AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - Rule change

HellScourge wrote:

And to the whole rule, banning cybering and pedophilia is ok for me, I never saw Amia as a place where I could let my libido rampage.

The torture stuff however is a bit more tricky for me, I was part of some good banite Rp which was gory and through the descriptions could I express better how my character did feel and how she cringed and such while she was subject to this torture.
And I was having a blast, when the rule was enforced that you need to ask for consent was that good too with me, people who were up for it could RP it, others just said no and all were happy.
Another occasion involved Drow torture, not gory either in my opinion (YMMV) but definitely squick stuff for people.
And then was I the torturer once too with exact the same stuff, just a bit varied, where someone else than (The torturee) posted the gorey stuff.

Out right banning it however seems counterproductive to me, not only do we take one of the major things away that made certain people so special

My thoughts too.

Auron went through some rather painful process that was so cunningly played by the other player involved that it helped me have a better dimension of the pain he was feeling and then from there I could work to know how it would affect him.

It was not gorey, it didn't have rich details... but the reasoning behind it was what made me stop and think about his personality.

I am going to write about it soon enough. I'm just trying to find the right words. ;)

Character development is always great.

EDIT: I think that it is the kind of package that Yossarin was looking for. :P.

jameslocke wrote:

Formerly we allowed cybering in tells, but had a "cybering is bad" mentality. Now there's less confusion because we've set a rule that can be clearly pointed to. Will that stop people from tickling each others tonsils? Of course not, but it makes it easier to punish when we catch it.

how would you catch it? are you guys monitoring the tell channel as well?

"...he asked inconspicuously."

Last edited by Pony on Tue, Nov 05 2019, 12:27 PM, edited 1 time in total.

aurelius311 wrote:

jameslocke wrote:

Formerly we allowed cybering in tells, but had a "cybering is bad" mentality. Now there's less confusion because we've set a rule that can be clearly pointed to. Will that stop people from tickling each others tonsils? Of course not, but it makes it easier to punish when we catch it.

how would you catch it? are you guys monitoring the tell channel as well?

We look for the same thing as before: the visible signs, such as two people sitting in a corner quietly, with or without clothes.

Arelith actually makes logfiles of the tellchannel. What prevents two players to sit in a corner, do kosher RP on the tell channel and talk about the weather or the last drama they had.. and cyber in tells?

hendrack wrote:

Arelith actually makes logfiles of the tellchannel. What prevents two players to sit in a corner, do kosher RP on the tell channel and talk about the weather or the last drama they had.. and cyber in tells?

Of course, this is violating RP as well as the rules.

Last edited by Delarwyn on Mon, Feb 16 2009, 17:39 PM, edited 4 times in total.

Nekhy wrote:

Well, if enough regular wankers and others who want to cyber for the sake of character development announce themselves, I promise to negotiate a cooperation agreement with Kinky Kingdom to cater to your entertainment needs.

Wooooo.. I actually laughed at it. I never went there Nehky, it seems a bit too heavy for my taste... but, some people seem to enjoy it and don't even need cooperation between sites.

Now, my characters are sexually active and they touch boobies and parts before fading to black. All in talks and I believe most of the DMs had read that. I try to make it fun for all and I know the people I rp with such things well enough to know about their mind, age and willingness. They are actually mostly characters of one person with really rare happenings with other person. I think sexuality is fun to play with. I do say boobies a lot and just today I told Nas in tells that if he tried to hide in my boobies he would disappear and no one would see him. That was a joke, I never rped romance with Nas, he is my friend and we joke about stuff all the time. He is the most innocent pervert I know. It actually got screened by someone.

With one single player I rp such things for a couple of years and I know him well enough oocly and everyone here would know what I am talking about. I dont hide it, but I dont make it gross either. I just like sexy jokes and rp, always liked it But, nothing that would go against the server rules.. or at least I dont think they do.

I dislike torture, but I wouldnt mind whipping, hitting the head on the wall, burning, cutting or whatever in a rp torture that makes sense. I do have a weak stomach and I may get a bit ewww if it goes too far. But, I will say that. Never happened though. I hate Pedophilia and I would leave any situation involving it. I may even look at a player differently if I see such thing happening.

But, I do get worried if I am rping some sexy thing and the person at my side goes afk or too quiet and I will ask the person to say something, so DMs wont think I am cybering or something. <.<

I dont know if what I say or rp is against the rules or not, I dont think they are. I actually got dced by try seducing someone once, with a quite straightforward approach and being refused..

So, I guess I am fine..

hendrack wrote:

Arelith actually makes logfiles of the tellchannel. What prevents two players to sit in a corner, do kosher RP on the tell channel and talk about the weather or the last drama they had.. and cyber in tells?

