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I'd like to suggest making Tumble +1 AC per 10 ranks instead of 5. As it is now, it's too good to NOT make a build that gets it for the +6 AC total and I feel dropping it down to +3 AC total would far more "fair" given the relatively low skillpoint invest needed to get it. It'd also make it less punishing to make a build that doesn't get tumble as a class skill as they could still get 10 tumble and miss out on 2 AC from it, instead of 3 as it is now AND perhaps encourage a bit more build diversity.

As is, it's probably the biggest must have in the game and I don't really feel that's a good thing, with discipline at a close second place on the list.

30 Skill points isn't a 'low investment' unless you have a character with excessively high intelligence.

I'd have to disagree here, AC is UBER important on Amia, and any way to keep it high is a good thing. As was said, 30 points is not a minimal investment for most fighter types, especially if you want discipline too. I'd rather not see AC's go down.

Also have to disagree. If you knock down the AC many manage to fit into their builds, what's to compensate for AB? And as things stand, it's not hard finding -some- way to hit someone even if they have full tumble. Rather than make it less punishing for a no tumble build, it's punishing everyone else who wants it.

This is my personal view of things, but maybe some share it. . . ! While this is a purely RP server, there is still a mechanical aspect to the game that can't be ignored. Everyone has the same chances to build anything they want, when starting fresh. I think it's reasonable to say that most character RP concepts can have a strong build tailored around them.

The entire server has been built around those AC points existing and it would become a nightmare to go back through and adjust everything on the server.

Now with that said I know someone has suggested in the past of allowing parry to act like tumble with AC. They both wouldn't stack obviously and it would open up a lot more flexibility where rogue wasn't always required.

Maverick00053 wrote:

The entire server has been built around those AC points existing and it would become a nightmare to go back through and adjust everything on the server.

Now with that said I know someone has suggested in the past of allowing parry to act like tumble with AC. They both wouldn't stack obviously and it would open up a lot more flexibility where rogue wasn't always required.

Interesting concept. Long as they don't stack, yeah, would be great!

I like that concept with parry doing it as well and whichever base is higher applies the AC.. but I don't think either is doeable as it might be hardcoded.

They did it on PoTM.

Ah thats who it was, PotM. They have a really nifty Parry system..

Yeah that is a good setup and it has been discussed beforehand. I think the bladesinger feat has something similar that is already scripted on Amia?

Or the Improved Parry feat could be modified into something like that. I think Improved Parry is already on the useless feat list that will or needs to be modified. Although I'm not sure if there is an agenda to do that.

No making parry useless! I have parry builds with epic dodge that loves it.
If anything, I'd say ADD the AC thing to Parry and let the greater base value decide the AC.. Or maybe let them be combined but capped at +6?
I dunno, I just think the uncapped AC gained by it is silly as it makes it a MUST HAVE for anyone that doesn't run around invisible all the time or thrives off low AC.

And since it doesn't fit in with how tumble works in pnp at all, it just seems this was added on for REASONS, same as the other things that doesn't line up compared to pnp in nwn.
Maybe change parry to work with it as I suggested above and/or do the same for spellcraft but make it deflection so mages can get some of that loving too without multiclassing just for the AC's sake. As long as there's multiple sources to gain AC from a skill that everyone has access to with the skillpoints, and as long as that doesn't stack, I think it would be far more "fair" for everyone involved, since pulling it completely would require a crap ton of rebalancing.

My Parry thing i would expect would be in addition to Parrys current flawed effect.

Gravemaskin wrote:

I'd like to suggest making Tumble +1 AC per 10 ranks instead of 5. As it is now, it's too good to NOT make a build that gets it for the +6 AC total and I feel dropping it down to +3 AC total would far more "fair" given the relatively low skillpoint invest needed to get it. It'd also make it less punishing to make a build that doesn't get tumble as a class skill as they could still get 10 tumble and miss out on 2 AC from it, instead of 3 as it is now AND perhaps encourage a bit more build diversity.

As is, it's probably the biggest must have in the game and I don't really feel that's a good thing, with discipline at a close second place on the list.

Curious as to what your experience is with plain old sword and boarders? Over the years, I've made a few and can say that having a max AC of 52 to 55 is pretty abyssmal. Now you'd like to drop that to 50 to 52.

Yeah, no. Diversity? It just further ensures those characters get less play.

I'd say giving the full bab classes the means to get that AC without tumble dumps is the ticket. Like the parry idea, though I'd say just giving a point of AC for every five ranks like tumble does would be better, considering parry's limitations.

Making Tumble more humble?

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