attacks you in the town, screeney and send to a DM, as that is metagaming the guards and illegal. If you kill him, you will not be in trouble, and still send the screeney.
Uberuce wrote:
Yurell wrote:
Does this mean that if there's hostile RP and they start buffing, we can just attack without setting them to hostile?
No. Don't just attack them; kill them. And get ready to dust their friends too, if they don't run away.
Is my favourite part.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
يمكنني استخدام مترجم جوجل
Last edited by Yurell on Sun, Apr 26 2009, 1:07 AM, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Short of being say, a surfacer in Ultrinnan, a banite wandering around Kohl, or a pally having tea in tarkuul, cases where obviously the guards would support someone of that town attikng the bad guy/surfacer/good guy, then ignoring guards is metagaming, period.
If you are a flag waving banite who walks into kohl and starts preaching teh bad word, telling stories of the massacres of children you've participated in, a defender or such pretty much would have full rights to engage you in appropriate pre-pvp rp, then to attack you. YOU, however, as the banite, would have absolutely no right to initiate pvp, because you are the one in the wrong place.
(technically, you'd be metagming the guards even by being in those places and doing those things, even without pvp...but you get the point).
There's a whole wide world out there. Use it. Fighting in towns with no dm's or player guards, is rule breaking.
_________________ Role with the Punches...
Elan: A 10% chance is pretty unlikely, but everyone knows that a one-in-a-million chance is a sure thing!
Scenario: You are a high level (20+) character, minding your own business, chatting to friends, etc. A low level (Anywhere below 15) character comes up to you. They harass you, your friends, and make crude remarks. You warn them to stop. They don't. You warn them again, they still don't. You now draw your blades and say it one more time, and they respond with the same lack of sense that put them into this situation.
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you (censored)." , or words to that effect.
If you ask me, the other character is the one initiating the PvP.
I don't see why you should be the one to give him/her a way out since he/she is the one doing trash talk.
IC trashtalk is grounds for instant smite.
OOC trashtalk is grounds for instant ban.
Scenario: You are a high level (20+) character, minding your own business, chatting to friends, etc. A low level (Anywhere below 15) character comes up to you. They harass you, your friends, and make crude remarks. You warn them to stop. They don't. You warn them again, they still don't. You now draw your blades and say it one more time, and they respond with the same lack of sense that put them into this situation.
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you (censored)." , or words to that effect.
If you ask me, the other character is the one initiating the PvP. I don't see why you should be the one to give him/her a way out since he/she is the one doing trash talk.
IC trashtalk is grounds for instant smite. OOC trashtalk is grounds for instant ban.
Completely agree on both sides being the trash talker ICly and being the trash talkie.
_________________ Lieutenant Belalad Feiwallyan
((Please take note if you PM me and you are ignored resend to me in 1-3days, it is likely due to not realizing I got mail))
You are a high level (20+) character, minding your own business, chatting to friends, etc. A low level (Anywhere below 15) character comes up to you. They harass you, your friends, and make crude remarks. You warn them to stop. They don't. You warn them again, they still don't. You now draw your blades and say it one more time, and they respond with the same lack of sense that put them into this situation.
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you (censored)." , or words to that effect.
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
its just like a guy with his buddies get verbally abused by some skinny pumpkin head and these guys pull guns to kill the skinny pumpkin head.
the appropriate response is to emote grappling the guy and take him away with your buff abilities. it doesn't matter who he is, if 5 people are grabbing at him, he'll be forced to submit. if he refuses to comply, tell DMs.
also, the player should spazz out OOC over RP. if he does that, fuck him.
_________________
Moridan_X wrote:
I liek Jean Ortega as a character because it shows that everyone can be different. I also don't think we should incorporate mean behavior in video games.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
Moridan_X wrote:
Quote:
You are a high level (20+) character, minding your own business, chatting to friends, etc. A low level (Anywhere below 15) character comes up to you. They harass you, your friends, and make crude remarks. You warn them to stop. They don't. You warn them again, they still don't. You now draw your blades and say it one more time, and they respond with the same lack of sense that put them into this situation.
Suddenly, the lower level character calls OOCly "You are just an Epic wanting to PVP a lowbie!", "I'm sick of always getting killed by you (censored)." , or words to that effect.
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
its just like a guy with his buddies get verbally abused by some skinny pumpkin head and these guys pull guns to kill the skinny pumpkin head.
the appropriate response is to emote grappling the guy and take him away with your buff abilities. it doesn't matter who he is, if 5 people are grabbing at him, he'll be forced to submit. if he refuses to comply, tell DMs.
also, the player should spazz out OOC over RP. if he does that, (censored) him.
