AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

Hey there guys, it's me again!

I've find kind of old stuff that I have worked on with rashid (Abdullah) and I do not want to leave this awesome project fall into abyss.

So, I will ask now - before giving any further intel - is there anyone (the best would be CET or close to CET, but I can accept anything :lol:

), who would be interested in Chivalrious Order that is NOT connected to Kohlingen and doesn't fall under its politics? (Even when there could be a base in Kohl at the beginning).

Mainly it would be open for Fighters, Divine Champions, Clerics and Paladins. Any other classes will be considered individually.

Deities - Any non-evil, mostly those like Tyr, Torm, Helm, Lathander, Red Knight, etc.

All I want to know - is there someone interested?

It would be nice to have some more public order where sermons and meetings are held for all paladins and clerics around the realm.

That is perhaps what I miss the most when playing a paladin. There aren't many if any religious events for holy warriors or clerics.

Last edited by Lutra on Fri, Jan 15 2016, 19:58 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Well...I have the concept what rashid sent me out in the past. However, you all disappeared a week after the founding meeting in June and then there was nothing to work with. Thus it made me start a city based faction in August.

Yeah, I do not know what happened to Rashid, for me I can say, that I received new job and time went to (add ugly word)

Still, I am going to give it a shot and start it again, because for Reynard it meant a lot. That's why I am asking...

Probably yes.

Chivalrious Order - does that mean that it will be all "knightish and shiny"?

I have character concept ready to be created and everything. It would be cleric of non-evil deity. Not sure though about being knightish enough.

Chivalrious Order - not knightish and shiny (like a band of shiny useless goodies that only talk about doing something, but when it comes to action, they will try to talk their path away), but a really strict discipline.

If I will find at least 2-4 more people, I will send a concept that I have and make an IG introduction. (For it was once a ... Started faction, I only wish to continue.)

I really like this concept. An easy way of saying I want to help the realms, get plugged in for some fun RP and have people to RP with. Another benefit is getting in on the ground floor. One of the great things about Amia is it has history. One of the bad things about Amia is it has history. Do you remember when so and so did this, at that time, *secret handshake*. New faction doesn't have that and people are able to get in on the ground floor, their character battling evil without having to deal with the time when so and so accidentally knocked so and so off the ship. You can be the person knocking the captain off the ship!

Holy_Avenger wrote:

Chivalrious Order - not knightish and shiny (like a band of shiny useless goodies that only talk about doing something, but when it comes to action, they will try to talk their path away), but a really strict discipline.

Shouldn't a good-aligned faction's FIRST impulse be diplomacy? I assume you mean springing into action when all other courses have failed, but the last thing we need is yet another faction that crushes evil characters with no questions asked.

Ideally Diplomacy should be the primary course, if it is tenable and viable. There are circumstances where it might not be but it's a really, REALLY tough judgement call and there may yet be consequences depending on how things go

Well, my experience is that you call diplomat, but you also want to keep diplomat alive. Also if diplomacy goes to ... bad place ... you want to have someone ready to defend you. I think that this might be a bit of friendly competition to Warknights who are now (at least I get this idea) the only one who do most of this stuff for "all the factions".
Any fighting group can have some diplomat inside of it, or they can have some ally who would accompany them when diplomats services are needed.

Disclaimer: I admire Warknights. But I think it is better not to have more possibilities to choose from.

Overneath wrote:

Holy_Avenger wrote:

Chivalrious Order - not knightish and shiny (like a band of shiny useless goodies that only talk about doing something, but when it comes to action, they will try to talk their path away), but a really strict discipline.

Shouldn't a good-aligned faction's FIRST impulse be diplomacy? I assume you mean springing into action when all other courses have failed, but the last thing we need is yet another faction that crushes evil characters with no questions asked.

Yet another? Sorry, but from what I know, there is almost no-one who goes against the evil character behind their borders. Those who do, are individualist, not united under one faction. (Just like T0m said...)