That, actually, was the purposeful loophole of the previous rules. We only didn't allow visible cybering (aka, sitting in the corner quiet), but people didn't quite get the loophole very tactfully put in there and did it the visible way regardless. Visible, aka, sitting in the corner naked. It's funny, it was defined as the visible way and still people didn't quite get it.

Alas, thanks to all those who didn't understand the subtle hint in the rules, now the rules have changed!

There have been a number of times where I've been doing 1 on 1 perfectly legit RP with another Drow player who has had to go AFK for a while. At the time we are likely in a corner, whispering, and locked in a room that no one is likely to find.

In this sort of situation, a DM could easily come across the two players, watch for 5 minutes, see nothing, and assume they are cybering. Is there a way to prevent this?

And I know someone's going to say 'Yeah, don't go AFK.', well yeah sure whilst it's that simple, people may not realise that they will be gone for some time. For example, random bricks through their window IRL, baby crying, called by parents, person at door, phone goes... The type of thing you respond to immediately.

Tell us that if we ask you about it.

That's fine then. ^^

Wyjyn: Loving all of you (and above all Disco) since 11 Jan 2007.

Will you be logging tells and reading through them?

Don't care about the rule changes, always thought those were the rules anyway. However, I do not support at all people reading through tells.

No, we won't.

Yes, I believe that was a unanimous "no" in our discussion.

As has been stated before, this is a rules clarification more than a change. When trying to prosecute the original wording of the rule, players pointed to something specifically and expressed confusion. So we've taken that and made it crystal clear.

Nothing is really going to change from how it has been. Cybering will still occur on the server as it always has, but now in the instances when we see it, we can more easily explain/prosecute the boot. There is no war on cybering at all, for none of us are prudes with a moralistic rationale.

As far as boobs being on a poll, we DMs don't put boobs in our polls. We really don't need any more boobs than we already have.

Yes, it's our

U.niting and S.trengthening A.mia by P.roviding A.ppropriate T.ools R.equired to I.ntercept and O.bstruct T.orture Act of 2009.

I am quite loyal but I wouldn't work on a tell spying system, unanimous vote or not (well, obviously it wouldn't be unanimous because I wouldn't vote for it myself). It's both wrong and a waste of time and effort.

Yups, we got enough boobs in the staff. We especially don't need any more of those boobs that do not come in pairs.

Nekhy wrote:

Yups, we got enough boobs in the staff. We especially don't need any more of those boobs that do not come in pairs.

Beg your pardon?

Obviously, we cannot fully enforce the rule. That was one strong argument against banning these kind of things on the Tell channel. However, the primary virtue of a rule is not to be enforcable, but to be justified. We are consistent, and we make a statement of how we want Amia to be.

And personally, I couldn't think of any justification for giving cyberers and sadists special priviledges in regards to what they can do. No other type of RP had permission to happen exclusively on the Tell channel. On a role-playing server, it just makes no sense. Like, at all. When your character is standing in Cordor, he's standing in Cordor. He's not having sex with some chick on an imaginary plane of existance. And everybody sees what he's doing. You're not allowed to sit in the Nomad and pretend you're sneaking into Ultrinnan to talk with a captive in the temple cells, either. Or run around grinding the Abyss and claim your character is actually teaching children in the orphanage.

If something's determined unwanted on Amia in public (and I doubt more than a few here would want cybering public), there's just absolutely no need to give it special permission to happen half-OOCly in private, either. Amia is meant for public role-playing which anyone can (theoretically) be a part of.

For me, it eventually boiled down to either it being alright on Amia, or not. (Even if I was dead-set against a black-and-white either-or at first.) Theoretically, allowing cybering and excessive gore in public would have been another justified, consistent option, but it's simply not how we want to run the server. If we accepted the notion that while it's not acceptable in public, it's OK if it's just between two consenting adults, we should just as well accept, say, twinking or telepathy that involved only two consenting adults. By definition, the DMs restrict the freedom of players, there's nothing new there, and this was an option we mostly felt was consistent with the other freedoms players get and in keeping with the way we want Amia to be. Or that's my view on it, at least.

It was an addendum to Yossi's comment.

Phearnun wrote:

Or perhaps you can just assume it when two people sit naked next to eachother not talking for an hour in a closed room in the hin inn?

if you cyber naked you deserve to get done.

I have nothing at all against the rules. I think it protects the young players and the players that dislikes such things. I think Amia is a good environment to young players because of such rules. I wouldn't feel comfortable if I walk into someone doing things in talk and such...
So thumbs up for the restrictions.

