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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 10:38 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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Any other successfully way to multi-class a barbarian, Beside the 24/4/2 ?
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 10:55 AM |
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007 Location: Finland
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Yep. Plenty.
_________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 13:54 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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I need some advise on what feats I should take at certain levels [in red].
Azra-
L24 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer
1(W). +2 Dodge, Luck of Heroes 2(W). 3(W). +1 Mobility 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Scribe Scroll 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Spring Attack 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 (? Metamagic) Spell Focus: Conjuration 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(W). 20(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(W). 23(W). +1 (? Metamagic) 24(W). +1 Greater Ruin 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(SD). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(SD). +1 (? Epic/General)
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 14:03 PM |
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Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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You need, 1x Great Intelligence feat. For Metamagic feats; You need Silent Or Still spell Maximize Empower Extend
Since you're a wizard, It's always handy to have Since you're going Shadowdancer, You need Overall Suggestion. Take 1x Level Shadowdancer Pre-Epic. Since you get extra Bonus feat at level 5-10-15-20 Wizard, This means your level 20 Bonus feat becomes Epic Bonus feat.
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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DustSpray101
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 17:17 PM |
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Joined: 27 Jun 2008 Location: Night Vale
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Very_Svensk wrote: Any other successfully way to multi-class a barbarian, Beside the 24/4/2 ? Yes. 17/13. Barb/Rogue respectively. Terrifying and Epic Dodge. Highly effective together with a sling or ranged weapon.
_________________ Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X Sven <=={o===========> Qeelak \ | / ,
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Ulir
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 17:50 PM |
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Joined: 09 Mar 2009
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Since you're a wiz, you dont need to take "scribe scroll" at level 9. You got it automatically.
I would suggest you take epic dragon knight, since you're going for epic conj., of hellball, which is grand. You might wanna take another look at the build you posted. You can't take epic spell foci: conj. or any epic mage spells when you level your SD at 21, 24, 27 & 30.
Ya, save a wizard level for the spot at level 21, 24, 27 & 30. That way you can get those fine epic spells and foci.
So, suggesting you to grab your SD levels at 22, 23, 25, 26, 28 & 29. I would prolly do that.
_________________ 
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 18:09 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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Ulir wrote: Since you're a wiz, you dont need to take "scribe scroll" at level 9. You got it automatically.
I would suggest you take epic dragon knight, since you're going for epic conj., of hellball, which is grand. You might wanna take another look at the build you posted. You can't take epic spell foci: conj. or any epic mage spells when you level your SD at 21, 24, 27 & 30.
Ya, save a wizard level for the spot at level 21, 24, 27 & 30. That way you can get those fine epic spells and foci.
So, suggesting you to grab your SD levels at 22, 23, 25, 26, 28 & 29. I would prolly do that. One level SD Pre-Epic, so he gets level 20 Wizard Extra feat in Epic.
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 20:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Thanks for the help.
Is there anything wrong with it now?
Azra-
L24 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer
1(W). +2 Dodge, Luck of Heroes 2(W). 3(W). +1 Mobility 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Brew Potion 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Spring Attack 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Craft Wand, Spell Focus: Conjuration 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(SD). 20(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Greater Ruin, Dragon Knight 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(W). +1 Great Intelligence
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 20:43 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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Don't need both EDK and EMD, some of the EMD options get extended as well with epic spell focus conjuration. Instead of one of those epic summons and brew potion, get skill focus and epic skill focus hide.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 20:45 PM |
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Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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I see no Still or silent Feats. Nor any Empowered Feats.
Add those, and remove Spring attack, Luck of Heroes
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 20:49 PM |
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Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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He has only conjuration spell focus, what do you want to cast silent, empowered or still from that? Extend and max is fine enough for buffing and ice storm / IGMS. Murex's build is fine aside the lack of hide boost, since he's a SD with some summons. Luck of heroes is awesome too.
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:05 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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hendrack wrote: Don't need both EDK and EMD, some of the EMD options get extended as well with epic spell focus conjuration. Instead of one of those epic summons and brew potion, get skill focus and epic skill focus hide. Why exactly should I not get both EDK and EMD?