This isn't about having a band of badass builders that are going to stand in front of the Tarkuul/Underdark/Zanshibon/etc with their PvP tool prepared.

This is about having a group of people, who are not interested in politics of particular states (Cordor, Kohlingen...), but do want to -do- something.

You can't simply be part of Kohlingen faction and trying to defend higher principles inside the Cordors borders. That's simply -not- possible, without a political aftermath. And now, there are those, who want to be part of faction, that -can- defend higher principles no matter what.

And yes, you can tell me "But then Cordor will come after you as a faction. etc" ... Cool, let them go after me. But that is a matter of IG happenings, alliances, etc.

And when I say " (like a band of shiny useless goodies that only talk about doing something, but when it comes to action, they will try to talk their path away)" -> I mean it exactly as I said that. This isn't about diplomacy, but simply about the fact, that almost 99% of the server is scared of PvP. There once was a group of heroic epic levels, talking in Bendirs and what happened? One bad-guy crossed the path to the forest, group followed him (probably they thought that they are strong in numbers), insulting him and he wasn't offensive! He did not try to attack them or anything, but their shoulders were wide and powerful, because "What can he do? There is five of us and he is alone"... You know what happened? He kicked their asses.
From that 'event', everytime I see this bad-guy IG and he crosses the path around Bendirs, everyone is silent, looking on the other side, etc.

I do not want to start a PvP faction here, nor group of heroic epic levels that got mouths full of words. I want to start a group of people, which are not afraid to go and fight for the ideals, no matter what. To start a neutral group that will help where it is needed and to whom anyone can arrive and say "Hey, I need your help." Without suffering a political aftermath or pointless hate.

You started with crushing evil characters - I am saying NO. This faction is about Protection a Justice. Not assaults and crusades.

Holy_Avenger wrote:

This is about having a band of badass builders that are going to stand in front of the Tarkuul/Underdark/Zanshibon/etc with their PvP tool prepared.

Holy_Avenger wrote:

I do not want to start a PvP faction here

I don't understand where you're going here.

This would be a good faction for Kyra, if she weren't already bound somewhere else.

Liz wrote:

Holy_Avenger wrote:

This is NOT about having a band of badass builders that are going to stand in front of the Tarkuul/Underdark/Zanshibon/etc with their PvP tool prepared.

Holy_Avenger wrote:

I do not want to start a PvP faction here

I don't understand where you're going here.

Sorry!

O, that makes a bit more sense with edits.

Never mind me!

Last edited by Overneath on Fri, Jan 22 2016, 4:40 AM, edited 1 time in total.

See one post below.

I'd love to join this faction if it emerges. Prefer playing good over bad in most cases. Thing is... What's the goal? Dare I say, vigilantes? There's no open evil. No force in everyone's face trying to take over stuff. Not player side. I bet there's evil groups plotting behind the scenes, but I don't know nothin' about it. And to do anything they'd need a DM (plot) and weeks of planning. So likewise, to do anything against them would require similar planning, no?

I'm merely skeptical of what such a group could do, without getting bored very quickly. Were the banites or thayans still rompin' around, I'd be 100% on board. But they're not. Sure, you could pick off the stray necro here and there. But that's the best I see happening.

None of this is meant to be insulting toward your idea. Truely, I want to know, what could we do? I'm of the mind the server needs more evil. Much more. An entire city of it, that actively tries to expand/destroy. All the current looming threats are DM plots, or secret things nobody knows about. Which, by the way, I am clueless on (current DM plots and secret evil). I only know that those two things seem to be constants in my history here.

Previous post edited. treasured memories said everything I wanted to say and much more eloquently.

I share the same concerns as above. I understand the desire to play a character that wants to do something, but there needs to be something to do.

The only way I could see this working out in a lasting or impactful way would be if the faction was hardcore Lawful Neutral, with room for both Lawful Evil and the more overbearing sorts of Lawful Good. A group that looks at its surroundings and decides that a disciplined mind and a firm hand is needed. Authoritarians, in other words.