It's not just for young players, either. I know I wouldn't want to read how you drill your patient with no anaesthesia when I'm hopping around areas on the DM Client, or even stumbling on such a scene playerside. I doubt anyone wants that, save for a few oddballs.

.... you are suggesting you ask the dentist for a shot before he drills your teetch?

Something tells me that getting your teeth drilled would be less painful than say.. a troll tearing your arm off. Or a cleric IMPLODING you. Yes, I think having all my bones shatter as they crumple into the central mass of my rapidly collapsing body would be quite painful. Also being slowly roasted by Combustion.

Halen_Van wrote:

Something tells me that getting your teeth drilled would be less painful than say.. a troll tearing your arm off.

Most probably since you get some painkiller, or it is not that bad. Loosing an arm however is painful.

Halen_Van wrote:

Or a cleric IMPLODING you. Yes, I think having all my bones shatter as they crumple into the central mass of my rapidly collapsing body would be quite painful.

I though that was one of the quickest ways to die, safe for Finger of death and wail of the banshee. It happens sof ast that you die instantly.

Halen_Van wrote:

Also being slowly roasted by Combustion.

And once more being a Tiefling, or having a ring of Goruth or how the god of fire is spelled, pays itself of. Natural fire resistance. Bring out your torches ladies, a Tiefling can only chuckle at the weak attempts of being burned.

Nairas wrote:

There have been a number of times where I've been doing 1 on 1 perfectly legit RP with another Drow player who has had to go AFK for a while. At the time we are likely in a corner, whispering, and locked in a room that no one is likely to find.

-That- Reminds me of a funny occasion. I was Rping, my partner had to go afk and I randomly said:
Me //For any DM watching, we are not cybering, he had to go afk.
DM: //ok

DM Tell: I just ported in there and then you said it, how did you know I was there?
Me Tell: Talk about strange timing. O.o

*Points and laughs at the creepy cyberers*

My recollection of the reasoning behind the last two rule revisions was that the DM team did not want cybering in public channels because young people play here and nobody wished to offend the ubiquitous 10 year-old SD lurking in the corner. So it had to be restricted to Tells.

Nekhy wrote:

We only didn't allow visible cybering (aka, sitting in the corner quiet), but people didn't quite get the loophole very tactfully put in there and did it the visible way regardless.

It was then argued that two people sitting naked in a corner bonking each other in Tells was a waste of server slots because they were not contributing anything to the server as a whole during their intimate moments. So the rule was amended to say that you could do it it Tells so long as you had some 'legitimate' RP occurring in the public channels.

IronAngel wrote:

If we accepted the notion that while it's not acceptable in public, it's OK if it's just between two consenting adults, we should just as well accept, say, twinking or telepathy that involved only two consenting adults.

This is the most rational explanation I have yet seen for the rule change (other than 'because we say so'). It still doesnt change the fact that the only reason two different things may have been happening at the same time (cybering in Tells vs. RPing in public channels) was because the rules had been changed to make it impermissable.

Yossarin wrote:

Nothing is really going to change from how it has been. Cybering will still occur on the server as it always has, but now in the instances when we see it, we can more easily explain/prosecute the boot.

If this is so, I dont really see what the recent revision accomplishes. We already have a rule to deal with extended AFKers (query then boot). The only difference is that the cyberer can presumably answer back, given that they're not actually AFK. Is this any different than someone not RPing for 15 minutes because they're reorganizing their inventory? (And no, I wouldnt condone as acceptable an hour of 'reorganizing' naked in the company of a friend twice a day.

)

What I want to know is, then, are the DMs going to be handing out bans to people who sit quietly without saying anything for more than some number of minutes, with or without clothing, on the assumption that they are engaging in a bannable activity (which cybering has previously been defined as)?

If I'm being a wee bit sarcastic about this, it's because I think that the only people who will be affected by this are slow typers who cant multitask well enough to carry on two different conversations at once. I condone reasonable efforts to make the server accessible to young people without exposing them to (too many) things that they (or anyone else, for that matter) might find offensive but I feel that the previous incarnation of the rule did a good job of straddling the line between freedom and 'public decency'.

I think that it's a step backwards rather than forwards because it accomplishes nothing of significance, but I'm not going to voice my personal opinion more than I already have because it's already been decided. I accept that the DM team has the right to change the rules and I acknowledge the DM team's decision.

Nairas wrote:

There have been a number of times where I've been doing 1 on 1 perfectly legit RP with another Drow player who has had to go AFK for a while. At the time we are likely in a corner, whispering, and locked in a room that no one is likely to find.

