But many deity rings does not have OOC limitations. Very contradicting.
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| OOC Limitations on Deity rings https://www.amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65311 |
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| Author: | Mobile_Svensk [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 9:32 AM ] |
| Post subject: | OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
The OOC Limitations on Deity rings, Can we ignore them or not. Several posts half a year ago suggests we can. DM Answer preferred. YES / NO? Source 1 Source 2 Source 3 - This even says that you can not use ANY OOC Limitation gear with UMD Amia RULES say nothing IRonAngel wrote: OOC restrictions were removed from almost every item in game. They were left on the rings because it was very tricky and a lot of work to remove them (because they were generated somehow, or something? - and there were lots), but the OOC restriction on deity rings no longer means anything. OOC restrictions on any other items were simply missed/forgotten during the cleansing and should be reported, or they still have a purpose (which you'll find out by reporting). I guess it's best to adhere to OOC restrictions apart from deity rings until you know for sure whether they're intentional or forgotten. Just to clarify the matter because I think you heard it backwards. OOC restrictions on deity rings specifically no longer mean anything. (On anything else, I guess they do if they still exist but they shouldn't.) I don't think we agreed to keep any specific OOC restrictions when they were removed, though, so anything predating that should theoretically just be a forgotten relic. But as always, check with someone. PaladinOfSune wrote: No matter what's said in-game, the OOC restrictions only apply to: Deity rings Arcane Archer arrows Gunz wrote: OOC restrictions on the rings and most equipment (save for AA and SD gear, if I remember correctly) are dropped. It's just a mess to have to re do them and reissue them to everyone who has copies so we're kinda stuck with keeping it on.
But the best rule of thumb would be: When in doubt, ask a DM. |
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| Author: | O'Raghailligh [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 9:36 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
No, we can not. |
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| Author: | Mobile_Svensk [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 9:45 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Main post updated |
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| Author: | O'Raghailligh [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 9:51 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
PaladinOfSune wrote: No matter what's said in-game, the OOC restrictions only apply to: Deity rings Arcane Archer arrows That's the word to listen to, bro. |
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| Author: | Mobile_Svensk [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 10:51 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
You obviously didnt read the first post and the sources. |
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| Author: | Amarice-Elaraliel [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 11:01 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
TormakSaber wrote: There's noupdate needed. You cannot use UMD to bypass deity rings.
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| Author: | IronAngel [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 13:05 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Yes, my post was apparently mistaken. I believe I say so a few posts down in the topic you quoted from. The reason for the OOC restrictions is still partly OOC, mind; it was too much work to remove them, and it was a bit of a "whatever, guess they kinda make sense" concession. The deity rings aren't actually in the lootbins as I understand it, but somehow generated with a script and therefore hard to fix? |
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| Author: | Amarice-Elaraliel [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 13:21 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Can't be that reason only, because if it were you would be allowed to ignore the OOC message like with the other and/or older items who still have them. And you're not allowed to do that in case of the rings (by the current ruling, until/if it may ever change) |
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| Author: | IronAngel [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 14:57 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Amarice-Elaraliel wrote: Can't be that reason only, because if it were you would be allowed to ignore the OOC message like with the other and/or older items who still have them. And you're not allowed to do that in case of the rings (by the current ruling, until/if it may ever change) The thing is, we removed those restrictions from everything else. If there are some items, they are holdovers that haven't been gotten around to, but should/will be changed sometime in the future. Ideally, anyway. If there is an item with an unwarranted OOC restriction, report it and it may be changed. But since it would be better to stick with WYSIWYG, it is convenient to keep the rule applying to deity rings. It is true there was some preference in the team to keep the restrictions on those for flavor or lore reasons. However, those reasons were not valid as I showed back then and would have continued to argue. But (unless I'm completely remembering wrong) Disco's executive call not to remove those restrictions kinda made the argument moot, and it was dropped. Doesn't mean the IC/lore argument was correct, just that people weren't particularly motivated to review a case with few practical consequences. So yes: the original idea between those rings was probably that people shouldn't adorn themselves with symbols of conflicting faiths and reap the boons. However, there's no real lore reason why magic items, of clerical make or not, would react to UMD any differently than arcane items. And the gods certainly don't personally keep track of those dime-in-a-dozen symbols. So it's not like there was some compelling lore reason to keep them restricted. Some people just thought it was cool and appropriate, it was a hassle to remove them, and all in all it wasn't that big a deal. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Fri, Apr 13 2012, 15:53 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Yeah the deity ring restrictions are left more or less because of the hassle from removing the bio from a few dozen different items. It's already been established that the deity rings aren't anything super-uber-particularly important to the deity. I.E. you could destroy some and it wouldn't even register on the respective deity's "radar." They're not artifacts or anything. |