Well what other factions do? I take it that they train, try to get new members, equip them, train them, work on their teamwork. What do warknights do when there is no war to be fought? What do people from Kohlingen? Sure they can patrol their area, but it feels to me like there is always some sort of problem in Amia to which neutral group can switch attention to and patrol in the area and deal with it. Or they can start working on their base of operation, should they need any (trying to find place, building some training yard, building barracks/housing for the members, maybe some small temple for gods the group worships etc.).

Just because main point is fighting evil, it does not mean that there are no other goals for group. When I used to lead group of battlemages on different server we would also hunt down beasts and write scripts about those beasts and their cappabilities and later did lectures on that, even though our main goal was guarding certain part of kingdom and nothing more.

You all are right.

It is hard to do something, when there isn't the main reason you are in faction. On the other hand, Nalkanar made a very valid point.

I can't say, what this group will do, when there are no evil guys around. There is so many options... (Like building the base, patrolling areas, etc...) that I can't even dare to say.

I understand your concerns about the goal and I get it. But I can't honestly say there out loud anything about the IG plans, that are already WIP.

Those are things that old factions are already doing, though. It doesn't really bring anything new to the server. I can't exactly fault you for that if that's what you want to play, but, y'know... that's just the way of it.

The reason I suggest a more extremist stance is because it would allow you to create villains, at least for your own narratives. Hunt down criminals who bribed away their punishment (read: paid their fine). Lynch a West Cordor drug pusher. Impose law where the system was too weak or corrupt. You know they're guilty, a trial would just allow them to lie their way out of justice.

There's a part in all of us that delights in the blood of transgressors, even if we try to temper it with laws and rights. Find that button and push it as much as you can.

Larsaan wrote:

Those are things that old factions are already doing, though. It doesn't really bring anything new to the server. I can't exactly fault you for that if that's what you want to play, but, y'know... that's just the way of it.

The reason I suggest a more extremist stance is because it would allow you to create villains, at least for your own narratives. Hunt down criminals who bribed away their punishment (read: paid their fine). Lynch a West Cordor drug pusher. Impose law where the system was too weak or corrupt. You know they're guilty, a trial would just allow them to lie their way out of justice.

There's a part in all of us that delights in the blood of transgressors, even if we try to temper it with laws and rights. Find that button and push it as much as you can.

That actually is what this Faction is going to do... As I said, force action where others talk. And as I said, I can't say much more without leaving the IC info here on forums, but as this faction is about Protection and Justice.

That is the main reason why this faction needs to be independent and neutral from "old" factions that are mostly City-based and have their hands shackled.

What I can add here is this - part of the official IG statement -

Public Statement
The Order of the White Stag is a Military Order of Knights, whose purpose is to protect the innocent, the people, and the values that embody the ideals of Knighthood. We are where the threat rises, standing for what are good and right, where ever we are needed or requested. The White Stag Knights remain true to the ideals that rule Chivalry, those of Prudence, Justice, Temperance and Forbearance, and the precepts and doctrines of the gods represented and accepted within our circle.

We are spearhead to consolidate the sustainable growth of the islands, paragons of justice and freedom, bringing hope where there is suffering and innocent victims, facing adversity with courage. We are ruled under a strict disciplined code of Chivalry, properly training our members to become beacons of service, defense and justice, that other may turn to or follow, always with respect to self-determination of peoples, nations and States.

What We Are Not
We are not Amia’s Police. We are not a social club; we abide by a strict code of discipline. We are neither judges nor executioners; we act only when is necessary and just, or is requested by need to intervene in a conflict. We are not politicians; we are warriors united by an ideal, who form a Military Order of Knights. We are not zealots, trying to impose our principles upon the rest. We are not a Chivalry Order, but a Military Order, which implies strong religious ties to the gods accepted within our circle.

Larsaan wrote:

Lynch a West Cordor drug pusher. Impose law where the system was too weak or corrupt. You know they're guilty, a trial would just allow them to lie their way out of justice.

