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msheeler
 
PostPosted: Fri, Jan 09 2015, 22:57 PM 

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A preview of the new fugue plane with the ooc information (which is located on a PLC in the Fugue) posted here for you to consider...

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Quote:
You have died.

Your soul has been drawn to the fugue plane where other souls wander the mostly flat gray expanse until they are gathered by their patron deities or make their way to the City of Judgment.

Should your soul return to the living it would have no memory of the time it spent in the fugue plane.

You will also not have any memory of some period of time leading up to your death. How much time? That varies and is left up to each player to determine on their own. What we do know is that the moment of death is so traumatic that the mind simply cannot retain it in memory. Some may remember the last person with whom they spoke or what they were doing mere seconds before death, while others may not remember what happened over the last few days or even weeks before death. Although you will be unable to recall the exact details of what happened on your own, your memory of events shortly before death may give you clues and even suggest who you might seek out to determine what happened.

Upon your soul's reunification with your body you may experience different sensations. Some awaken with a severe headache lasting a day or two; others find that they suffer from a weakness of the body that can only be cured with ample bed rest. Some may even experience temporary amnesia and do not recognize anyone around them or places that are normally familiar. Others find that in the moment of battle the amount of adrenaline in their system combined with healing magic spurs them to action for a short while before they succumb to weakness and need rest. Still others may develop an abnormal fear of death or other phobias, neuroses or psychological aberrations. What exactly will you feel? We leave this up to each individual to determine on their own, but you should bear in mind that death is traumatic to the body, the mind and the soul and returning from the dark place beyond death is at the very least disorienting and not without consequences. We are all affected by what happens to us, and you are encouraged to make your experience part of your role play.

May you find peace with your god when all things end.


 
      
Fennewald!
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 0:16 AM 

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Wow, that looks much better than how it is now.

And yet, RIP the Arelith vestige. This is still better though.


 
      
Tyrak
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 5:28 AM 

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i liiike.

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The_Big_Sleep
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 5:36 AM 

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Oh man, that is nothing short of gorgeous... I'm excited for that to be put in. And then to die, so I can see it. :lol:


 
      
IronAngel
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 21:38 PM 

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Is it your intention to imply that the victim of an assassination probably shouldn't/isn't allowed to remember the attack and thus identify the killer? That has been the primary motivation to push for a memory loss clause. Your vague formulation seems to allow players to decide one way or the other, so I'm not sure it is going to prevent or solve any conflicts. If you don't mean to take any new stance on this issue, on the other hand, what is it that the paragraph is supposed to address, in practice?

Don't get me wrong: it looks good and as fluff, it's fine. I just wonder if the fluff is supposed to have any practical implications; and if so, it looks a little too vague to unequivocally settle player disagreement.

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msheeler
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 21:59 PM 

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Yes there this is meant to confirm a ruling that the moment of death is not remembered and so you may not know who killed you if it was a well executed assassination. Were you locked up an tortured for a week before being killed off? Yeah then you probably have a good idea who did it. Were you talking to a friend one moment and then everything went dark? Yeah, you should seek out that friend and try to find out what happened. This rule is left vague to give players some freedom to figure out how they want to RP it, just bear in mind that the moment of death can not be remembered so there will always be some question as to what exactly happened.


 
      
IronAngel
 
PostPosted: Sat, Jan 10 2015, 22:28 PM 

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Alright, thanks! I think it could be a little shorter and a little clearer as to the intention, since a moment can be howsoever short and leave nothing to the imagination (I might remember the blade piercing my heart and still have plenty of moments until death). But that's really up to how specific you want your ruling to be.

EDIT: It occurs to me, though, that you only go to the Fugue from real PvM death and respawn (unless you're revamping the system). You won't actually get to see that message in PvP.

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On Joon, Kjetta wrote:
The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!


 
      
OpenTheRift
 
PostPosted: Sun, Jan 11 2015, 19:50 PM 

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IronAngel wrote:
As far as we have reason to expect, none of the things you mention will have any effect on the way death is role-played. And more importantly, there isn't necessary anything wrong with the way death is (not) role-played right now. The system as it stands leaves plenty of room for people to turn it into a traumatic experience when it suits the story, or shrug it off. The part you did not understand was my central argument: any death system that imposes a "right" way to RP about it undermines story at the expense of gameplay. Scenes in a story are supposed to have meaning, they advance logically from one to the other within the conventions of the genre. A collaborative RP experience is never fully planned, of course, but adding an obtrusive element of mechanically randomness ("oops I rolled 1, let's interrupt the coherent light-hearted adventure parody for a forced paramedic scene") does not improve storytelling. Death can only be meaningful when it needs to happen, or when it happens when you least expect it. If death becomes a routine inconvenience that you kind of expected but that will be annoying when it happens (which any harsher system will cause), it becomes even more banal and meaningless than it is now. What you want and how you propose to achieve it are not in line.