Why? Your char knows he'll be back in, at the longest, four hours by empirical evidence, and since simply beating the crap out of him as no long-term effects (no effect at all thanks to the availability of healing potions beyond the short-term satisfaction you can also get by killing them), why not kill?
I know it depends on the character, but I know my evil drow will not put up with some elf continually insulting her for example - the elf will become a corpse very quickly.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
Frankly, you are generalizing. What you say might be true for the reaction of some PC's but entirely the wrong response for others.
Some of my PC's would engage you in a thoughtful discussion about your choice of words, another would knife you in the back the second you turned around, while another might get right in your face and demand an immediate apology that might include licking their boots *or else*.
In other words, there is no "right" response.
_________________ Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
Rras is polishing his gem collection with his friends in the wilderness.
JoeBlow10: Dragons suck!
Rras: ..Shut up and go away..
JoeBlow10: Haha Lizardbreath, what'sa matter, daddy wasn't good enough to find a lizard and had to find some elf?!
Rras: Go away or I'll kill you. /pvp-wand
JoeBlow10: Haha! Overgrown suit-c..
Rras: *RRRRRRGHRHRHGNGHG MUNCH!*
He gives a very serious warning making no mistake that if they push the issue its gonna result in death, or 'Red-dragonish rage', and I hostile them.
There are some exemptions: Certain friends, and children, and -some- crazies.
_________________ Dwagin [Duh-wa-GIN] N. - 1a. Small and cute thingum, particularly fond of four legged scaled creatures of the metalic and chromatic varieties.
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
I totally agree in real life. But there have been some real societies in which killing someone for insulting someone's honor would be seen as appropriate behavior, and some characters might just be vicious.
Quote:
the appropriate response is to emote grappling the guy and take him away with your buff abilities.
According to this page, if you kill the other person, you get to determine whether you killed them or just subdued them. The person killed doesn't get to decide.
http://www.amiaworld.net/about/pvp.html wrote:
The PvP settings determine what happens when you 'kill' somebody in a fight. The setting of the killer is the one that matters, and the victim (m/f) does NOT determine the outcome of the fight, neither ICly or OOCly.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
StandingBehindYou wrote:
Moridan_X wrote:
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
I totally agree in real life. But there have been some real societies in which killing someone for insulting someone's honor would be seen as appropriate behavior, and some characters might just be vicious.
Quote:
the appropriate response is to emote grappling the guy and take him away with your buff abilities.
According to this page, if you kill the other person, you get to determine whether you killed them or just subdued them. The person killed doesn't get to decide.
http://www.amiaworld.net/about/pvp.html wrote:
The PvP settings determine what happens when you 'kill' somebody in a fight. The setting of the killer is the one that matters, and the victim (m/f) does NOT determine the outcome of the fight, neither ICly or OOCly.
Yup, so you can 'kill' them and just emote it as tackling him to the ground, beating him senseless, slicing him in half ... whatever goes.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
frankly i agree with the lower level. you shouldn't kill someone because they insult your character, that is just absurd.
I totally agree in real life. But there have been some real societies in which killing someone for insulting someone's honor would be seen as appropriate behavior, and some characters might just be vicious.
Quote:
the appropriate response is to emote grappling the guy and take him away with your buff abilities.
This may not be the best example, but say a Gansta, one in a powerful position got insulted by someone who he saw as a no mark, they'd demand respect, and likely beat them senseless to scare the *Censored* out of them, they may still not respect the Gansta, but they'll deffinately think twice about disrespecting them again.
They'd do this because they wouldn't want people thinking they're soft, or going soft, losing their touch. So, they use fear to force respect, the same could be said for certain characters in similar positions.
_________________ Ael'thil Rilyn'tlithar Previously known as: Anubis
This may not be the best example, but say a Gansta, one in a powerful position got insulted by someone who he saw as a no mark, they'd demand respect, and likely beat them senseless to scare the *Censored* out of them, they may still not respect the Gansta, but they'll deffinately think twice about disrespecting them again.
They'd do this because they wouldn't want people thinking they're soft, or going soft, losing their touch. So, they use fear to force respect, the same could be said for certain characters in similar positions.
I entirely agree. I wouldn't call gangsters "good people," but that doesn't mean it can't be IC for a character to act in that manner.