If this truly is the intent, I'm all in. This sounds like something that aligns with me perfectly. Is this too extreme? Because this is exactly what I have in mind when the idea of killin' corruption.

But I am left slightly confused. You said:

Holy_Avenger wrote:

That actually is what this Faction is going to do... As I said, force action where others talk.

in response to Larsaan's post, the one I quoted at the top. But then you also said this:

Holy_Avenger wrote:

What We Are Not
We are neither judges nor executioners; we act only when is necessary and just, or is requested by need to intervene in a conflict.

I think a group like that would have to be judge, jury, and executioner at times. Again, this isn't to be rude, or call you out. I'm just a little curious. Either way, I'm going to give this a try if you'll have me. Sent you a PM about other nonsense that would be a waste to post here.

My opinion is the same every time someone proposes another paladin faction.

Amia needs more villains, not more paladins.

"From my point of view, paladins are evil!"

"Then you are lost!"

Dead wrote:

My opinion is the same every time someone proposes another paladin faction.

Amia needs more villains, not more paladins.

Id take this a dynamic step forward, amia doesn't necessarily need alignment based conflict, it needs more movers and shakers, less reactive entities.

I am all for any organized intention, but i think that a proactive faction is much more important than one that reacts to the world, essentially meaning it is bound to the stagnant motion of the server, rather than generating it within itself.

If villains were the answer than the city of tarkuul would be more than a dead joke.

OpenTheRift wrote:

If villains were the answer than the city of tarkuul would be more than a dead joke.

The City of Tarkuul is not a character, in case you missed it. So your comparison of a player's character with a location on the server is quite miscalculated and without any doubt absolutely irrelevant to my previous point that Amia needs more villains.

He's right. Amia DOES need more villains. Proper villains.

I like my pally. I'd gladly play him again - but there's nothing and no one to stand against right now.

Dead wrote:

OpenTheRift wrote:

If villains were the answer than the city of tarkuul would be more than a dead joke.

The City of Tarkuul is not a character, in case you missed it. So your comparison of a player's character with a location on the server is quite miscalculated and without any doubt absolutely irrelevant to my previous point that Amia needs more villains.

You've missed the forest for the trees.

All good and nice concept but it is missing some of the quintessential elements that are Amia specific. It is a fresh concept at least and good luck with it.

Few thoughts though:
- If you want to make independent from a city then you might want to find a neutral location because sooner or later they will get associated with the city. (Tried it 7 years ago...it is not working, I didn't even try that with the OSS) I think you actually considered that in the previous faction plan of yours, Vigilant Protectors. There are also a few people out there doing something similar, thus it might be a good idea talking with them.

- What Larsaan said is important. We might play in different timezones but other "old" factions are doing pretty much what is listed in both the OOC and the IC notices. Thus focus on how this faction would be different. The city based RP is not inherently evil, nor it is necessarily more restrictive than your concept.

- Should you chose a neutral location then be prepared for the consequences (War Knights in Ostland, Eternal Order in Benwick).

-Quoting you here from above:

Quote:

And yes, you can tell me "But then Cordor will come after you as a faction. etc" ... Cool, let them go after me. But that is a matter of IG happenings, alliances, etc.

Should you chose a city as a base then be prepared that your actions may reflect on the city itself and then the city will get angry, that applies to both good and evil factions who operate within the city (Dawnguards, EO in Kohlingen, other evil groups that were Tarkuul or Zanshibon based).

Yes, I thought about that and the answer is simple:

The Order of the White Stag is meant to be neutral - that means not city-based.

Guardian wrote:

He's right. Amia DOES need more villains. Proper villains.

I like my pally. I'd gladly play him again - but there's nothing and no one to stand against right now.

I think you should still play your paladin, as I also think that this faction should continue in spite of the obstacles to its success.

I agree with what's been said, about a lack of villains, and I especially like OTR's take on a lack of movers/shakers instead.