This has nothing to do with cliques, the old guard, the Arelith-scare or anything like that. It is simply a matter of good, consistent game design and honest argumentation. If the method you propose simply does not have the consequences you aspire to and, as far as we can see, would only have undesirable side effects, it is a bad method and we are better off not implementing it.

I have and will continue to play PvE death not as death, but as getting knocked out or otherwise injured so that one can't fight further without first-aid. I pretend Raise Dead scrolls are emergency scrolls that can fix a body and restore its functions but cannot return a departed soul. If you want to RP being dead for real, then, I probably won't raise you with a scroll. Tough luck, get a cleric.

I fully support potential permadeath in PvP and DM stories, though.



Quoted because gosh darn love this post. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

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MisterLich
 
PostPosted: Sun, Jan 11 2015, 22:46 PM 

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msheeler wrote:
After talking a bit with Silke, I think it was, I've been toying with something along those emote lines. However the thought I have is this:

    1.Redesign of the fugue plane to give it a better 'feel' of death and the beyond with new PLCs, lighting, sounds, music etc.
    2. Place flavor triggers in the fugue that tell people what death should / could feel like.
      "A bitter could sinks into the pit of your being, a cold with out hope for warmth"
      "You step forward, but you don't so much step as simply move"
      "How much time has slipped by? Minutes, hours, days? Does it matter?"
    3. Upon death all PCs have an immediate fade to black and are moved to the fugue plane leaving a corpse object behind.
    4. Anyone casting resurrection/raise dead/ etc. would simply teleport the PC back from the fugue plane.
    5. Where the re-spawn points are you can be given the choice to re spawn, wait for a raising, or choose to perma kill your PC and have them auto archived.



That's almost exactly what Arelith does, and it works quite well. People treat death much more seriously. Perhaps also a slightly more severe penalty on death, such as the ability to actually lose a level? If I just took level 16, then died and my entire party died too, I would lose that level.


In other words, what I'm proposing is:

1. Instead of 100 xp / level, perhaps 150 exp per level, or make it scale with your level. You lose (10 * level) exp per level, or in other words, 10 * level^2. If you die at level 5, you only lose 250. If you die at level 30, you lose 9,000.

2. You can lose levels upon dying. You will never lose more than one level because it is mathematically impossible, but being able to actually feel a loss in power would put more effect on dying. You went hunting, died, and had to get brought back by your God (i.e. respawn)? That has a price. You lost that new spell level you gained. Go get it back.



It seems a bit harsh, but realistically, low level characters will suffer less, which is good because they're more prone to deaths without a raise, and high level characters, who rarely die because they're very powerful and have friends to hunt with, will actually feel the pain of a death. The formula for exp loss that I proposed reaches an equality with the current formula, at level 10, where in both the current formula and the one I proposed, you lose 1,000 exp. After that, my formula becomes more harsh, causing you to lose 1,210 at level 11, whereas the current formula causes you to lose 1,100. Level 10 characters should have already become established enough to have some friends and know who to hunt with, or if they're so good at the game they've leveled by themselves, they should be much more powerful at level 10 than average, and not have a problem hunting the Shekat spiders.

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Glim
 
PostPosted: Sun, Jan 11 2015, 23:00 PM 

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Level loss will never be an option for us because certain classes with custom content break the character if de-leveled.


 
      
msheeler
 
PostPosted: Sun, Jan 11 2015, 23:10 PM 

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Joined: 17 Dec 2008
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And is abusable for rebuild purposes.


 
      
MisterLich
 
PostPosted: Mon, Jan 12 2015, 0:23 AM 

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Ahh, I gotcha. Kind of disappointing.

Though I wonder, how does Arelith get around that? Do they not care if people intentionally die to rebuild themselves? Seems odd now that I think about it...

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Osiris Masud

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Ice
 
PostPosted: Mon, Jan 12 2015, 1:27 AM 

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In Arelith, there are no rebuilds.

If you want to correct something of your character, well, tough luck. Delete and start again, or get killed a few times until your desired level.

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