AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - The Official Teach a Man to Fish topic (Build topic):

Plenty of stuff you can KD on a little person. Just got my AB whore of a gnome to 30, and basically all I couldn't knock down were the giants, half of the Abyss critters, half of the Frozen Wastes critters, Umberhulks, and a trivial count of others. If I were to pull a number out of my arse, which I will even if I shouldn't, I'd say the offset in PvM in contrast with medium and small-sized knock-downers (non-IKD) is roughly below 20% in terms of the number of knock-downable stuff. One fairly frequently used attack compared to being able to knock down more stuff in PvM with a bonus of +4 seems just not as nice. Ring slot taken into account, it seems intriguing enough, but I'd see the two options on a rather even par.

But that's all. I think you're good either way, and it might be wiser to heed the advice of the more experienced player with the build in question.

Ok. My skills are looking like this:

33 Hide, 33 Move Silently, 33 Spot, 32 Discipline, 30 Tumble, 26 UMD, 13 Spellcraft, 10 Open Lock, 10 Search, 10 Disable Trap, 10 Set Trap, 6 Concentration.

6 Concentration, +2 Constitution, +2 Racial Skill Affinity. Might stop a few low level taunts.

Feats: Dodge, Mobility, Finesse, Focus, Improved Critical, Blindfight, Great Fortitude, KD, IKD.
Epic: Great Dex x1, Epic Dodge, ESF: Spot, ESF: Hide, Epic Weapon Focus, Armor Skin, Prowess, Crippling Strike.

Not too happy with 10 Search. But AC should be out the wazoo.

Uncle-Opustus wrote:

I love small people

I won't argue you on it as you're the more experienced midget person, but I used to do the Ring of the Ram thing on my medium-sized sneaker. Taking IKD instead as a feat was such a huge upgrade I'd never look back. I can only imagine it'd be missed even more sorely on a small PC.

-Cloak-and-Dagger- wrote:

Ok. My skills are looking like this:

33 Hide, 33 Move Silently, 33 Spot, 32 Discipline, 30 Tumble, 26 UMD, 13 Spellcraft, 10 Open Lock, 10 Search, 10 Disable Trap, 10 Set Trap, 6 Concentration.

6 Concentration, +2 Constitution, +2 Racial Skill Affinity. Might stop a few low level taunts.

Feats: Dodge, Mobility, Finesse, Focus, Improved Critical, Blindfight, Great Fortitude, KD, IKD.
Epic: Great Dex x1, Epic Dodge, ESF: Spot, ESF: Hide, Epic Weapon Focus, Armor Skin, Prowess, Crippling Strike.

Not too happy with 10 Search. But AC should be out the wazoo.

You want 19 Set Trap to comfortably set epic traps without a whole lot of gear switching. If you're fine with that, cool, but I'd rather just use Rogue's Cunning and plant them without any fuss, since you don't always have the time to swap stuff around. Rest look fine, though! You can get away with only 1 rank in Open Lock, honestly, but there's that gear switching problem again.

Right. Well, with locks, there's generally no time pressure. Gear swapping not really a problem there, so the 9 ranks needed for an Epic Zap Trap are easily accounted for. :idea:

Thanks to both of you.

Maybe a weird question, but what are the 'good' empowered spells?

I'm trying to see if my wiz actually needs it (basically it's a choice between that and Brew Potion). I know Spell Mantle empowered is better than Greater Spell Mantle (lol?), but is there anything else that is generally awesome to have empowered?

Delayed Blast Fireball, Spell Mantle... otherwise, eh. Maximise covers most of them already. I rather like Empower on a druid, though.

PaladinOfSune wrote:

Delayed Blast Fireball, Spell Mantle... otherwise, eh. Maximise covers most of them already. I rather like Empower on a druid, though.

Thanks, I'll let some others chime in but I'll push that feat to later in the build. Take something more useful now, haha.

In addition, if you brew a (for the sake of numbers) Animate Dead potion at level 5 is it a level 5 potion or a level 15 potion? Basically, does the level of the crafted item equal what is on the wiki or is it a max of your class level or the feat number, whichever is higher?

Last edited by Ulir on Tue, Aug 30 2011, 10:48 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Empowered flame arrows are pretty cool, too. You can take a gander at your spell list and see which spells you plan to use without meta feats, which you do and fit in empowered spells that way. Would you really grab an empowered delayed blast fireball if you can use meteor storm? Perhaps your level 7 spells is filled with buff spells, like extended haste and such and you don't want to use maximized ice storm. The option would be to use empowered instead.