In this sort of situation, a DM could easily come across the two players, watch for 5 minutes, see nothing, and assume they are cybering. Is there a way to prevent this?

And I know someone's going to say 'Yeah, don't go AFK.', well yeah sure whilst it's that simple, people may not realise that they will be gone for some time. For example, random bricks through their window IRL, baby crying, called by parents, person at door, phone goes... The type of thing you respond to immediately.

When I find myself in one such situation, I send a warning on the DM channel, whether or not there is a DM on. If the player will delay to come back from AFKness, I will just send a Tell to said player saying I went to do something else and that RP was put on stand-by.

I am that paranoid.

it never even occured to me that when someone is AFK, a passerby might think that. perverts.

aurelius311 wrote:

it never even occured to me that when someone is AFK, a passerby might think that. perverts.

I think that everyone will think that of me, so I say "//waiting for him/her to return" every couple of minutes wit some of my chars. Other's are just to adorable to expect that (and married!).

Xaviera wrote:

What I want to know is, then, are the DMs going to be handing out bans to people who sit quietly without saying anything for more than some number of minutes, with or without clothing, on the assumption that they are engaging in a bannable activity (which cybering has previously been defined as)

If I don't have any evidence that two people are cybering, they won't be banned. Suspicion isn't a good enough reason to ban someone. I reserve the right to create an awkward or unpleasant IC situation if I suspect some players are going at it in tells. That's my way of saying, "If you were cybering, knock it off."

I only have one thing to add....

Look at the classic horror/suspense movies, the ones in black and white. The old Vincent Price stuff... or Alfred Hitchcock. None of their stuff was gory. What made them classics is the art of the storytelling and the implied. If you tell someone exactly what they see, their mind has no room to make it's own conclusion.

For that matter, it can go for Cybering, too. There were days where it was incredibly taboo for a woman to even show her stomach on screen, much less any of the things that they do now. Yet, there were great love movies that left more implied than the actually showed. Some Like It Hot with Marilyn Monroe springs to mind. The scene where she first comes over and says her A/C is out..... *begins to pant*..... granted, it's Marilyn, the definition of the words glamorous and sexy, but still.

So, for gore and blood.... it doesn't really change all that much. Playing my drow Ilharess for my entire time on Amia, I can honestly say that I think I've had to ask player's to tone it down maybe once since the rule was first changed years ago.

Cyber.... well, I've only got this to say: They make a product called a Fleshlight. To those that wish to cyber with what is most likely another guy should first purchase one of these products and try to use it vigorously while looking at this:

.... this is probably the person on the other side of the screen who you just had a wonderful round of "Hide the sausage" with.

If that doesn't solve your need to cyber, then you should really see a therapist.

Are you telling me people roleplayed sex without casting darkness and spamming the vioce set? thats way more satisfying than anything you can type. serious the vioce sets are hialrious.. yet the one character who has the vioce set for it never actually does it, ah the irony.

That poor poor chair

IronAngel wrote:

Or run around grinding the Abyss and claim your character is actually teaching children in the orphanage.

It's a field trip

I think this is the time to suggest we all take our clothes off and have sex?

jameslocke wrote:

If I don't have any evidence that two people are cybering, they won't be banned. Suspicion isn't a good enough reason to ban someone. I reserve the right to create an awkward or unpleasant IC situation if I suspect some players are going at it in tells. That's my way of saying, "If you were cybering, knock it off."

So you were the one spawning rats in the Abyss when my partner was just afk? Sheesh, I still wonder ICly how the hell the Abyss can have a rat infestation problem.

Dev Disco wrote:

I think this is the time to suggest we all take our clothes off and have sex?

Is it the Democratic National Convention already?

Dev Disco wrote:

I think this is the time to suggest we all take our clothes off and have sex?

you are supposed to take your clothes off?

Dammit...that's what I've been doing wrong. I buy clothes twice as big as I need so I can fit the girlie in too.

Last edited by Pony on Tue, Nov 05 2019, 12:26 PM, edited 1 time in total.

To be fair you cannot anyway since the whole cyber thing is out the window, never mind your fetish :p

Last edited by Pony on Tue, Nov 05 2019, 12:26 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Ever have a shark spawn in the bath-house? :p

Bathing shark. That's our version of the bathing duck.

I've had a diseased rat corpse spawn afloat in the bath house though. That was good for a laugh.

xordae wrote:

I've had a diseased rat corpse spawn afloat in the bath house though. That was good for a laugh.

That's my hallmark

Rat corpses, goblin sharks, penguins, oozes, gelatinous cubes...

Rule change - please read and observe

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