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| Author: | Mobile_Svensk [ Sun, Apr 15 2012, 22:23 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
But many deity rings does not have OOC limitations. Very contradicting. |
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| Author: | Amarice-Elaraliel [ Sun, Apr 15 2012, 22:31 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Gond simply allows all alignments. He also isn't very picky race wise! http://amiawiki.shatuga.com/index.php/Gond |
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| Author: | Innuendo [ Sun, Apr 15 2012, 22:45 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
With the new buyout caps on stores, why not make all deity rings custom value at like 103268236 coins, effectively preventing any amount of UMD from working on them...? I think most of them are tier four loot, but if not, they should all be tier four so the (lowbie) economy wouldn't really be affected in slightest. It'd still be more profitable to sell them to PC's, instead of NPC's. Just a suggestion, anyway. I know I accidentally wore a Golden Ring of Bahamut on one of my toons even after he was turned CE from CN, he has enough UMD to wear almost anything in the module(?). I didn't even realize I was doing it, until I was randomly checking on my gear to see what I could improve upon, after which I promptly tossed the ring away into one of my many magical bags. |
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| Author: | Naivatkal [ Sun, Apr 15 2012, 23:47 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Innuendo wrote: With the new buyout caps on stores, why not make all deity rings custom value at like 103268236 coins, effectively preventing any amount of UMD from working on them...? I think most of them are tier four loot, but if not, they should all be tier four so the (lowbie) economy wouldn't really be affected in slightest. It'd still be more profitable to sell them to PC's, instead of NPC's. Just a suggestion, anyway. I know I accidentally wore a Golden Ring of Bahamut on one of my toons even after he was turned CE from CN, he has enough UMD to wear almost anything in the module(?). I didn't even realize I was doing it, until I was randomly checking on my gear to see what I could improve upon, after which I promptly tossed the ring away into one of my many magical bags. I like this. It would solve that issue, and make it easy for people to know they cannot wear something. |
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| Author: | DerkDerkistan [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 1:37 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
I'd guess that would raise the same issue as just removing the OOC tag from them. |
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| Author: | Naivatkal [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 1:53 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
DerkDerkistan wrote: I'd guess that would raise the same issue as just removing the OOC tag from them. What would that issue be? The correct people would still be able to use them, and since UMD cannot bypass rings, it shouldn't matter. Asking cause I could be missing something haha |
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| Author: | Gers [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 1:57 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Far as I'm aware, the deitys rings *do* follow the OOC rules. Do not equip them unless you fit what they say. Or you'll be smote from on high (or on low, depending on the deity involved). |
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| Author: | corypx [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 1:57 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Innuendo wrote: With the new buyout caps on stores, why not make all deity rings custom value at like 103268236 coins, effectively preventing any amount of UMD from working on them...? but mistakes happen, towns and NPCs get updated....you can never be to sure what might get messed up. just look at the tome of Mystra problem we had and all the work the time spent by DMs to attempt to correct that. there is a chance that if they make a item have a sell value of 10mil or something that befor they can fix it some A-hole might exploit that flaw. |
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| Author: | Naivatkal [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 2:04 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
corypx wrote: Innuendo wrote: With the new buyout caps on stores, why not make all deity rings custom value at like 103268236 coins, effectively preventing any amount of UMD from working on them...? but mistakes happen, towns and NPCs get updated....you can never be to sure what might get messed up. just look at the tome of Mystra problem we had and all the work the time spent by DMs to attempt to correct that. there is a chance that if they make a item have a sell value of 10mil or something that befor they can fix it some A-hole might exploit that flaw. Could also make it so that NPCs won't buy them, but that you can trash them still. |
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| Author: | Ulir [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 2:50 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
