Being a bad guy, dosen't give you the right to be an A*hole this isn't Grand Theft Auto Amia edition. There are rules. Just be a considerate A*Hole and try to avoid a sloppy argument that consists of expletives send via ///ooc

I want ALL rules clearly defined some place on the website. So then we know our boundries. Rather then having a rule tossed in some place that nobody knows about because it's not listed anywhere but the DM fourms.

We need a list of clear rules, so we can't break it. At the moment it's kinda like flying blind, minus the rules already listed.

Here's a tip, don't be evil just cause. Coming to the forest day after day to kill people or start conflicts does not make you evil, it makes you annoying. Killing you knowing you'll be back the next day anyway and pull the same exact crap gets boring after the third time.

Smart evil is the way to go. Give your characters goals, and have them use any means necessary to achieve them. Being evil does not mean you need to destroy everything, if there is nothing to gain.

Hello Everyone [...] I like tentacles [...]

We introduced a new player to our D&D group recently, and new to RP as they are, my GM recently put together a handy little guide to Roleplay. I thought I'd just copy it out here since it's virtually the same environment, and so much of it really is relevant, even if not to Amia specifically. There's more coming, but I ran out of time putting this up. ~Shal

Role-Play Philosophy

It occurred to me that we are a large group of Roleplayers who probably come from a wealth of different backgrounds and possess a variety of different styles. And having that sort of broad spectrum and experience available is a real asset for us. This is meant to encourage thought and discussion about our hobby - not one that is intended to call any particular player's RP into question. I list these points as rules, but they are my rules. They do not have to be your rules!

1. No character concept survives contact with play.

Roleplaying is, at its heart, an interactive process. No matter how artfully my character's background might be constructed, it is inevitably going to be less influential on my character than the play he actually experiences. Of course he is defined by the events of his background. But at the same time, play is what we're here to do. The play is what makes this a group activity. And the play is what forces us to adapt, change, and redefine. After all, every character background is, in truth, an experiment. We're putting elements together that I think work together in a very interesting way. But it takes practical application - actual play - to see if the experiment is a success. And if it isn't good enough, then more often than not, it's the background that I need to tweak and change - not the Roleplay.

2. Where my character is going is far more interesting than who my character is.

Well, if character backgrounds don't retain integrity in the face of play, how do I create a concept that has pre-existing definition and pathos but can move forward interestingly?

I have to understand that motion is more interesting than stasis. Even at the early stages of creating a character, my thinking generally revolves around the question 'what is this character's journey?' Of course, he might never complete that journey. Or his journey might change radically throughout the course of his Roleplay in general.

But there should still be a sense of what that character's arc is. Is he poised for a tragic fall? Perhaps he's positioned to ascend from mediocrity to something more. Or his story is going to involve navigating the strange network of his insane family. Maybe he's a bitter man who will learn to love, or a loving man who will grow embittered with the world. In every story, it is the journey of the character - not the essence of the character - that is the most important.

There's a corollary to this rule and it is thus: If the journey is the important thing, starting my character on top is a dangerous and bold choice. Once I'm on top, there are few directions for my journey that are not down.

3. You cannot make your own character cool. You can only make other players' characters cool.

For this rule, I'm actually paraphrasing one of my old storytellers who boiled the concept of play generosity into one of the most succinct truths I have ever heard in this hobby. His name was Tom. So. What did Tom mean when he said this? What he meant was that it is functionally impossible for me to go around trying very hard to convince people that my character is cool. It's self-defeating. Because the harder I try, well, the less cool I'm going to seem.

In any story, we have a tendency to see characters not just through our own eyes but from the perspective of other characters within the setting. If Booyeah the Barbarian tells us constantly that he is the most dangerous of men - but every single secondary character treats him like he's as dangerous as a puppy dog, well, we're not going to believe it.

The same thing applies to Roleplay. It's not my job to make my own character cool. It's my job to make YOUR character cool. I need to pay that forward, doubly, triply so. Whenever possible, wherever it makes for good play, I should make an effort to help you get your coolness into the scene. And I'm counting on you to do the same for me. That's the trust relationship of generous and rewarding Roleplay.

