This question was brought up and I wanted to put this up for anyone else interested.

Kyorl’d’Orbb – Spider Guard

These males are a branch of the Arach-Tinilith (Lolth Temple). They are made up of only the most honored males, those who hold perfect adherence to Lolthite society. They perform as role models for others to follow. They have many duties all of them involving service to the Arach’tinilith and only the priestesses of Lolth. They guard the Temple and most importantly the priestesses.

Under the direction of the priestesses they patrol the streets of the city to insure that the populace is in perfect discipline.

The Arch High Priestess (Ul’ath’tallar) has ultimate authority over the Kyorl’d’Orbb. Since Nizzre’tyne is the Ul’ath’tallar at this time here are her requirements:

1. Must be male
2. Must be a cleric of Selvetarm
3. Must have at least one priestess to vouch for you.
4. Must have fighting prowess and be capable of scouting most of the underdark on your own.
5. Must have a clean history with no ill behavior or crimes.
6. Must pass a test given by the current ranking Olath’sutrinos (Dark Commander)
7. Must pass a test given by the Ul’ath’tallar
8. Black Guards are accepted but only if their powers are from Selvetarm or Lolth. (you can contact Nizzre’tyne if you want to perform a ritual to do this.)

Because the Spider Guard are male that may give orders to and take into custody anyone (including high ranking females, males and even the odd priestess) they are expected to be the epitome of a Lolthite drow male. (Check out Streeaka’ael if you want to see how to do this properly – And as the Dark Commander – Olath’Sutrinos, Streeaka’ael is only required to take orders from the Ul’ath’tallar.)

Jess d’l’Orbb – Fang of the Spider

This new group is set up for those females that are excellent warriors or have Black Guard abilities from Lolth. (Yes I created it due to my PC Aly'isgar and the excellent RP of Xa'Chena who both deserved a place to serve that was proper for a female in Amia Lolthite society)

Nizzre’tyne believes that females should not take orders from males so any female warriors training in the Melee Magthere are under the supervision of the ranking Jess d’l’Orbb (currently Xa’Chena Tinnerai). The other males may make suggestions but they may not give orders any female warrior.

Female warriors with Black Guard abilities given by Lolth may attempt to be accepted into the Temple as personal body guards to priestesses. The requirements are no less stringent.

1. Must be female
2. Must have at least one priestess to vouch for you.
3. Must have fighting prowess and be capable of scouting most of the underdark on your own.
4. Must have a clean history with no ill behavior or crimes.
5. Must pass a test given by the current ranking Olath’sutrinos (Dark Commander)
6. Must pass a test given by the Ul’ath’tallar witnessed by your Ilharess if you are in a noble house.
7. Black Guards are accepted but only if their powers are from Lolth or one of her subordinates. (you can contact Nizzre’tyne if you want to perform a ritual to do this.)

Please note that if your RP is excellent you may be able to negotiate your character into one of these groups even if they don’t exactly meet the requirements. I have met PC’s who’s ideas seemed destined to fail whose RP impressed the heck out of me and they have found a way to fit into the current Lolthite society. So good luck and have fun!

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Ari'aerath Dlues'athsha ~ Silver Singer with the Bow of the Sun
Clarette Feohn ~ Magic is Art.
Victoria Marrs ~ "I have an herb for that."

This is exactly the type of group I was looking to join, a much better fit for Asdrubal than the Magthere proper. Now of to find the right Priestesses to ask!

Thanks for the extra information Firene, this is much appreciated.

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Mark it zero!

// I've been wanting to do more with this but real life has kept me busy and I never really knew what direction I should be aiming for. This does help me get a good view of how I should handle this! Also, perhaps it's wise for me to introduce Jess d'l'Orbb more? Hold a little session in which interested people can see if it fits for them?//

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Login - Sevk
Xa'chena - The lost child of Lolth

Heh, corrected the misspellings, lol.

In Lolthite society is is expected that interested parties would seek out the the opportunity. Or their Ilharessen would tell them to get it in gear and get over to the Temple/Magthere to sign up in order to bring more prestige and power to the house (and Ilharess).

Of course if the current Jess d'l'Orbb sees a likely candidate or would like to hold try outs there's no reason why she can't -- whatever you think would be fun for you Karelg.

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Ari'aerath Dlues'athsha ~ Silver Singer with the Bow of the Sun
Clarette Feohn ~ Magic is Art.
Victoria Marrs ~ "I have an herb for that."

Instead of starting a new institution, why not rework the Magthere to perform such a role?

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Plays:

"I'll think of something once Amia:EE drops."

The Spider Guard isn't new. You have to understand the workings of the Lolthite drow society a little better because your question doesn't make sense. This is a reworking of the Magthere.