I suppose it is more beneficial for a sorcerer than a wizard, in terms of filling out slots with offensive spells. But still a FEAT that is neat and worthwhile I daresay.

Edited

True, I suppose.

(Brew Potion info, go!)

Empowered Delayed blast fireball is still better than Meteor swarm hands down.

What's your point? You are famous for posts like this. Stop it.

Ulir wrote:

Would you really grab an empowered delayed blast fireball if you can use meteor storm?

Answer - Yes if i took the feat. That is my point. The player might not realize that it's a better option.

*sighs* :roll:

It's not a better option.

DerkDerkistan wrote:

It's not a better option.

Depends on the situation. Never say never.

DerkDerkistan wrote:

It's not a better option.

Out of curiosity, when would it be a better option?

Last edited by hendrack on Tue, Aug 30 2011, 8:25 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Naivatkal wrote:

(Brew Potion info, go!)

The potions have a fixed CL and your characters CL doesn't change anything. Same with wands, but more CL means more uses on the wands, though.

When you see that it has been altered to do d8 damage per caster level, up to 30d8.

DerkDerkistan wrote:

When you see that it has been altered to do d8 damage per caster level, up to 30d8.

Yeahhh...damage isn't everything :wink:

Traps do the other part better. But I'm not going to argue mechanics of a spell.

Coming from an avid user of Meteor Swarm, they both have their place. Swarm can be a tricky bugger to place properly because of the minimum no-hit range, but if you have the right situation you're able to drop most monsters in two casts.

It's ultimately a pain to have if you're a sorcerer, though, since not being able to use that slot for Wail, Weird or Dominate Monster can limit your utility. I consider Time Stop and Disjunction absolutely essential choices, so that third choice is always tricky.

PaladinOfSune wrote:

Coming from an avid user of Meteor Swarm, they both have their place. Swarm can be a tricky bugger to place properly because of the minimum no-hit range, but if you have the right situation you're able to drop most monsters in two casts.

It's ultimately a pain to have if you're a sorcerer, though, since not being able to use that slot for Wail, Weird or Dominate Monster can limit your utility. I consider Time Stop and Disjunction absolutely essential choices, so that third choice is always tricky.

I think the third slot depends what spell focus you have.

Necromancers usually go for wail
Evocers 'should' in my humble opinion take Meteor Storm

If you are neither of those i'd say your strongest bet is the Black blade of disaster (It's ACE if you have 28-29+ Levels of Caster because the On Hit; vorpal rift DC Increases with Caster level)
Or the Bigby's crushing hand which can truly devastate most PC's or NPC's.

Example

Pretty much my opinion too, yeah. My Evoker sorcerer has Meteor Swarm, but I still do miss the delicious Wail sometimes.

Ya, only one spell to play with sadly. Sorcerer would be a fine option if you wanna play a mage with one specialized school focus only. A pyromancer fx.

hendrack wrote:

Naivatkal wrote:

(Brew Potion info, go!)

The potions have a fixed CL and your characters CL doesn't change anything. Same with wands, but more CL means more uses on the wands, though.

Cool, thanks! That's what I thought, it just seemed weird to make a potion that's level 15 when you are level 5 XD

Dear Builders!

Kobold!

Kobolds love traps. Fighter/Rogue with a light hammer?

Warhammer, I'd say. One of the models has a pointy end and is rather small in size, not looking silly on kobolds I would think.

Kurtulmak's favoured weapon is a Spear.

The closest thing to a pickaxe is a Warhammer.

Both the Spear model for Trident and Pick model for Warhammer need the Weaponsmith models, last I knew.

I would say using a Trident would not be a bad idea, as per Kobold Lore the short spear is both Kurtulmak's favoured weapon, and one used by many Kobolds. And a Miner would have a fair amount of Strength, and from a build perspective going STR based, and taking RDD would be fine, lorewise and build wise, the RDD benefits negating their punyness and such. And you can of course craft a trident to have a a spearhead.

And of course you don't have to wear a Full Plate. (Most Kobolds don't) So you can make use of their DEX bonus there.

So a Bard 20/RDD 10 could work well.

Also, the spear model for Trident does not ned job system.

Wanting to fishout a barb. build, but may need help

info :
Race earth genesis
class rog 2/barb 24/ ftr 4 or 2rog /28barb

Starting starting stats
str 20
Dex 10
con 18
int10
wis 6
Cha 6

You need to decide if you are aiming for mighty rage, Epic damage reduction, dev crit, the terrifying, or thundering rage.