What if the confrontation occurs outside a city, in the wilderness, and one character approaches a large party and starts smack talking or threatening them IC. The party's characters decide to initiate pvp.
What the large party doesnt know is that this antagonist's friends are all invisible or stealthed nearby, watching, and when pvp starts the concealed allies smoke said party. Does this impact on the rules regarding pvp?
_________________ Vaylek - The Worst Guy Pu Liu - Descendant of the Great River Dragon
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
I'm not sure how legal that is ... it sort of hovers on the border, since the invisible people didn't RP. However, their party member is being attacked.
I think we'd need (or I'd like) a DM decision on that one.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
I would just kill them anyway send em a combat warning ignore their complaints and use everyone of my epic spells that i have on them just to piss em off more. Thats what you should do *nods*
Was about to say its called setting an ambush. Sorta like in my view whenever about to do pvp with a drow assume there is another either invisible or hidden near by. If you are just cocky and assume it is three on one then realize it is five on three shame on you.
_________________ Lieutenant Belalad Feiwallyan
((Please take note if you PM me and you are ignored resend to me in 1-3days, it is likely due to not realizing I got mail))
I agree with you, but I would feel much safer with DM confirmation, as it does seem a little rocky.
Rocky indeed. An explicit ruling either way would pander to either carebears or griefers.
It'd be a bad rule that you were required to say "//Oh, before we continue, I've got buddies in stealth behind me" while the verbal PvP was ongoing. Like the CR ratings, it'd be such a great metagaming tool that it'd genuinely make it harder to stay honest, and of course if you weren't even trying, then you're laughing.
Conversely, I'd not want to endorse this kind of assclownery as a DM. As a very broad rule of thumb, if something doesn't gain anything ICly for your character, but is OOCly funny at someone else's expense, then it's probably griefing. Waiting until your friend is being whupped doesn't make much sense compared to popping out of stealth in obviously overwhelming numbers and deterring the fight. Peace through superior firepower, and all that.
So I'd not expect a firm rule. I'd also not expect a group that went around as five epic Shadowdancers and one lowbie loudmouth and whupped midlevels all day to last very long. They'd find themselves 'stumbling upon' the Annual Law Knight Hiking Trip or something as lulzsy as that. Every day till they took the hint.
See, my problem with the situation I originally mentioned is this:
My IC response to that is to stab the idiot in the face.
My OOC response is to walk away, so that no more problems come from it.
But that query seems to be answered now. Stab in the face it is.
_________________ Aravain, Champion of Song. Anar, a dark elf. Giovanni, Blood Knight.
What the large party doesnt know is that this antagonist's friends are all invisible or stealthed nearby, watching, and when pvp starts the concealed allies smoke said party. Does this impact on the rules regarding pvp?
As long as the hidden members set to hostile, no rules are broken.
There is no rule that says reinforcements are disallowed.
If you couldn't see the trap, it just means your WIS isn't high enough
That kind of escalation is almost certain, and indeed I do it myself; there simply isn't time to type out that kind of warning when things are about to kick off, so I just stand shoulder to shoulder with my buddy and hope people guess what that means, especially since I click Hostile as early as I can. I tend to assume everyone not in my party is allied to the people I'm fighting. If they so much as breathe funny I drop them.
It does occasionally ruffle some feathers, but every argument that's been conducted afterwards has gone as follows:
Them: You killed me without any RP, I'm going to get you banned.
Me: Sorry about that, I can't tell who's in whose party, so I just click everyone blue to red off the party list and hope they take the hint
Them: Well, I was only watching.
Me: You were standing right in the middle of a mass brawl.
Them: That isn't an RP reason to kill me
Me: If you were standing in the street and a riot broke out, and the cops showed up with the horses and batons, would you stand there in the middle of the road and watch, or would you get the hell out the way?
Them: I'm going to get you banned, you PvP powergamer.
Me: Answer the question.
Them: Just because you've got that stupid RDD powerbuild doesn't mean you have to kill everyone
Me: Answer the question. And, please, go tell the DMs IAmUberuce killed you with his RDD. Your credibility will be amazingly high with them.
Them: Fine, I'd get out the street.
Me: So would I. Me riot cop. You dressed like rioter. Me hit you with baton. The RP reason *was* that you were standing there. Your IC get-out *was* the time that I spent killing them that I did *not* spend killing you.
Them: I wasn't going to fight though!
Me: And how would my character know that?
Them: [PvP, RDD, powergamer, banned]
Me: If this happens again, I promise you I'll do it the exact same way.