The corollary to rule 3 is: While it is your job to make my character cool, it is my job to make my character interesting. If you don't think my character's interesting then it's really very unlikely that you're going to want to buy into my story. And vice versa.

4. IC conflict = OOC cooperation

It's that simple. Roleplay is a communal activity. It is interactive. Obviously there is going to be IC conflict and confrontation. Stories would tremendously dull without that sort of tension and climax. Characters should, without doubt, be in conflict with each other. But when my character is squaring off in opposition to yours, we, as players, are working together to build a more interesting story.

So in any fight, the core conceit should not be 'I want to beat you.' It should be 'I think it is more interesting if my character wins.' And if it isn't more interesting, then it needs to go the other way. Every IC fight is an OOC collaboration to improve the quality of the narrative; to elevate the story to the next level. Whether that conflict is a duel, a race to learn a secret, flirtation, whatever. When our characters are opposed to each other, you and I are working together to capitalize on the alchemy of that reaction. The more confrontational our characters are, the less confrontational we should be as players.

Your Character, the World, and being immersed in it

The Building is a heavy Roleplay focused environment created to immerse our players in this world. When I say the word immersion, it means that ideally when you show up, you become the character you have created. A skilled Roleplayer can forget the world around them and take on all the attributes, positive and negative, of the character they're portraying. It can be an exhilarating experience that can make you laugh, or cry, if you can just for a moment forget who you really are.

Immersion means that your focus, IC and OOC, is on the Game and its Roleplay. You don’t joke about the loser you met at the bar last weekend or make predictions about the upcoming football game.

It means that you might actually, after enough practice, begin to see this world from the perspective of another person, who might be your own polar opposite.

You might begin to understand why people would react the way they do because of motivations that are different from your own.

Through becoming someone else, you might begin to understand others; and in doing so find that you are having the time of your life, free to do things you would never otherwise do and see the results play out without any real harm.

Immersion is a fragile state of mind. It gets easier the more you work and practice at it, but just like the guy on a cell phone in a movie theatre disturbing your film, your suspension of disbelief can be very easily shattered, and the experience ruined. We may not be able to dictate how others play, but we can attempt to create a framework within ourselves to help character development flourish.

First, and most obvious, immersion is achieved through description as well as dialogue. “What have you been doing?” Is a wholly neutral question until you add the description of manner or expression during the asking.

“What have you been doing?” she said tartly, her eyes mischievous.

Is very different from…

“What have you been doing?” he demanded, his countenance darkened with barely controlled anger.

Only the player can provide these subtle body language clues. While there may be things that hinder this communication, including lack of experience, English as second language, or other reading/writing stumbling blocks, we feel that as long as the idea is gotten across the rest can be practiced. A vivid, imaginative mind is almost always more valuable than dynamic vocabularies or player charisma. Many of our players (and more often the assumption) will animate their statements or Roleplay with their own expressions and tones. Sometimes a player won't even need to say anything - their facial expression can reflect their character's outlook when fully immersed in Roleplay.

Secondary but not separate from the ability to Roleplay is having the ability to form an interesting character with a detailed background. Anyone can say that they woke up with no memory of who they are, and some may even be able to form a character over time through their interactions with others. Imagine however, what our role play would be like if everyone did the same thing. The game background is provided for the player's individual story, and is not really suitable for a world of thousands. Does this mean you can’t incorporate amnesia into your own story? Of course not.

The idea however, is to form your character’s personality from very specific experiences and events and provide reasonable explanations for every action or response from your character. This group is fortunate enough to draw from the crème de la crème of Roleplayers, and as such, we will collectively expect this. We all have experiences that can / may help you with your character development and entry into the game, and some ideas and thoughts that can demonstrates examples of both good, and bad, cliche and overused concepts.