But there are some things we just can't control. Yes, it would be ideal if this faction was created while there was a clear antagonist who could keep you busy. But ultimately what's more important is that you're playing what you find fun, rather than what the community needs. It took me a long time to learn that lesson. Sure-- keep the needs of the community in mind, but if you do too much of that at the cost of just plain, simple fun with what you enjoy most it all becomes far more serious and pressing than it needs to be.

I've got an evil character. I'd happily try to fill a nemesis role for the group, if it ends up that way. Otherwise, I suggest just building it and finding ways to have your characters progress and develop alongside each other. Slow it down-- Big hordes of enemies justify big hordes of heroes, so if there's nothing so open to face off and define yourself against, try to work at a smaller, more personal scale.

as a note of being a city based faction... Whether the city likes you or not is the fun part, it naturally garners RP if you say "I'm Cordorian" or "I'm a representative of the Cordorian White Stag order" and then you have your own dynamic flare, because once you're big enough to be recognized (or perhaps just charismatic enough) you generate a roleplay venue simply by existing in contention with the city you claim to be of.

Cordor, and it's ministers desire X image, but they're bound to the law of their land...
You on the other hand, are actively portraying XYZ image, and doing it on a broad spectrum while totting the Cordor flag, this would lead to very amusing RP.

More concisely put, what I'm saying is that integrating yourself into the server as a unique but still integrated puzzle piece helps build the environment, it's easier and more beneficial to be a part than to build yourself from the ground up without any connections.

Last edited by Dead on Sat, Jan 23 2016, 8:13 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Holy_Avenger wrote:

Yes, I thought about that and the answer is simple:
The Order of the White Stag is meant to be neutral - that means not city-based.

Not being city based doesn't mean neutral. You say you will not be Amia police, but then you talk about going around Amia and crushing evil where it exists. That's what police does. You say you are not zealots, yet you are clearly making a faction of "Fighters, Divine Champions, Clerics and Paladins who follow Tyr, Torm, Helm, Lathander, Red Knight, etc." That's what zealots are. You say you will not be tied to Kohlingen yet you are using the White Stag - a symbol of Kohlingen. Ultimately, like Mr. Hackums said - play whatever brings the most fun for you, but I am simply not buying this story and to be perfectly honest I don't know why are you trying to sell it. Just make the faction and do what you think is right.

I am just saying that on a server where good outnumbers evil 20:1 having another paladin order will just tip the balance even further down into the maws of a social server. But 20:1 or 25:1 does not make that much of a difference anyway. Imagine the server if it was the opposite. Imagine how meaningful and how important would be your order in that case.

TormakSaber wrote:

You've missed the forest for the trees.

Meaning?

Meaning you missed his point for a chance to pontificate about Tarkuul. There's much more productive things to be done on the server, and in the server, as opposed to the forums.

Oh I think I got his point just right. He made yet another unprovoked swing at Tarkuul and myself, so I had to run his flawed argument into the ground. If he was more polite, I would even agree with the first part of his post.

On the other hand, if I was to ignore the blatant punch below the belt, he actually proved my point by calling Tarkuul dead. I said we need more villains, he said Tarkuul is dead. Tarkuul is dead because we need more villains. So yeah. I rest my case.

Tarkuul is dead partly because people like you do nothing but complain on the forums instead of getting in game and being the movers and shakers you claim the server needs. You and your character are in a position they can do a very great deal with, and your solution to the problem presented seems to simply be to complain on the forums until someone agrees with you about the problem you have the capability to fix.

You're too busy defending Tarkuul's honor and taking everything personally, and also on the other hand waiting for everything to be handed to you on a silver platter, that you've forgotten that being in a leadership role on Amia as a PC means you have a much greater ability to actually manifest change on the server, because presumably, as a leader PC, you are in the position to change things, shake things up, and more readily affect PCs due to your resources than other players might not immediately be able to.

This is what you should be doing with your time, rather than waving your hands in the air about how Amia needs more villains, and people should stop playing X thing.

Your character is one of the leaders of an evil city. You are a villain. Go do stuff.

Give me control of Tarkuul for a week (with DM support) and watch how much shit gets done.

A week.