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:06 PM |
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Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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Because you cannot have the cake and eat it. You have to sacrifice something to gain something. Effectively, By gaining SD levels, you don't have as many EPIC feats as you want.
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:09 PM |
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Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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And in case you didn't know, you can't have both summoned at the same time. An extended Mummy Dust will last an entire rest cycle anyway, and a Dragon Knight extended with Epic Conjuration would be enough too. Simply in terms of efficency, when one is summoned it's time wasted for the other.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:15 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Epic Skill Focus: Hide would be nice, but is it even possible get 20 ranks in Hide with this build for the prerequsite?
I am aware that both epic summons cannot be used at the same time, I chose both because if one dies, I can then summon the other.
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:22 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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Personally i'd recommend EMD over dragon knight. EMD on amia is leaps stronger than the vast majority of epic melee characters. While the dragon knight gets stomped on pretty easy.
Remember with its long duration even if your using EMD for pvm, you could just buff it and watch it destroy most epic spawns.. IF it gets hurt just feed it a heal pot.
I agree with Sven. Spring attack is a waste 100% on a wizard, luck of heros is also something you dont need. Take the metamagic feats. They help TONS with your spell book layout as a wizard.
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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Maverick00053
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:26 PM |
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Palemaster wrote: Personally i'd recommend EMD over dragon knight. EMD on amia is leaps stronger than the vast majority of epic melee characters. While the dragon knight gets stomped on pretty easy.
Remember with its long duration even if your using EMD for pvm, you could just buff it and watch it destroy most epic spawns.. IF it gets hurt just feed it a heal pot.
I agree with Sven. Spring attack is a waste 100% on a wizard, luck of heros is also something you dont need. Take the metamagic feats. They help TONS with your spell book layout as a wizard. >_> That really isn't true. No summon is stronger than a properly setup mele fighter. The thing you are thinking of is the fact that the EMD, at least the default version, is immune to crits and a lot of other things. So... while it can barely hit anything with 60ac give or take it tanks like a BEAST. The EDK on the other hand doesn't have the immunity to crits but trust me... it holds its own with the fear aura alone, and the fact it can spot SDs and spank em.
_________________ ActiveLevexal Techsmith Tokas Tokersun - http://amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=88661
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:34 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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Trust me.. I have in my playervault some of the strongest melee characters on the server, and I know Sven has some pretty smexy powerbuilds aswell. I have both WM's and Cheesy like Barb/Bard/PM's.. EMD buffed is a huge pain and might even spank most of them. I'm even taking into consideration that I swap to a +4 warhammer with 2d6vs Construct. The summon is awesome. EDK however is a waste of space vs anyone.... including a good rogue. Where as EMD is SUCH a pain that in any sort of PVP I would not -ever- consider fighting it, but instead focusing on who ever summoned it. It hits hard to..
Maybe try something like this
1(W). +2 Dodge, Spell Focus: Conjuration 2(W). 3(W). +1 Mobility 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Brew Potion 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Craft Wand, empower spell 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(SD). 20(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Greater Ruin, ESF: Hide 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Epic Spell: Of Your Choice (But not another summon!) 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(W). +1 Great Intelligence
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:35 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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You have plenty of skillpoints to spare as a wizard with, apparently, at least 22 Intelligence. So of course you'll have 20 Hide by level 19, when you take your first SD level. You will obviously want to maximize your Hide and Move Silently.
You'll also probably have 30 Tumble, right? Free AC is nothing to scoff at, even if you don't intend to get hit a lot. In any case, 14 Tumble is enough to make you immune to Attacks of Opportunity from moving, which means Spring Attack doesn't do anything. So I'd definetely sooner take 14 (15) ranks in Tumble than waste a feat on Spring Attack, even if I thought it important to move freely in combat.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:46 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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I was planning on this character to not have any AC, so Tumble would be a waste.
