AMIA ARCHIVE :: View topic - New monkey grip rules

DC Cost: 18 (15 for the skinchanger widget, 3 DC's for the mechanical change to your weapon, 3 DC's for any subsequent weapon changes outside of DC requested weapons)

Plus all that shield AC... Mmm... Sweet sweet AC.

It's a lot of Dc's ...Just saying

You can ask now. Its actually in effect now and Yaston is level 30 so just ask a DM to make a copy of your sword and apply the negatives you choose.

Can the Monkey Grip process be reversed? I mean, can you make a one-handed weapon to become two-handed with the STR bonus?

Also, don't bother being smart and trying to bypass the penalties by applying positives bonuses to a DC Weapon request. I know at least three DM's who'll turn you down on the spot for doing that.

There are magical staves which offer almost the same stats as a quarterstaff, but can be wielded by small and medium races alike. I would go for one of those instead.

Yep, no STR requirement however I myself will be coming down hard upon any MG requests that don't have a reasonable IC reason for the weapon they are requesting. I'm strong, or I trained in it, isn't good enough in my book for greatsword, greataxe, heavy flail or other gigantic weapons such as those. Helberd, spear or other more commonly used weapons with shields, sure, but the weapons that don't usually get used with a shield? Nah. Better have a good reason for it.

*Cough* -2DEX for a WM ain't really ...An issue? Since they all need 13 DEX.

Lawl. It's been changed to -4 DEX. OK

I'm wondering about the requirements for Monkey grip. For example, someone with STR MAX 26-27 can try a request for it ?

Yep, no STR requirement. . .

New question!
Can you MG two-bladed weapons?

Author:	Mobile_Svensk [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 15:12 PM ]
Post subject:	New monkey grip rules
Hey! Mosh or any other DM - Could you explain in detail what the changes are about? The Link leaves a lot of questionmarks. What are really the benfits mechanically of having Monkeygrip nowdays? There's a whole lot of negative scores applied. What does 'Bonded weapon mean' ? Quote: DC Cost: 18 (15 for the skinchanger widget, 3 DC's for the mechanical change to your weapon, 3 DC's for any subsequent weapon changes outside of DC requested weapons) What does the mechanical change mean? Is it the negative stats applied to it that costs? Will you only be able to wield one weapon? Or just one 'Type'? Im sure there's more questions that spring up soon.

Author:	Naivatkal [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 15:18 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
There's only two negative changes applied, you pick one from each list. Which is nice, since it lets you tailor your char a little more by deciding what he/she will neglect while training with the weapon. From the reading, it seems 'bonded weapon' is in essence like 'Weapon of Choice' whereas the char is basically becoming closer to their fighting style with that weapon and perfecting their use of it. But there's no benefit from being bonded other than what is stipulated with Monkey Grip (unless you go WM or something). The mech change is likely the negatives being applied for the balance reasons. That's my impression from the post =D

Author:	MoshingChris [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 16:04 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Naiv got it right basically. If you want to Monkey Grip a weapon, you pay three DC's to have it modified to Monkey Grip stats. You can have as many Monkey Grip weapons as you want, but you pay 3 DC's for each one you modify. The benefit of Monkey Grip now-a-days. Aesthetics. Bonded Weapon means the weapon you have trained to Monkey Grip with. The limit on Bonded Weapons is only as limited as to the amount of DC's you wish to spend appending Bonded Stats to those weapons. The benefits: On average 2 damage more on the die roll and a mythal slot on the weapon. The negatives: You can no longer get a 1.5str bonus from using Monkey Grip.

Author:	Mobile_Svensk [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 16:09 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
But that sort of defeats the purpose of spending ...18DC's on an average if it's purely Aesthetics? It's a lot of Dc's ...Just saying

Author:	Jes [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 16:12 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
What are you talking about? People spend a lot of DCs for aesthetics... Wings Tails Glowing Eyes Bottled Companions Reskins Polymorph reskins Weapon/Armor Appearances Leto Body Shaping Etc. I don't even want to know how many DCs I've spent on aesthetics! Really, it's not that big a shock. People do it alllll the time.

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Author:	DustSpray101 [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 16:20 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Plus all that shield AC... Mmm... Sweet sweet AC.

Author:	IronAngel [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 20:03 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
DustSpray101 wrote: Plus all that shield AC... Mmm... Sweet sweet AC. Not to mention the mythal slots a shield has.

Author:	Lutra [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 21:33 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Very_Svensk wrote: It's a lot of Dc's ...Just saying Not...it is not. I also have monkey grip and those penalties are quite reasonable, I would say and it is still cheap, though cheap might be a relative term here When can we ask the DMs IG for the change? It will be noted on the forum?

Author:	MoshingChris [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 21:35 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
You can ask now. Its actually in effect now and Yaston is level 30 so just ask a DM to make a copy of your sword and apply the negatives you choose.

Author:	Ulir [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 22:12 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Have been pondering to request MG for some time now and seeing the changes, I feel the urge to ask a few questions. Here goes. You will get half your strength modifier as a negative stat, to even out the 1.5 damage bonus of it, right? When unequipping a shield, would the 1.5 damage bonus still be nulled as I think it will, due to extentive training and concentrated focus of wielding it with a shield? Would I be able to pick up another weapon of similar type, or a different type two-hander for that matter and wield it with two-hands if I so choose (getting 1.5 damage bonus)? The price of a MG bonding will then be 18 DCs plus an additional 3 DCs if one wishes to add another mythal slot to the weapon (six powers total)? "3 DC's for any subsequent weapon changes outside of DC requested weapons". Does this mean that if you remythal your weapon slightly, you would need a DM to update the changes for the cost of 3 DCs or can only add and remove magics from the bonded weapon as one pleases? Where does the 2-4 bonus damage come from when no additional damage is applied (except from a new mythal slot)? Thanks in advance.