I think this is totally OT now. But since it's here...

Well point of "why evil is not present" is having base of operations and DM support, so I guess anyone who would have control over something like Tarkuul and some DM to get things moving would make lot of stuff happening in one week. I think that real problem is consequence of such action. From what I understood Tarkuul would be wiped out in one swift attack

and that is probably the biggest base for "evil" on Amia. Same with underdark. Even estabishled "evil" needs to be in line, otherwise it will be destroyed in one attack.

Amia needs some sort of untouchable haven for evil, so that evil characters can go out, make mess, make stuff happen and then hide if needed. If this would exist it would be sort of pain in the ass for good guys, that they cant just use their numbers to stomp all over that bad guy, but they have to actually organize more and try to get bad guy out of his haven. Or maybe make the haven accessible only in certain conditions, so evil can hide there only once in a while and otherwise have to risk it.

EDIT: With evil being not easily killable there would be more stuff to react. I remember that one server I've played before we were hunting down this one guy for weeks, cause he could go back somewhere where we could not touch him really, and otherwise we could only get to him by predicting and watching his moves, reporting what happened around the kingdom and making patrols in area where he was. For example faction mentioned in this topic would be ideal for such a manhunting, while city-related factions would probably not really go to great lengths like this.

AirPhforce wrote:

Give me control of Tarkuul for a week (with DM support) and watch how much shit gets done.

A week.

Sorry, but... who are you? :roll:

TormakSaber wrote:

Your character is one of the leaders of an evil city. You are a villain. Go do stuff.

I'll avoid the rest of your post, because I'm not a part of Tarkuul for a long time now, but back then with Glim on the board we've done some nasty, nasty stuff with Lucius in charge.

That said, I've never been very savvy about Tarkuul's goals, nor did I care, but the way it seems to me is that Tarkuul wants to do things in a subtle way. If they unleash an undead army to the Island it'd go against the very nature of the city. So if you want a group that will spread horror across the land and bad stuff "openly", Tarkuul does not seem the right place. But then again, it is how the city politics appears to me, an ex-Tarkuulian Secret Ops.

Also, I know a handful of people who were doing crazy evil shit and stopped after being bitched to on forums, PMs and tells non-stop. People cry for evil characters, but as soon as evil emerge, it's only a matter of time before insults and forum crying starts flying by.

Maybe players and especially DMs should try to avoid tangents and cuts in to other players that whilst interesting and/or accurate, are not really about the OPs topic.

I'm a little confused as to the ethos and goals of this order, part of me thinks it's a bunch of freebooters fighting the good fight super hero style for justice and helpless folk. Another part of me wonders if this faction will end up with ethos creep and eventually end up plotted outside Bendir Dale verbally jousting with other has beens

I've been on break from Amia for ages after other such factions came and went, but if I can get better sense from the OP about his plans I could be tempted back on an existing champ or a newly rolled one.

I look forward to hearing more.

Edit: Spelling

I asked the OP if he minded; he said he doesn't. If he starts to mind, I'll just split the other discussion off into its own topic for him. So, carry on you crazy kids.

Strikeclone wrote:

Maybe players and especially DMs should try to avoid tangents and cuts in to other players that whilst interesting and/or accurate, are not really about the OPs topic.

I'm a little confused as to the ethos and goals of this order, part of me thinks it's a bunch of freebooters fighting the good fight super hero style for justice and helpless folk. Another part of me wonders if this faction will end up with ethos creep and eventually end up plotted outside Bendir Dale verbally jousting with other has beens

I've been on break from Amia for ages after other such factions came and went, but if I can get better sense from the OP about his plans I could be tempted back on an existing champ or a newly rolled one.

I look forward to hearing more.

Edit: Spelling

Actually, If we will even end up talking in Bendirs, I will take it as personal failure and quit Amia :lol:

That's really something I do not want to achieve.

Anyway, I would like to start something different. Dead said we are using symbol of Kohlingen - I say no. White is NOT one of the Kohlingens symbols, because it is universal symbol of Orders such like this. Connection to Kohlingen will not be established - ever. As Allies? Maybe. As part of it? No.