There are players who want female characters that are fighters. If I didn't do it this way then they would simply be outcasts and not allowed in the Magthere or Temple just as my character wasn't in Ultrinnan.

The PC's RP in these cases has been excellent and I'm altering the way things are set up to give these players the opportunity to be a part of the Lolthite drow society on Amia. I can do this because my character currently has the power to be able to pull it off. In Ultrinnan my female fighter couldn't do it. So she was an outcast even after an Ilharess took her into a noble house.

Please keep in mind that these are not factions. They are city services that drow can be involved in. They are a RP tool for like minded characters. Remember that an Edonil drows life centers on Edonil unlike surfacer characters that can go to a multitude of other cities for RP.

Hope that helps you out, Galenson.

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Ari'aerath Dlues'athsha ~ Silver Singer with the Bow of the Sun
Clarette Feohn ~ Magic is Art.
Victoria Marrs ~ "I have an herb for that."

Eh... I always saw this as independent of the Magthere and more a part of the temple faction itself, from the outside looking in that is. That is perfectly fine as well as, to be technical, only Males may join the Magthere anyways in accordance to fluff and Lore, and that is the direction Edonil is moving to be more in line with.

Females get priest training (and the occasional Male in Selvertarm). Males get Magthere. Both sexes may join the Sorcere (though usually it is another Male dominated branch of life).

By setting up the temple to branch slightly with the Kyorl'd'lOrbb & Jess d'l'Orbb, a new option has been created. It accommodates both sexes and helps creates a solid faith faction that is outside House vs House politics and the usual lore but still works in fluff (which is why I personally have rolled with it).

((Edits for clarification and blatant spell check issues.))

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Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X
Sven <=={o===========>
Qeelak \ | / ,

I don't hold the greatest knowledge of Drow lore, but it kinda sounds to me that it'd make sense for Jess d'l'Orbb to shift towards the temple and quit being part of the Magthere. Their function and such would still be the same. I guess if people agree on this, it could be handled IC .

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Login - Sevk
Xa'chena - The lost child of Lolth

The only problem I can see is that when a like minded character as you've put it has the option to pick either a) the Magthere or b) the Spider Guard, they're all inevitably going to try and get into to the Spider Guard because of the higher standing of such a faction with the Temple. That's going to make the Magthere stigmatised as the second rate institution... (that is if you are planning to keep both institutions)

I'm just suggesting that perhaps the roles of each needs to be reviewed so that you don't get any overlapping of duties.





I understand your point, however I must disagree with that statement:

Like every other Drow out there, all of you have access to a multitude of city hubs in the Underdark and beyond to get your role play fix. Because you chose to limit yourself to Edonil and only Edonil, that does not mean you were forced to.

There is nothing stopping you from branching out your influence to other places if you so desired. Please understand that key difference.

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Plays:

"I'll think of something once Amia:EE drops."

There should be no issue for males, as I understand it, as it is religious warriors vs. fighter/weapon masters

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Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X
Sven <=={o===========>
Qeelak \ | / ,

Nope, spiderguard are simply a hand of the temple, they do not have to have any religious aspect themselves, just pure unwavering loyalty to the temple.

That said the number of spiderguard should be VERY limited.

Huh. Not on the same page then.

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Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X
Sven <=={o===========>
Qeelak \ | / ,

agreed with The Great Equalizer. Most spider guards where NPCs and their was a very few amout of rolls players could be. just to keep the numbers down.

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Braller Thunderbeard: The Dwarven mini-Jesus with a porn star name. Blasphemous.
Dante: "He is likely to heal you as he is likely to smite you."

Then the actual requirements for what it takes to be a Spider Guard has shifted from it's original incarnation. When it was first created, the Spider Guard was for PC's who were either clerics of Selvetarm or BG's. With the advent of Divine Champion, that class would now also be included in the previous group.

If things have changed, that's fine. However, Spider Guards were originally created as a place for divinely touched males to go as they didn't really fit into the MM and had no real place within any of the academies or institutions of Ultrinnan or now Edonil.

That's the whole reason why they were created and, personally speaking, I believe it worked out fine as it kept the fighter/WM's in the MM kept the BG's and clerics in a more divine roll. I would suggest that if non-divine males are allowed within the Spider Guard now, that extremely strict and stringent restrictions on IC RP should be put in place lest every male try to do exactly what Galenson said and join the Spider Guard instead of the MM.

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"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III

Agreed

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Braller Thunderbeard: The Dwarven mini-Jesus with a porn star name. Blasphemous.
Dante: "He is likely to heal you as he is likely to smite you."

To play devil's advocate for a moment the spiderguard on amia has varied between requiring Divine powers and not needing them. I know this for fact because back in around 2008 or so, Tharith was for a time part of the spiderguard as a Fang of Lolth.