Here is a revision-
Azra-
L24 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer
1(W). +2, Dodge, Mobility 2(W). 3(W). +1 Spell Focus: Conjuration 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Skill Focus: Hide 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Skill Focus: Move Silently, Spring Attack 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(SD). 20(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Greater Ruin, Great Intelligence 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Epic Skill Focus: Hide 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(W). +1 Epic Skill Focus: Move Silently
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:49 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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With no DISC you want tumble.. IF someone gets close and can spot you the tumble could very well save your life.... Its not about the AC per say its about avoiding the AOO's (As a mage you can give yourself pretty decent AC with spells anyways)
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 21:55 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005 Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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My sd/Wizard has 57AC, and 90/90 Hide/MS - It's PvM Oriented, and works well...
I can guarantee you, You do want AC, because not having discipline hurts you soooo baaad
_________________ Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/ NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:06 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Very_Svensk wrote: My sd/Wizard has 57AC, and 90/90 Hide/MS - It's PvM Oriented, and works well...
I can guarantee you, You do want AC, because not having discipline hurts you soooo baaad Okay, if my build can achieve this kind of AC (and Hide/MS), then sure. I'm just questioning how 57 AC is possible for having no armor.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Armor adds a few points at best. What's your base Dexterity modifier? Add +6 from maximized Dexterity bonuses. You could grab Epic Mage Armor to give you +5 of every type of AC and free tons of equipment slots. On top of that, there's Haste and Mage Armor for +5 Dodge combined. I'm not sure what boots there are in game, but you should find be able to find +4 Dodge AC for wizards.
You'd want a shield, though. There are large shields with no spell failure in game, but you'd have to drop something from your build.
Spring Attack costs one feat. 15 Tumble costs 15 skill points. You can afford the latter better even if you don't want the AC. And when you drop Spring Attack and go for AC, you can easily afford Shield proficiency.
Listen is also worse than Spot, and generally lower. So you don't necessarily need Epic Skill Focus in MS, certainly not normal skill focus (since it's not a prereq for the epic variant).
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
Last edited by IronAngel on Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:28 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:18 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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L24 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer
1(W). +2, Dodge, Mobility 2(W). 3(W). +1 Spell Focus: Conjuration 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Skill Focus: Hide 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Shield Proficiency, (Craft/Brew?) 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(SD). 20(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration (I guess you intend to take a Conjuration-extended EMD?) 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Greater Ruin, Great Intelligence 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Epic Skill Focus: Hide 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(W). +1 Epic Spell: Epic Mage Armor
Swap order as possible and desired. That's what I'd do, given the general idea you have.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Maverick00053
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:22 PM |
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Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Palemaster wrote: Trust me.. I have in my playervault some of the strongest melee characters on the server, and I know Sven has some pretty smexy powerbuilds aswell. I have both WM's and Cheesy like Barb/Bard/PM's.. EMD buffed is a huge pain and might even spank most of them. I'm even taking into consideration that I swap to a +4 warhammer with 2d6vs Construct. The summon is awesome. EDK however is a waste of space vs anyone.... including a good rogue. Where as EMD is SUCH a pain that in any sort of PVP I would not -ever- consider fighting it, but instead focusing on who ever summoned it. It hits hard to.. It's a tank with crappy ab, imo. *Shrugs* Everyone has their different opinions. EDK though is far from useless for anyone who takes it. There is a lot of little things it has, Fear Aura + True Bioware TS for one, that makes it stand out. Before the Dev Crit change I might of agreed with you solely because EDK use to be insta deved a lot followed by "LOL". Anywho, this isn't the place to really discuss the, "OMG my level 30 undead cleric shaman summon is better than yours" debate. So with that, ill run off before I am smited for not assisting peeps in builds.