He was probably referring to the inevitable connection between "Order of the White Stag" and "Kohlingen: White Stag Shore." Which is not unfair. I can see how that connection can and will easily be drawn, especially if you are physically based in Kohlingen.

A discussion on Tarkuul's role in Amia is a bit overdue IMO, I posted an OOC topic awhile ago in the Tarkuul forum about it but unfortunately it did not gain much traction.

Part of the problem I think lay in we don't know what kind of antagonistic evil works for Amia. Regarding Guardian's post about the OOC bitching about antagonistic evils, in my experience of those kind of groups I've seen bitterness and bitchiness on both sides. I feel it is a bit of a farce of how people fondly recall the Banites or the Caraigh Cultists when the OOC environment could be pretty terrible back then which even put off the DMs. Is that kind of RP even sustainable?

That all said, I don't think that's particularly important for when it comes to Tarkuul because that's not the sort of evil that Tarkuul does. Tarkuul should in my eyes be a hub for evil PCs and their evil schemes, how can we encourage more of that and make the best of it?

Edit: On reflection I should offer some more concrete thoughts of my own otherwise this topic might just circle the drain and go nowhere constructive.

Yes Tarkuul should be more of a community. I think we need to lose the illusion that there is an omniscient Voice and that is not something done easily playerside. A lot of schemers are put off by the idea their plans are exposed the moment a word of it is breathed in Tarkuul. I mean, why is it only Kohlingen who gets the murder mysteries?
The Living Guard are nearly redundant when it comes to crime in Tark, what is the point of having all those Laws? There needs to be more room for intrigue. A city that reeks of necromancy should feel more dangerous to live in. The only danger people feel is the seeming absolute power of the Voice and that can be somewhat stifling. And even when you take that omniscience out of the equation, the players need to be at some kind of equilibrium with each other AND the City or things might just go to the shit like Edonil did.

And when you have a thriving evil community, you can be certain that their shenanigans will eventually spill out of the city and cause some real conflict.

Tarkul – all the time

My character does not like Tarkul, you have the undead island, refugee of Palemasters and ancient evil magic. Congratulations you hit all the nails on the head of being marked as the large evil. My character would love nothing more than raise an army of powerful dragons and raise it to the ground while using turn undead powered by thirty thousands clerics and turning the island himself. Meanwhile armies of mages counter weaving the Netherese magic which powers the city.

He doesn't have any of the resources to do so, however in two hundred years hopefully he will! My character likewise wouldn't advocate people blindly marching to their deaths attacking the city while there are many other evils running around. While Tarkul may be the most mentioned evil, those chain of islands were the undead raise up every night and attack are a more active threat. Farmer Dan may not be a powerful man, but his sheep and cows should be safe from attack. Personally I do not believe it was coincidence that his wife was eaten by zombie either, especially now that he is seeing Miss EmmaMay only a week after his wife was slain (two day's after she was buried). Okay so that is not a real plot (please DMs run this plot), but just an example of other persistent evil which is not Tarkul.

One does not need to be Amia's police to recover the kidnapped towns people held by the bandits, to clean out the old well from the goblins which has inhabited, to remove the underwater pirates from the coast so the towns people may fish in peace. Commonly that is a task which adventurers do, however wouldn't it be better instead of the random guy at the bar paid to do this a chivalrous order was around. Their goal to clean up problems such as those?

Guardian wrote:

AirPhforce wrote:

Give me control of Tarkuul for a week (with DM support) and watch how much shit gets done.

A week.

Sorry, but... who are you? :roll:

Someone who sees a ton of ooc whining but no ic action. Like, everyone says evil can't do anything because of the paladins, so go fuck them up. Destroy their farmlands, lumberyards, resource points, prevent them from launching a counter-attack by taking away their means to mount one. Tarkuul is a flying city with an army and massive firepower, go blitzkrieg.

New Faction? What is your opinion?

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