Above all, there exists an RP Code of Conduct, that explains some commonly seen Roleplay no-no’s as well as behavioral expectations when Out-of-Character. At the heart of many of these is fairness to other players. Logically, within a group is the place where most Roleplay can blossom. The life blood of role play is drama, and you don’t have drama without different opinions and points of view in the world in which your character exists. Be prepared for in-character conflict, and do not take aggressive actions by others against your character personally. Use them, instead, to weave a story for your character. At the same time, be aware that some actions you take in the story may have long term detrimental effects on your character. Betrayal and strife often equals death in world with little rules. In the end, good Roleplay starts and ends with you.

Cliched Character Backgrounds:

We all want to have some kind of engine that drives our characters towards revenge, or greatness, or into a situation their original life might not have allowed normally - the whole motivation for an adventure in the first place. And sometimes we just don't want to deal with having family, friends or background NPCs around. Then we'd have to name them and describe them and so on, and so on.

But it does strain credulity a bit when we have entire continents full of orphans, all driven to revenge. I mean, talk about maintaining zero population growth! Besides, having a living family actually creates some powerful story tools. There are people worried about you. Or people you need to impress, or fear, or prove wrong. There are loyalties that conflict with your loyalty to the party, or the campaign, or specific plots. And that's interesting! That's great!

And if you do want to reinforce the idea that the world is a big mean place full of violent raiders, you can still go that route. But turn it on its side a little. Lose a sibling, perhaps. Or hell, maybe your parents WERE the raiders. Or maybe raiders pillaged your town and burned your farm and you all survived but your parents were helpless to exact revenge. Maybe your parents are the vengeful ones, and are seeing it done through their able-bodied offspring. Or have your villainous father fake his death, manipulating your character. Kicking a cliche on its side is a great way to lend new life to an old idea.

The most common alternative to the "orphan paradigm" is the 'sold into slavery to pay off a debt' story. Again, there's a reason it's a cliche. It's emotionally compelling. You've got bankrupt parents, a story of corruption, a horrible fate inflicted on an innocent soul. I mean, that's good stuff there! But between parents dying left and right and parents selling their progeny into slavery left right and center, it's hard to imagine how populations refresh themselves.

Again, this is a great cliche to kick on its side. Maybe you were stolen from your parents. Or your parents were tricked by a con artist into giving you away. Even better, maybe your parents have always cared for you and finally have the money to buy you out of slavery but can't find you! But they love you so very much and they're searching high and low. Perhaps as a teenager you had a crush on the slaver in question and helped maneuver your parents into the situation not realizing what it meant for you.

One-Sided Characters

He leaps tall buildings in a single bound! She's faster than a speeding bullet! He's stronger than a locomotive! These are the people who have had flawless and perfect competence throughout their careers. Armies break against their shields and their blades scythe through their enemies like wheat at the harvest. They are mountains of mighty man-flesh, deadly femme fatales without compare, perfect warriors and irresistible sex gods and goddesses.

We're all here for a little validation. We all want to be hot, sexy, strong and all competent, and live vicariously through our characters. I dig that, trust me.

But we also need our characters to be human.

And here's the vital thing - we need our characters to have interesting failures so that their future successes are made that much more heroic and more interesting. When Vance van der Huge, slayer of thousands, kills one more poor schlub, well, no one on earth cares. When Princess Fatale, slave by day and assassin by night, seduces one more prince only to poison him in his sleep, well, she's so good at it that it doesn't seem that impressive in the end.

These are those cliches that's better to kick out the door than kick on its side. But if you do go this way, then create an interesting failure. Or, alternately, throw in a reason why this superior excellence is a problem. Maybe the perfect warrior was so perfect that people eventually got fed up losing soldiers to him. So they just poisoned his wine. And now his bones ache and his muscles twitch and he has to deal with the -loss- of his excellence. Maybe Princess Fatale suffered an unfortunate scar from a vengeful target that got away, virtually destroying her chances at seduction again.

And then we have the psychotics. The unfeeling killing machines. The perfect, emotionless agents. The wild-eyed foaming rabid brutes. The utterly heartless.

Okay, here's the sad truth- These people just don't exist. Anywhere. Ever. People repress their emotions, certainly, and some do it to an extreme. But unless you happen to have a hockey mask and a team of stoned writers working on your character background, there's no such thing as a truly heartless killer.