_________________ ActiveLevexal Techsmith Tokas Tokersun - http://amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=88661
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:24 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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DEX will be 14
Tumble would be mostly a cross-class skill, but I think I'll go for AC, so tumble would be good. I think I will also throw in Epic Mage Armor at L24 instead of Greater Intelligence. More mythal slots would be good for +5 to Hide/MS.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:27 PM |
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Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Murex wrote: DEX will be 14
Tumble would be mostly a cross-class skill, but I think I'll go for AC, so tumble would be good. I think I will also throw in Epic Mage Armor at L24 instead of Greater Intelligence. More mythal slots would be good for +5 to Hide/MS. Tumble is a Shadowdancer class skill. You don't need to take it on wizard levels, just save the points for those SD levels. Skill-dumping is quite standard practice. You can get 30 by level 27. And yes, freeing up slots is exactly why I think Epic Mage Armor is worth it.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:30 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Allright, here is where I stand now-
Azra-
L24 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer
1(W). +2, Dodge, Mobility 2(W). 3(W). +1 Spell Focus: Conjuration 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Shield Proficiency 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Skill Focus: Hide 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Skill Focus: Move Silently, Spring Attack 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 Stealthy 19(SD). 20(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Greater Ruin, Epic Mage Armor 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Epic Skill Focus: Hide 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(W). +1 Epic Skill Focus: Move Silently
(Can Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration be taken at L20???)
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:33 PM |
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Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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I'd play that. But you still have Spring Attack in there. Why? It's not required for Shadowdancer, and it doesn't actually do anything. You're immune to AoE's from moving thanks to your Tumble, anyway.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:36 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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IronAngel wrote: I'd play that. But you still have Spring Attack in there. Why? It's not required for Shadowdancer, and it doesn't actually do anything. You're immune to AoE's from moving thanks to your Tumble, anyway. Immune??? 
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:38 PM |
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Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Whenever you move in combat, you provoke attacks of opportunity. Tumble is a skill that lets you roll to avoid these attacks. However, the DC is not the attacker's Attack Roll. The DC is a fixed 15, meaning 14 ranks will always pass the check even if you roll 1.
Spring Attack makes it so you don't provoke attacks of opportunity, it has no other benefit. And since you'll nicely avoid those attacks anyway, it's pointless.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:40 PM |
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Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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Do you need the SD HIPS for RP or as greater sanctuary substitute? Anyway, you still want 1 great INT otherwise your INT would be uneven at level 30 and that hurts.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:42 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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hendrack wrote: Do you need the SD HIPS for RP or as greater sanctuary substitute? Anyway, you still want 1 great INT otherwise your INT would be uneven at level 30 and that hurts. So take one less Int, maybe. 20 Int is quite enough if you're not casting a lot of offensive spells with DCs. And there's not much of that in Conjuration. This is a cool niche build that won't be an optimal spellcaster, but I think you'll do just fine with only 20 Intelligence and 24 CL.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:53 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Yes, this character is basically a sneaky summoner, not an offensive caster. 20 INT will do me just fine I think, maybe I can get more DEX that way and have more AC. I'll take out Spring Attack since I don't seem to need it. hendrack wrote: Do you need the SD HIPS for RP or as greater sanctuary substitute? Both. Just a couple questions- 1. Can Epic Spell Focus be taken at L20 or not? 2. Do I need high Concentration for the use of the spell Black Blade of Disaster?
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 22:55 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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Its late, mixed up assassin and SD. Unless the HIPS is so essential for roleplay, I'd skip SD alltogether, make something like a 25 wiz 4 fighter 1 rogue with 20 INT (Iron is right there about spell DC being not necessary), rest into STR and make a corner sneaking guy with quarterstaff EWS on tenser's steroids. Armor skin, tumble, EMA and -ASF armor makes quite enough AC. That'd be some cool build instead of all the pseudo-GS HIPSing wizards. I'll just do that sometime in the future. The literal old gnome wizard fart hiding in the bush and whacking you on the head from behind with his walking stick.
Epic spell focus can be taken at wiz 21+. BBoD does not take concentration into account, its still useful for casting spells while taking damage though.
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:18 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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keep the SD
No concentration is needed for BBOD because it checks every round to see if your character is concentrating via his actions. If your hasted you can build up an action queue like this: Spell/emote/spell/emote/spell/emote and cast with BBOD w/o breaking the check. If you time it right. (Spell/heal kit/spell/heal kit) also is easy to use.
That said~ If your a mage, you want at least maxed concentration skill wise.. Trust me. Or you wont be able to cast ANYTHING if something hostile reaches you. And you will be very vulnerable to taunts (Spell failure and reduced AC)
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:20 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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Quote: No concentration is needed for BBOD because it checks every round to see if your character is concentrating via his actions. If your hasted you can build up an action queue like this: Spell/emote/spell/emote/spell/emote and cast with BBOD w/o breaking the check. If you time it right. And that, Sir, is an exploit.
