AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

I vote we change the term PvP (Player vs Player), to CvC (Character vs Character).

Being a role-play server, it seems more fitting. The characters are the ones experiencing what we make them do. I can see on an arena server, where the Players are pitting their builds against each other. That, in my opinion, is PvP.

Another reason, is more subliminal. Always thinking about the combat being Player vs Player, in your mind, may have some affect. Actively thinking of it in terms of Character vs Character, might help, in some small way, to calm some of the tensions.

Other servers call it CvC.... I agree with the intent, but, honestly, it doesn't change much.

"CvC" is cute, but PvP is a wider term that is used across multiple games and genres to refer to a specific activity. The questionable psychological impact of trying to use an alternate term is not worth the potential confusion when writing rules or discussing topics. PvP is a much more intuitive term for most gamers simply because of its ubiquity in the hobby.

We could always put a little blurb about it in our rules, once they get reformed. "While it is called PvP due to the broad nature of online games, it may be beneficial to think of it as 'CvC', character vs character, on Amia."

I'd never expect people to change their nomenclature. It would just get bulky and confusing. Reminding people that you're fighting the character and not the player should be enough, rather than trying to adapt a new term that empirically will mean the same thing for a lot of us.

NinjaClarinet wrote:

"CvC" is cute, but PvP is a wider term that is used across multiple games and genres to refer to a specific activity. The questionable psychological impact of trying to use an alternate term is not worth the potential confusion when writing rules or discussing topics. PvP is a much more intuitive term for most gamers simply because of its ubiquity in the hobby.

Mhmm, I'm well aware of this.
Still, it 'is' a role-play server. *shrugs*

Yeah keep it PvP everyone knows the term, changing it seems kind of pointless as I know most people will just keep saying PvP.

Dark Immolation wrote:

We could always put a little blurb about it in our rules, once they get reformed. "While it is called PvP due to the broad nature of online games, it may be beneficial to think of it as 'CvC', character vs character, on Amia."

I'd never expect people to change their nomenclature. It would just get bulky and confusing. Reminding people that you're fighting the character and not the player should be enough, rather than trying to adapt a new term that empirically will mean the same thing for a lot of us.

This, yes. I'll make note to alter the wording accordingly.

That's a great idea, thanks for the suggestion, and the action taken with it.

If we are going for "accurate" abbreviations really it should be "PBMWTRPTJPVP vs RPBATIARPSSCPVPFS" standing for "powerbultmunchkinwithtokenroleplaytojustifyplayervsplayer" vs "roleplaybuildasthisisaroleplayserversocantplayervsplayerforshit"

Just my 50p worth :lol:

That's not helpful. At all.

And you are grossly incorrect on your assumptions, on both sides of the coin.

To be honest, even if it was changed to CvC I would probably still call it PVP out of habit since that is what it is called in virtually every other game.

Naivatkal wrote:

That's not helpful. At all.

And you are grossly incorrect on your assumptions, on both sides of the coin.

A.) It was a funny not to be taken seriously

B.) Not as incorrect as you might think!

C.) But still a tongue in cheek bit of fun.

Given the climate currently, things can be taken wrongly. ON top of that, I believe you've lamented about 'munchkin builds' enough to warrant the belief you were being serious. You have a large enough chip on your shoulder as it relates to PvP that you should take care of your words as you come off, often, as a toxic personality. And the term 'munchkin' is rather demeaning, if we are to be honest.

And, as someone who has been on all four sides of the PvP equation, you are still incorrect.

For clarity's sake I believe this is pretty reasonable, I also subscribe to the thought that this sort of division shouldn't need to be made. I can't believe we have to have a conversation about this. It's silly and if we do have to have this conversation we've got a bigger issue on hand such as disconnecting the player from the character, and understanding the dynamic and unpredictable nature of RP that gives it appeal versus writing your own stories with complete control.

It's just semantics honestly, and renaming it character versus character doesn't change the fact that two players of whatever skill levels determine the outcome through mechanical prowess.

Speaking as someone who has studied a fair bit of human nature, going with the CvC route, would likely have subliminal affects, yes. While it would be slow to catch on, humans are creatures of group think. As well, subtle undertones such as PvP and its correlation with games such as Battlefield, Call of Duty, League of Legends, and so forth presents that attitude that the players are doing the fighting and thus, angst is directed more playerside.