Or you can be like my barb and net Epic DR, Mighty, and Terrifying rage :3

I swear it has EDR 2 and Thundering too. Might be wrong, not at home to check lol

-Cloak-and-Dagger- wrote:

Kurtulmak's favoured weapon is a Spear.

The closest thing to a pickaxe is a Warhammer.

Both the Spear model for Trident and Pick model for Warhammer need the Weaponsmith models, last I knew.

I have forgotten.if the trident is two handed for small sized chars or one handed, do you know?

Two handed. So would are warhammers.

dayfer wrote:

Two handed. So would are warhammers.

This is leaning towards a con based barbarian kobold going absolutley willy nilly when somebody threatens him or his peeps.
Can even whore rdd levels as you said without feelin like a nub.

Yup, just remember most are cowards at heart, and if you're thinking Barbarian, then White DD could work, liking the idea I must say.

dayfer wrote:

Yup, just remember most are cowards at heart, and if you're thinking Barbarian, then White DD could work, liking the idea I must say.

I heard from an unverified source that it's a bit iffy to preform a RDD ritual with kobolds due to their dragon heritage. I mean, they're basically descendants from all types of dragons - Imagine trying to focus a ritual out of that.
I'd better ask dusty if it's all right at all, since he's the kobold expect and also invite Letumlux into a li'll conversation before i pursue such a path with the character.

Otherwise i could just go pure CON barbarian and laugh a little at the insane HP the kobold will get.

Sounds good, I will admit I've never made an RDD Kobold for the same reason.

dayfer wrote:

Sounds good, I will admit I've never made an RDD Kobold for the same reason.

Yeah. I'd say pursuing that path for a kobold is a little like drinking a random magical potion and realise the day after you slept with Arnold Schwarzenegger and that you're pregnant with his child, not to mention you now have boobies and enjoy watching TV-Shop in the middle of the day.

You have NO IDEA what you could unleash.

The images!!

But yeah, best ask the Kobold Lore buffs, mines lacking a bit.

I wouldn't be so worried about a Kobold's end build if you are using this thread to discuss entries to my Alternate Beginnings campaign. A lot can happen between lvl 2 and lvl 6...

Scout's motto - Always be prepared! Less work for the DM's then!

I can't believe you're sitting here powergaming an alt. beginnings character. Shame on you.

TormakSaber wrote:

I can't believe you're sitting here powergaming an alt. beginnings character. Shame on you.

Oh go and be snide somewhere else - It's perfectly acceptable to whisk around theories and ideas.

Given an alt beginnings character is completely at the behest of the DM you may not even have the same statistical score at the end of the campaign. Yeah you really shouldn't be thinking of the end build right now. You aren't even in the campaign yet.

Change of topic:

I'll throw this out there. What class/gods do you think would make the most sense for a Shamanic style character? More of spiritualist Shaman as opposed to the elemental kind you tend to see depicted in modern games (ala, world of warcraft as the best example).

I've been thinking on this for a good while, and none of the standard Nature gods really seem especially suited for this and thus Druid might not be a good class choice either. All the nature gods I've read about seem more about "protect the forest and wild life" than about "commune with spirits and your ancestors." There may not even be an appropriate deity for this on FR, but I figure if there is someone in this group would probably know.

Thanks for any feedback.

Druid, yeah.

Quick question! On my AA, I have one spare feat to take. Trying to choose between Skill Focus Spot (Not the epic one), Weapon finesse, Epic Toughness, Alertness, or some other epic sorta feat. I already have Epic Prowess, Epic Spot, Armor Skin, Epic Focus Longbow and Gr Dex I.

I've been sort of torn between Weapon Finesse and picking some random other feat that will help me more. Weapon Finesse is really limited to the situation I'd use a melee weapon, which is likely going to be never. Any thoughts?

Take Epic Toughness.

coyotesage wrote:

Change of topic:

I'll throw this out there. What class/gods do you think would make the most sense for a Shamanic style character? More of spiritualist Shaman as opposed to the elemental kind you tend to see depicted in modern games (ala, world of warcraft as the best example).

I've been thinking on this for a good while, and none of the standard Nature gods really seem especially suited for this and thus Druid might not be a good class choice either. All the nature gods I've read about seem more about "protect the forest and wild life" than about "commune with spirits and your ancestors." There may not even be an appropriate deity for this on FR, but I figure if there is someone in this group would probably know.

Thanks for any feedback.

Rashemi sorc/cleric/druid of either chauntea/miliekki. Don't even need to be a druid but the witches in Rashemen are quite into the whole commune with spirits thing. Last I asked for my own character a minor ethran on her 'dajemma' around the world can be played without request. Unapproachable East is the sourcebook you might want to look into.

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