Personally I don't feel there is much of an issue either way, a lot of divine male characters are less suited to be what I imagine spiderguard to be than non-divine males. I feel that as long as the idea behind the spiderguard is that they are a very select few chosen to serve the temple then I like it.

If we get to a point where it takes away significant numbers from another of the academies *Cough*MM stealing rogues from VDVM*cough* then I have an issue, otherwise I always like for options to be available to suit characters.

Earin/Ibseth's Fangs of Lolth is a hard one to classify... to be honest at the time it felt more like the Fangs were Earin/Ibseth's handpicked crew to carry out his dirty work, opposed to really being a "spider guard" so to speak. (thats what it felt like for me anyway with my Fang member, I was never tasked to guard the Temple or accompany priestesses but sent to do other things.)

But the issue I've seen is that if the Spiderguard and the Magthere cross over too many roles with each other, you're going to get a gravitational shift towards the spiderguard because, quite frankly based off that job description what male Drow -isn't- going to pass up the chance to boss around some females?

A clear, black and white difference between the roles of the Magthere and the Spider Guard needs to be thought out more in depth to make both unique and to prevent one becoming the "elite" crew and the other the second rate trash.

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Plays:

"I'll think of something once Amia:EE drops."

I'm going to reply as I was the one who created the current Melee Magthere structure.
In roleplay with the Spider Guard, it was decided that for the benefit of warrior roleplay, the spider guard would join up with the Melee Magthere. This was done to improve the roleplay behind warriors. I wanted to concentrate roleplay in a few places and for warriors, the Magthere seemed the best way.

If you read the IC topic of the Melee Magthere that I created, including the mission statement of the Melee Magthere, you'd see that the joint Magthere/spider guard has a few conditions.

The Spider guard and the mere fighter/wm have a combined physical training. They take the same basic classes. Males who demonstrate divine abilities would gain allowance into the Spider Guard and receive spicified training under the Olath'sutrinos.

In the current setup both divisions of the Melee Magthere can produce the Ul'saruk. However, in case the fighter division produced the Ul'saruk, his command is restricted. The Ul'saruk is thus not able to command the Spider guard in everything that deals with the temple (such as the divine training of the spider guard), the Olath'sutrinos would lead in those fields. If the Olath'sut'rinos becomes Ul'saruk, he can manage both divisions without issues.

This may not be fully following the lore, but I still believe that it was a good decision due to the limited playerbase we had and the roleplay that came from it is enough to demonstrate it.

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YES THIS. Sorry for the confusion. I've corrected the requirements, I thought everyone knew about the cleric requirement.

Please note that if you are a male drow character you MUST be either a cleric or a BG of Lolth or Selvetarm in order to qualify for the Spider Guard.

Yes the Spider Guard have better status in Edonil because a god or goddess has given it to them.

The Spider Guard are houseless males who guard the Temple and priestesses.

The Melee Magthere are the city guards, they run the expeditions to the surface in raids and protect the city.

Think of it this way. The Melee Magthere is the Army while the Spider Guard are personal body guards.

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Ari'aerath Dlues'athsha ~ Silver Singer with the Bow of the Sun
Clarette Feohn ~ Magic is Art.
Victoria Marrs ~ "I have an herb for that."

Again....not a faction. So this isn't a problem since only clerics & BG's qualify for the Spider Guard. The Magthere isn't second rate anything because there is only one. I'm sorry to say but you are the only one saying it's second rate and since you don't have a Lolthite drow it means nothing when you say that.

I, for one, would really appreciate it if you wouldn't keep trying to create problems where there are none. If you have a suggestion you should be delivering it ICly with your UD Drow character.






So this is another case where you just don't understand Lolthite drow society. The surface has been turned into a wasteland by the elves. Drow want no part of it other than raiding or getting slaves or getting creatures to experiment on. Also, I have to say that the RP with the current drow players has amazing depth and is excellent. I mean just yesterday there was a Yath'tallar test and the emotes and answers from the player of Jhal'vyrae were truly inspiring. Why would I want to go to another city when I can have that right there in Edonil?

Would a DM please lock this. As long as Nizzre'tyne is in charge of the Temple there is no debate as she has set the requirements and her word is final.

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Ari'aerath Dlues'athsha ~ Silver Singer with the Bow of the Sun
Clarette Feohn ~ Magic is Art.
Victoria Marrs ~ "I have an herb for that."

IC actions led to IC consequences... Get in game and change it if you like. Just saying.

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Thine taste in horrid footwear not withstanding, I did not say that thou were in fact an idiot, I merely implied that such things were self evident.

-Krrja

what I been saying for a long time XD

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Braller Thunderbeard: The Dwarven mini-Jesus with a porn star name. Blasphemous.
Dante: "He is likely to heal you as he is likely to smite you."

Locked at the OP's request.

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"I once took the high road and it took me straight to hell and I stood there all by myself." -Hank III