This cliche's an unbelievably easy one to make interesting. You have a healing process right there, waiting to happen. You have repressed emotions just waiting to get out. And after all that repression, they're going to hit you in the least convenient ways. So imply all that in your bio. Show us the clues that the facade is cracking.

These are only a few cliches, and there are many others. A cliche is not necessarily a bad thing, either. Certain tropes, ideas and cliches are common to a setting because, well, they're appropriate to that setting. But we are, each of us, creating interesting stories. And interesting stories demand that we step it up a little. We shouldn't be breaking stereotypes all over the place (that's its own cliche after all), but we should tweak things, twist them, turn them on their side.

Our characters should be in conflict, and that conflict shouldn't be entirely external. Divided loyalties, inconvenient emotions, failed ambitions, moral dilemmas, tragic romances - these are all things that bring about and create real depth in a character. It's not just about giving your characters some specific weaknesses with a name and a label. It's about connecting your character to the human condition, making them real and believable.

We have a group of people with wonderful ideas and wonderful stories. There is no trap that I've described here that I, myself, have not fallen into at some point or the other (and am likely to fall into again in the future). These are just thoughts that I've had while looking at my own ideas and trying to find out how to improve them. I hope they're helpful to you!

Existing Within the World

Notice that many of these games don't include things like free speech, right to assembly, equal protection under the law, right to a fair and/or speedy trial or any of the other liberties and privileges that come with living in a modern 20th century democracy.

I only bring this up because it is difficult to think beyond our paradigm. It is, in fact, impossible to do it fully. We must, by default, see all things from our own perspective and colored by our own biases. But since the world in which we play is so different from our own, we do have an obligation to at least be aware of the ways in which it differs, and to make an attempt to play to this different and vibrant world.

But by the same token, you are not just 'existing' within a world, but a part of it, as well. As you Roleplay, your actions can help shape and define things around you. A group of players who unite to overthrow a tyrannous warlord, freeing his overworked peasants, create a unique perception of the world not only for the players, but for the NPC's who exist within it as well.

In as much as Roleplay within the core of your group will become your bread-and-butter, don't be afraid to interact with the world as a whole. NPCs exist as part of the world, living and surviving, with their own thoughts, emotions and perceptions, and you never know how they can affect things. As an example, once when walking into a room of NPCs, a player offhandedly asked OOC "Are any of the NPCs hot?" and courtesy of a few random die rolls, there was - and what began as an unremarkable, undeveloped NPC began an integral part of her character development, eventually becoming a defining motivation when this NPC friend was killed.

This world is, first and foremost, a savage world. It is a place untouched by the sweeping effects of great thinkers, philosophers, scientists and artists. It is a land ruled by sword and strength. All authority is autocratic. Men - and almost universally ONLY men - carve out lands with the strength of their arms and then rule them with an iron fist.

Travel is slow, communication is slower. The various nations are not friendly to each other and their peoples mistrust foreigners. Racism is endemic and commonly accepted as fact. The same is true of sexism. Homosexuality exists, of course, and in certain specific areas might actually be more publically prevalent than it is today. But at the same time, the scorn for such men is wide-spread, instinctive, and not in any way considered insensitive.

Obviously, player characters are meant to be heroic - and heroic characters do break certain molds. But we need the mold to exist in the first place, and be apparent, in order to make the act of breaking it dramatic. That means that the female warrior's show of excellence is not dramatic unless everyone expects her to be weak and expects her to fail. It's that expectation that makes her success meaningful within the setting.

So, creating the setting is a responsibility that we all share as players. So be a little more hateful! Be a little more racist! Understand that justice is rare and that judgement lies in the hands of those who rule, and they dispense it as they please without the need to answer to a well developed political system. The perceptions of the world will for the most part be the emerging perceptions of new characters, until they develop.

This is a cruel, savage, unfair world. Let's work together to make it the best (and worst!) that it can be!

And another note, it could do with being someone who isnt a dyed in the wool drow

From your first interactions, you need to make perfectly clear to the other player that you and your character are entirely separate entities and there are no hard feelings between you and the other guy behind a screen. A few tells with amusing comments or even just something like, "Sorry, he's a real bastard if he doesn't have his coffee in the morning " could crack the OOC tension in a crucial moment.