I recall that OOC restrictions applies to deity rings and AA arrows only, for a good reason. They are magical items representing the gods, so it makes sense that you do not equip a ring of Velsharoon when being a paladin, or using a ring of Lathander when being an evil necromancer, just because you like the magical abilities of the ring. Unless you want to punished by the god, cursed or whatnot. They can be worn by potential followers of course (those that live up to the requirements of said ring). Would be a shame to remove the OOC restrictions of the deity rings. And silly too. |
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| Author: | NinjaClarinet [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 3:03 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
I thought the lore behind the rings was that they were just collectible magic trinkets, and not actually affiliated in any sort of official fashion with churches or deities? |
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| Author: | Naivatkal [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 3:09 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
NinjaClarinet wrote: I thought the lore behind the rings was that they were just collectible magic trinkets, and not actually affiliated in any sort of official fashion with churches or deities? I've seen it said a few times by DMs that they are essentially a pittance in the eyes of the deity they represent. But, at the same time, I would think that certain followers of certain deities wouldn't wear the rings of certain other deities. So, really, the closest we can get is a blanket OOC guideline like this. |
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| Author: | Yossarin [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 3:10 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Never listen to Ulir, who has failed in reading the Lore forum. |
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| Author: | DerkDerkistan [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 3:29 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Naivatkal wrote: DerkDerkistan wrote: I'd guess that would raise the same issue as just removing the OOC tag from them. What would that issue be? The correct people would still be able to use them, and since UMD cannot bypass rings, it shouldn't matter. Asking cause I could be missing something haha The issue of going into the toolset and fixing every single one to reflect the change. Everything I've read indicates that as the reason why the OOC restriction is still on the rings. Personally, I'm a big fan of the OOC restriction; Not because of the "it's a symbol of another god, so a paladin wearing a Velsharoon ring would be smited" thing. It's more simple. It keeps players and their characters honest. Why would a paladin wear such a symbol, even if he could? The RP should always be greater than the mechanics of it. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 19:18 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
DerkDerkistan wrote: Personally, I'm a big fan of the OOC restriction; Not because of the "it's a symbol of another god, so a paladin wearing a Velsharoon ring would be smited" thing. It's more simple. It keeps players and their characters honest. Why would a paladin wear such a symbol, even if he could? The RP should always be greater than the mechanics of it. But that's what Alignment restrictions are for. A divine class wearing an opposing divine item could be "smited" all the same for wearing the thing without an OoC restriction at all. The problem with making it an OoC restriction however makes it look as if it is an OoC infraction, when in fact, it should not be. It makes it look as if you're breaking some server rule, rather than you just getting you just desserts for something you have done IC. |
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| Author: | DerkDerkistan [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 19:35 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
What I meant was, you can wear any ring you want and nobody but DMs can tell. If the OOC restriction is removed, then it's up to only the DMs to police characters, when something like this could be very interestingly done peer to peer, so to speak. "Hey, Goody McPaladin. Why are you wearing that ring of Velsharoon? You know that's blasphemy, right?" If the ruling already was that the rings are not holy symbols and are just trinkets for collectors or whatnot, then if the OOC restriction is lifted, that seems to preclude the people that might wear such blaspheming things from having any repercussions at all. My paladin could wear a Velsharoon ring and others -should- be able to see it, but unless I emote anything about it, nobody will know. That is what I meant by keeping players and characters honest. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 21:01 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
Maybe it's just me, but that seems like babysitting. There are plenty of much, much eviler items out there with only alignment restrictions that would get you fallen even faster than a silly little ring. There are robes made out of celestial skin, rods from undead bones, etc etc that no goodie wears for the same exact reason they wouldn't wear a ring of Velsharoon. The only difference is that the ring has a pretty little picture of a crowned skull on it and an OoC wag-of-the-finger. Even more, in the case of evil weapons and clothing, you can completely modify the appearance and name, and just like the ring, no one would be able to tell unless you emote it. I understand where you're coming from, but it's not like that can't already happen with other items. And given that it has always been that these little bands are not artifacts, it really makes no sense in comparison to other things just as(if not more so) axiomatically taboo without an OoC restriction. |
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| Author: | TormakSaber [ Mon, Apr 16 2012, 23:14 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: OOC Limitations on Deity rings |
they have them, they're not moving, end of argument. |
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