What Ruce said, I guess. Setting Hostile is also the responsibility of the attackers (from stealth or otherwise). This can be done through the player list, even if it's a bit awkward in big fights, so you don't have to break stealth.
I'd love to say common senses applies, but that's not very helpful. If Kalliniel walks into a scene with baddies attacking an elf, he's pretty much duty-bound to step in and help the elf. Granted, I type fairly quick and would probably emote something akin to *Seeing the plight of his kinsman, the bladesinger raises an eerie song and a slender blade, dancing furiously into the fray* or whatever. If you PvP in public, I reckon it's safe to assume you might face more foes than you expected.
_________________
On Joon, Kjetta wrote:
The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
If someone attacks Stillborn... well. He deserve to die. If not for anything else then for pure stupidity, if that was Uberuce character in the scenario. You got to choose your fights too. I have no hesitation when someone atacks me with no RP around. I just chop them down, and when they complain and say I'll get banned, I just shrug and move on. It was never my fight anyway. I didn't choose it even though I ended it.
I suppose the situations Iron and Ruce described mean the neutral party should ICly indicate they're not up for a fight, if they stand in close proximity of a potential (or full-blown) fight and have no intention to join in for either side. That wouldn't save you from the riot police (been there, done that), but should be understood by most players.
Here are a couple I'd like some RP input/advice on:
1). You are a PC that clearly hates and is IC bound to destroy Undead. You are fighting goblins(low level). Another PC appears before you and summons a Mummy or something. You say "you must release them" or something. They say "Ha ha, No! *sticks middle finger up*". You say "if you refuse I must release them, I must destroy that form". The reasons for and lead up to PvP are clear.
For your PC to 'walk away' would be severely OOC and should cause you to be abandoned by your god. So, you IC must attack and attempt to destroy the summon, even if your death is almost assured. What to do? The PC responsible for the summon is quite aware, both IC and OOC, that you must fight. Their awareness of you level is however, undoubtedly OOC. Indofar as the initiation of PvP goes, who is to blame?
2). You are in a party traveling through the wilderness. One of you party members has an arch-enemy whom appears and begins PvP initiating RP. You emote *puts hands clear of scabbeded weapons and steps back*, the arch-enemy sets you to hostile anyway. What to do? I believe there is a degree of 'poker face' involved here. I say this as I have used this same emote as a ploy to appear non-hostile and have then attacked and killed.
Is it bad form here to send a Tell saying that you clearly have no intention to attack if this is really the case? Would it be polite to roll a bluff check against a wisdom stat.(not bloody spot) in this situation or could that be inverse meta-gaming?
EDIT: If someone (indicates above post) has a character named Stillborn I would request humbly that they be allowed to rename it. That is a horribly crass name and I find it very, very offensive.
Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Location: ANU, behind the coffee mug (+10 GMT)
The Incognitos wrote:
Here are a couple I'd like some RP input/advice on:
1). You are a PC that clearly hates and is IC bound to destroy Undead. You are fighting goblins(low level). Another PC appears before you and summons a Mummy or something. You say "you must release them" or something. They say "Ha ha, No! *sticks middle finger up*". You say "if you refuse I must release them, I must destroy that form". The reasons for and lead up to PvP are clear.
For your PC to 'walk away' would be severely OOC and should cause you to be abandoned by your god. So, you IC must attack and attempt to destroy the summon, even if your death is almost assured. What to do? The PC responsible for the summon is quite aware, both IC and OOC, that you must fight. Their awareness of you level is however, undoubtedly OOC. Indofar as the initiation of PvP goes, who is to blame?
2). You are in a party traveling through the wilderness. One of you party members has an arch-enemy whom appears and begins PvP initiating RP. You emote *puts hands clear of scabbeded weapons and steps back*, the arch-enemy sets you to hostile anyway. What to do? I believe there is a degree of 'poker face' involved here. I say this as I have used this same emote as a ploy to appear non-hostile and have then attacked and killed.
Is it bad form here to send a Tell saying that you clearly have no intention to attack if this is really the case? Would it be polite to roll a bluff check against a wisdom stat.(not bloody spot) in this situation or could that be inverse meta-gaming?
For the first, I think it is justified to walk away (or fight to your death if you wish) ... I doubt you are going to Fall for not mindlessly throwing yourself to annihilation, sine you stand as much chance as if you had slit your own wrists anyway.
For the second, if you emote something like that, and they set you to hostile, I think it reasonable to use the PvP tool to set them back, sending a tell you are not involved in this.