That imo is exactly what you need to do, something to take the tension out of the ooc part, it really can make all the difference to an encounter.

... you just have to give up on characters like that and hope the player has the good sense to make a character who they don't mind changing mid-way through their game.

Plenty of people won't let their character be hurt, scratched or damaged in any way. They won't sway from their role because their class build won't allow for it and they made that character for the express purpose of being a paladin or whatever. As an evil character, you just have to give up on characters like that and hope the player has the good sense to make a character who they don't mind changing mid-way through their game.

I'd like to point out it's just a game......you're character can be as much of a prick as you want (mine are sometimes) just don't act like one oocly.

Honestly, I never really understood the bashing of those evil characters that are just flat evil. They exist in reality, why not here?

Hello Everyone [...] I like tentacles [...]

DeSimone committed his first murder on March 15, 1968. He was walking down the street with Hill and Burke when DeSimone spotted Howard Goldstein, unknown to either gangster. Hill recalls DeSimone turning to him and saying, "Hey Henry, watch this." DeSimone yelled, "Hey *********!", pulled out a .38 caliber pistol, and shot and killed Goldstein. Hill exclaimed, "That was cold-blooded, Tommy!" DeSimone replied, "Well, I'm a mean cat."

No. If you act like a prick in game there's a good chance you're distrupting other people's roleplay with your prickish nonsense.

For instance I was happily roleplaying when some newb created a half orc and started wandering around giving people hugs. That is acting like a prick in my book and that is ruining the game for me.

For another instance, some blackguard walked up to me in the forest and started giving it the whole, "you will die!" for no reason buisness. That might well have been his (dubious) idea of roleplay, but it still interrupted my gaming experience with some pathetic excuse for roleplay.

The point is this: If you're going to go around antagonising people, do it right or you'll screw the pooch for everyone. That's what this whole thread's about - getting it right. That's why we're discussing it. That's why your argument that 'if we're all nicey nicey out of character everything will be okay' is severely flawed.

I liek Jean Ortega as a character because it shows that everyone can be different. I also don't think we should incorporate mean behavior in video games.

Oh man, this thread is loaded with backdoor compliments.

Lets be practical, the ONLY thing you can do to be evil without a DMs help is kill players. Often for little or no reason without a DM to set up the story. You have to initiatie your own problems with random strangers just to provoke death battles that are more of an annoyance then anything else.

Its just not practical to run a true 'bad guy'. Its harder to do the things a bad person would want (To amass wealth and power), by and large all you do is annoy other players, and you can never really do anything more sophisticated then random murder.

heres some tips, and im running a group that is bad too:

- make your character strong- you can't expect to take on all of amia with a lvl 20
- good build - its gonna have to be cheap, you wanna be able to like solo 5 players at a time, because that is what the battles will be like (people who claim their characters to be good will swarm to kill you)
- make ur evil team have at least a spellcaster with spell resistance and true seeing - there are too many shadow dancers running about along with people capable of casting invisibility, you need to target those guys and make sure they don't see ur plans or whatever. its also too easy to get imploded.
thats what i got right now

oh, and if you wanna do some major dmg, be a paladin, cordor is riddled with evil that deny it

Oh man, this thread is loaded with backdoor compliments.

I gotta' say, I tend to think the worst bad guy RP is the kind that leaves people dead. You can do so much with fear, corruption and roleplayed violence that the death screen just comes off as plasticy and weak.

heres some tips, and im running a group that is bad too:

- make your character strong- you can't expect to take on all of amia with a lvl 20
- good build - its gonna have to be cheap, you wanna be able to like solo 5 players at a time, because that is what the battles will be like (people who claim their characters to be good will swarm to kill you)
- make ur evil team have at least a spellcaster with spell resistance and true seeing - there are too many shadow dancers running about along with people capable of casting invisibility, you need to target those guys and make sure they don't see ur plans or whatever. its also too easy to get imploded.
thats what i got right now

oh, and if you wanna do some major dmg, be a paladin, cordor is riddled with evil that deny it