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Allright, this time with 1 level of Fighter-
Azra-
L23 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer L1 Fighter
*Only 5 Tumble ranks as a WIZ *10 ranks in Hide, and 8 ranks in Move Silently (pre SD) *Tumble Dump to 15 ranks when SD (or 20 if possible) *Get Spellcraft to 26
1(W). +2, Dodge, Mobility 2(W). 3(W). +1 Spell Focus: Conjuration 4(W). 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Toughness 7(W). 8(W). 9(W). +1 Skill Focus: Hide 10(W). +1 Maximize Spell 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Skill Focus: Move Silently, Stealthy 16(W). 17(W). 18(W). +1 (?) 19(SD). 20(W). +1 (?) 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(W). 24(W). +2 Epic Spell Focus: Conjuration, Epic Mage Armor 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +1 Greater Ruin 28(SD). 29(SD). 30(F). +2 Epic Skill Focus: Hide, Epic Skill Focus: Move Silently
I needed the extra epic feat so I can get both ESF: Hide, and ESF: MS, just still pondering what to choose for those two pre-epic feats.
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:29 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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You don't get Epic Skill Focus as a Fighter bonus feat, though. On a Ranger you would. Why don't you try it out in game? You can use console commands to level up easily enough, or download a test module. I use this: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=mo ... il&id=4215
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:32 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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Quote: And that, Sir, is an exploit. Its listed in the NWN wiki and a common and valid tactic as far as im concerned. Dont like it? Guess someone should fix a script for it then. Murex, personally with that build i'd lean more towards dropping the fighter and sticking with the 24wiz. Max your spellcraft, max your concentration, max your tumble, max your hide/ms. You can stick with just ESF hide and be alright w/o the esf MS.
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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hendrack
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:36 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Location: Vienna
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Palemaster wrote: Quote: And that, Sir, is an exploit. Its listed in the NWN wiki and a common and valid tactic as far as im concerned. Dont like it? Guess someone should fix a script for it then. Some things cannot be fixed in a feasable way. Just because the NWNwiki posts exploits doesn't mean you can use them to circumvent intentional behavior of spells on Amia. 
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Murex
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Posted: Sat, Nov 20 2010, 23:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Allright, Ranger instead of Fighter. I want high Move Silently and Hide. Thanks for the test module btw, I'll use it.
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 1:38 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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Quote: Some things cannot be fixed in a feasable way. By your logic then, anyone casting any spell with BBOD summoned is using an exploit. Besides, an eight year old with a crayon could implement a script to change BBOD if it is infact considered an exploit. That said, I still disagree that its an exploit.
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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Ulir
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 3:29 AM |
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Player
Joined: 09 Mar 2009
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At level 20 you get nothing, since you have 19 wiz levels and one SD level.
11 feats pre-epic if you go 19 wiz/1 sd and 12 feats pre-epic if you go 20 wiz. All about what you might need in pre-epic really. At level 21 with 21 wiz levels you can pick a strong summon to help you. If you go 20 wiz/1 SD, you will have two epic feats, but may not pick an epic summon until level 24, since you need to have 21 caster levels to gain an epic spell (differs with pale masters). The time from 21-24 is not really that long on Amia, if you find a bloodthirsty group.
Like this perhaps?