_________________ 2009's Second Most Overall Contributing Player
Here are a couple I'd like some RP input/advice on:
1). You are a PC that clearly hates and is IC bound to destroy Undead. You are fighting goblins(low level). Another PC appears before you and summons a Mummy or something. You say "you must release them" or something. They say "Ha ha, No! *sticks middle finger up*". You say "if you refuse I must release them, I must destroy that form". The reasons for and lead up to PvP are clear.
For your PC to 'walk away' would be severely OOC and should cause you to be abandoned by your god. So, you IC must attack and attempt to destroy the summon, even if your death is almost assured. What to do? The PC responsible for the summon is quite aware, both IC and OOC, that you must fight. Their awareness of you level is however, undoubtedly OOC. Indofar as the initiation of PvP goes, who is to blame?
When I was the lowbie in that situation, I gave my customary explanation: that if they would not unsummon the creature, I would attack. They way I saw it, the other player was totally within their rights to splat my character.
However, in general, people I met weren't particularly interested in PvP -- not that there would be anything wrong with that -- and ended the situation in ways that avoided it. I don't think I recall anyone trying to find an excuse to kill my character as a lowbie. The incident I recall the most clearly is when an epic mage laughed in my character's face and said something to the effect of "You're not worth my time, " then cast Greater Sanctuary and walked off.
At all levels, regardless of relative power, I often found confrontations that began in that manner ending in unexpected ways. (I won't relay them all here, because I think it would cheapen the excellent RP I saw if it just ended up being a list of potential responses.) But people will often get around the situation without splatting you.
And if they do kill you, so what? Respawn, dust yourself off, and RP that someone dragged your body back to the Temple of Waukeen. Angst about it IC or and rail about the foul necromancers menacing the lands, if appropriate, but it's nothing to get bothered over OOC.
If someone (indicates above post) has a character named Stillborn I would request humbly that they be allowed to rename it. That is a horribly crass name and I find it very, very offensive.
If someone (indicates above post) has a character named Stillborn I would request humbly that they be allowed to rename it. That is a horribly crass name and I find it very, very offensive.
I can write you a nice IC reason to be called Hitler if you like. It will still be a very offensive name to some people, for their reasons. I would put this name in the same category. There may well be things here beyond your experience but the fact remains that it is, to some, a very disturbing name to see running around the server. This isn't a demand, it is a request on what I can only call humanitarian grounds.
I agree with you, but I would feel much safer with DM confirmation, as it does seem a little rocky.
Rocky indeed. An explicit ruling either way would pander to either carebears or griefers.
It'd be a bad rule that you were required to say "//Oh, before we continue, I've got buddies in stealth behind me" while the verbal PvP was ongoing. Like the CR ratings, it'd be such a great metagaming tool that it'd genuinely make it harder to stay honest, and of course if you weren't even trying, then you're laughing.
Conversely, I'd not want to endorse this kind of assclownery as a DM. As a very broad rule of thumb, if something doesn't gain anything ICly for your character, but is OOCly funny at someone else's expense, then it's probably griefing. Waiting until your friend is being whupped doesn't make much sense compared to popping out of stealth in obviously overwhelming numbers and deterring the fight. Peace through superior firepower, and all that.
So I'd not expect a firm rule. I'd also not expect a group that went around as five epic Shadowdancers and one lowbie loudmouth and whupped midlevels all day to last very long. They'd find themselves 'stumbling upon' the Annual Law Knight Hiking Trip or something as lulzsy as that. Every day till they took the hint.
Hehe...........nice.....
_________________ "Never ascribe to malice, that which can be explained by incompetence" ~ Napoleon Bonaparte. - Clearly, Napoleon never envisioned the Internet......where I'd judge it about 50/50.
Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Location: Down South and Bent Edge
Transitions question.
Mr Manly Elf was striding through the forest of Wazzit, when three Big Black Clad Borks come out and confront him. The usual i kill you banter goes on and Mr. Manly Elf decides to stab one to gain the initiative and then to run away, so Mr Manly Elf runs north from the forest of Wazzit to the Pass of Whosethat, going over a transition on the journey. The Borks give chase etc etc etc and the wiley Mr Manly Elf picks them off one by one.
Now i've been told multiple times that using the transitions is against the rules which i find silly. I understand if your an asshat and assualt a character immediately as they exit to get an advantage but if your literally running for your life, stringing out folk and picking them of doesn't seem to me to be out of context.
_________________ I play: Gage le Gris Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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