As well, simply because something "has been done for awhile" or is done widely on the internet does not mean it is the best choice.

As an example, someone might see the term who is new to the server and ask what that is. Thus, the mood is set that Amia sets out to do character against character, rather than player against player. Human psychology is such a fragile thing when it comes to influences from others.

---

In short, I would fully support a change to CvC and see if people pick up on it.

Last edited by VitalTouch on Sat, Feb 07 2015, 7:00 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Naivatkal wrote:

Given the climate currently, things can be taken wrongly. ON top of that, I believe you've lamented about 'munchkin builds' enough to warrant the belief you were being serious.

Except for the ~obvious~ overstatement of silliness in those abbreviations and I've no idea what "current climate" you are referring to in relation to my post, because its a dumb joke and nothing more.
However that if the "current climate" you are referring to is the spate of posts and feelings about player/DM relations, I would suggest that the apparent chip on ~your~ shoulder that made you blow up a stupid obvious silly comment into massive over reaction post, well that's maybe something you need to think over?

Naivatkal wrote:

You have a large enough chip on your shoulder as it relates to PvP that you should take care of your words as you come off, often, as a toxic personality.

That "chip" you refer to is actual experience, and I will talk serious in serious threads as much as I wish thank you very much and if you wish to view my distain of pvp with your own distain I guess that's fair enough really but to label it as a chip on my shoulder is demeaning of my point of view. And I challenge you to find anyone who has role played with me and/or spoken with me OOCly who would define me as having a toxic personality.

I take great care with my words and when I am being serious in a serious thread I believe I do my best to make my points as clear as possible and the rationale behind them , I don't expect everyone to agree with my points of view but labelling my views as "toxic" well fuck you very much to be honest.
Now ~that~ was toxic and no I am not telling you to "go fuck yourself" I was using that phrase to demonstrate what toxic looks like as you seem to be confused, please advise me where in any of my posts do I talk to people like that to warrant you mislabelling me "toxic"?

I suggest with all due respect that you get over yourself, if you disagree with anything I say in serious posts on serious topics feel free to put fourth your counter points and arguments and reasoning as I try to do.
However if you don't get or understand my stupid tongue in cheek and obviously humorous posts or even don't find them funny, fair enough to just ignore them. What do you expect to achieve by making a confrontation out of it?

Naivatkal wrote:

And the term 'munchkin' is rather demeaning, if we are to be honest.

So what if it is, anyone coming to a role play server with the express intent to powerbuild in order to grief the hell out of non-powerbuilds ~is~ a munchkin and I call them as such. Also,...Calling someone "Toxic" is rather demeaning, but that didn't stop you...did it.

Also FYI http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=munchkin

Naivatkal wrote:

And, as someone who has been on all four sides of the PvP equation, you are still incorrect.

As someone who has experienced pvp munchkinness, seen pvpmunchkinness and knows players and characters who are munchkins I am correct in what I have said, and whilst I am sure there are those that indulge in more relevant RP pvp this does not alter the fact of munchkin existence.

Sorry if you feel this is inappropriate given the "current climate" but you push me, I'll push back

P.S. if you really had an issue with my alleged "toxicity" then perhaps a private message starting a dialogue would have been better rather than trying to drag my name through the mud publicly, requiring me to offer rebuttal publicly.

I have to agree that calling it CvC likely won't do much. People will always call it PvP, and sadly some won't realize it's actually CvC regardless of the name. Though it could take over in dominance over time, indeed. Just depends on how much we continue to use CvC or slip into the old patterns again, heh.

It's merely a matter of perception.
I cannot be argued to bullshit a proper explanation how this would actually affect at all the community, but I'll just be cheesy and say "it will".

It's not really a big enough deal to warrant a drawn out discussion like this guys

at least from my perspective. It's a 5 minute change, so it's worth it even if there's only a chance of it helping

Yuh, that is true. All we can do is make the change and perhaps try to consciously use CvC instead and see if it permeates into the server :3

I don't see the point in using a different abbreviation for what is essentially the same thing. Just stick to PvP.

Regards
Monkey Business

CvC megusta

PvP Name Change

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