1 Wiz - Feats: Toughness, Dodge 2 Wiz 3 Wiz - Feat: Mobility 4 Wiz 5 Wiz - Meta: Extend Spell 6 Wiz - Feat: SF: Conj 7 Wiz 8 Wiz 9 Wiz - Feat: GSF: Conj 10 Wiz - Meta: Empower Spell 11 Wiz 12 Wiz - Feat: SF: X school/SF: Hide/Spell Penetration 13 Wiz 14 Wiz 15 Wiz - Feat: GSF: X school/SF: MS/Greater Spell Penetration, Meta: Maximize Spell 16 Wiz 17 Wiz 18 Wiz - Great Fortitude 19 SD 20 Wiz 21 Wiz - Feats: Great Int or ESF: X school (one of the feats has to be from the epic wiz feat list), ESF: Hide 22 SD 23 SD 24 Wiz - Feat: Epic Spell: Mummy Dust or Epic Dragon Knight Rider 25 SD 26 SD 27 Wiz - Feat: Epic Mage Armor (remember 26 spellcraft) 28 SD - Tumble Dump, HiPS 29 Ranger - Feat: ESF: Conj (has to be an epic spell focus feat. The others are not that interesting for casters), Hide/MS Dump etc. 30 Wiz - Feats: Greater Ruin or Hellball, ESF: MS
_________________ 
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Murex
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 5:25 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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After using that mod, I have come to this conclusion-
Azra-
L23 Wizard L6 Shadowdancer L1 Ranger *Only 5 Tumble ranks as a WIZ *Get 10 ranks in Hide, and 8 ranks in Move Silently *Tumble Dump when SD *Get Spellcraft to 26
1(W). +2, Dodge, Mobility 2(W). 3(W). +1 Toughness 4(W). 17 INT 5(W). +1 Extend Spell 6(W). +1 Spell Focus: Necromancy 7(W). 8(W). 18 INT 9(W). +1 Stealthy 10(W). +1 Shield Proficiency 11(W). 12(W). +1 Greater Spell Focus: Necromancy 19 INT 13(W). 14(W). 15(W). +2 Skill Focus: Move Silently, Skill Focus: Hide 16(W). 20 INT 17(W). 18(W). +1 Maximize Spell 19(W). 20(W). +1 Craft Wand 17 DEX 21(W). +1 Mummy Dust 22(SD). 23(SD). 24(W). +1 Epic Spell Focus: Necromancy 18 DEX 25(SD). 26(SD). 27(W). +2 Greater Ruin, Epic Mage Armor 28(SD). 19 DEX 29(SD). 30(R). +2 Epic Skill Focus: Hide, Epic Skill Focus: Move Silently
Thanks for all the help everyone!
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Murex
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 5:52 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Since I'm here, I may as well get some questions answered (unrelated to previous posts).
1. Is the spell Finger of Death a Touch attack?
2. At what level do Palemasters become immune to death magic? (or do they?)
3. What are the rules on getting the Winterwight? (32nd–33rd CL ???)
4. Does the +2 AC from Armor Skin stack with the effects of the spell Epic Mage Armor?
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TheCortroy
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 5:57 AM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Jan 2008 Location: With my [AK]-47
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Murex wrote: Since I'm here, I may as well get some questions answered (unrelated to previous posts).
1. Is the spell Finger of Death a Touch attack?
2. At what level do Palemasters become immune to death magic? (or do they?)
3. What are the rules on getting the Winterwight? (32nd–33rd CL ???)
4. Does the +2 AC from Armor Skin stack with the effects of the spell Epic Mage Armor? 1. No, it is not. 2. They don't become immune to death magic, only Crits, Sneaks, and Stuns. 3. Becoming a PM adds +2 CL to your stuff, allowing you to get Winterwight. I would add further explanation, but I'm not entirely sure. 4. Yes. (I think, at least.)
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Palemaster
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 6:17 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Oct 2010
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Sounds like it'll be a pretty decent powerbuild. Should be sauce in most pvp situations. Enjoy!
_________________ The Old Man ~ Tribe of the Damned
All comments above are strictly the biased opinion of a player.
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Ulir
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Posted: Sun, Nov 21 2010, 6:20 AM |
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Player
Joined: 09 Mar 2009
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If you have fx 10 levels wizard and 19 levels of pale master, you have a caster level of 29. Add the +3 that the Summon Greater Undead gives you as a pale master and you're at caster level 32 and can summon a Winterwight. So, you can basically not use more than one level on another class, without losing the Winterwight. 20 wiz/10 pm fx would give you caster level of 33. Check out the "Summons" section. Remember that +1 ecl would mean that you have to use all your levels on pm and wiz or pm and sorcerer. Wiz fits best though, since high int makes your arm attacks stronger.
Armor skin stacks with everything. Only selectable once from the epic feat list.
_________________ 
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