Author:	MoshingChris [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 22:27 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Its really not that difficult. You get your monkey grip widget that costs 15 DC's. You choose a weapon that you want to use as your Monkey Grip weapon. This weapon is permanantly altered to negative damage 1/2 your strength mod. You then choose two of the negatives from the list provided. This is your Monkey Grip weapon. You can two hand any weapon you please. You may only Monkey Grip with weapons that have the bonded stats on them. Two handed weapons have 5 Mythal Slots, 1 handers have 4 mythal slots. Ergo you have +1 Mythal slot when Monkey Gripping. The five mythal slot change on two handers was recent and with that change a whole bunch of players suddenly requested Monkey Grip. 2-4 damage comes from the fact you are Monkey Gripping a large weapon whose base damage is 1d10 - 2d6 for all two handers excluding Quaterstave and Spear. "3 DC's for any subsequent weapon changes outside of DC requested weapons" This means if you want to use another weapon as Monkey Gripped you have to pay 3 DC's to get the negative stats applied.

Author:	MoshingChris [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 23:43 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
I've update the topic in Requests: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=59475 Hopefully that sheds light on folks concerns.

Author:	Ulir [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 23:49 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Not to be an arse, but now it says -4 dex as a penalty. Is that on purpose? On another note. Aren't the penalties for quarterstaff and spear MG not kinda.. wild? Would one of the two penalties not be more appropriate, due to the fact they have a low base damage, compared to other weapons?

Author:	Lutra [ Mon, Jul 25 2011, 23:53 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
MoshingChris wrote: You can ask now. Its actually in effect now and Yaston is level 30 so just ask a DM to make a copy of your sword and apply the negatives you choose. Thanks! One more question: If I already have monkey grip do I have to make another request to get permission to hold another weapon? In my case Yaston tends to hold spears in his hand not for meele combat but he likes to throw it(at least I like to rp it) on big enemies before the meele engage.

Author:	Silvarus [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 8:53 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Monkey_Gri ... 5e_Feat%29 Aka. How to make your character look like a poorly designed anime character -feat.

Author:	Magiros [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 19:00 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Edited: Nevermind. A foolish question after reading the things over again.

Author:	TormakSaber [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 0:03 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Pay DCs or don't do it. I am actually quite disappointed because we approved it for your greatsword and you have been doing it for other weapons. That is actually grounds for the stripping of your item with no refund.

Author:	Lutra [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 0:13 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
:O nobody told me that restriction actually....or I was probably too lame to remember. This is why I asked to clarify it. I would pay the DCs of course, but mostly wanted to ask the drill regarding that. I really don't have bad intentions with that.

Author:	MoshingChris [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 0:21 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
-4 Dex was on purpose iirc. I just realised now that all MG'ers are likely to be STR based and many of them would be WM's. With -2 Dex its not really a penalty is it if you have 13 dex anyway.

Author:	PaladinOfSune [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 1:11 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
The weapon type is irrelevant, same penalties apply. No sense in complicating things.

Author:	Selvec Darkon [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 6:45 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Yea...that extra slots does a lot. Espeically since you can get +5 enchantment without giving up to much. What this probably means though, is that if your going to bond a weapon, you might as well save up your DC's to make the weapon worth having.

Author:	boobookittyscrew [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 8:50 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Hate to sound stupid but....what is monkey grip and why do they call it that? Do they hold the weapon with their feet or a prehensil tail or something?

Author:	Charles1810 [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 9:18 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
So there is no STR needed, does this mean a gnome wizard could get this so that he can finally have a one handed staff? Or will that be really frowned on?

Author:	Selmak [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 9:28 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
There are magical staves which offer almost the same stats as a quarterstaff, but can be wielded by small and medium races alike. I would go for one of those instead.

Author:	Selvec Darkon [ Tue, Jul 26 2011, 11:48 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Yep, no STR requirement however I myself will be coming down hard upon any MG requests that don't have a reasonable IC reason for the weapon they are requesting. I'm strong, or I trained in it, isn't good enough in my book for greatsword, greataxe, heavy flail or other gigantic weapons such as those. Helberd, spear or other more commonly used weapons with shields, sure, but the weapons that don't usually get used with a shield? Nah. Better have a good reason for it.

Author:	Lord Jarski [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 8:56 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
I got a question about this aswell. Can the Monkey Grip process be reversed? I mean, can you make a one-handed weapon to become two-handed with the STR bonus? It would make perfect sense to use a katana with both hands, but also say, scimitar or warhammer too. Any except the small and tiny weapons which are too small to be effectively used with both hands. Also, are other weapon modifications doable mechanics-wise? Like being able to dual-wield a pair of morningstars, light flails or whips? No idea if any of this is even possible, but it would certainly give more options for new characters that dont want to go on the traditional weapon+shield road.

Author:	TormakSaber [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 9:02 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Quote: Can the Monkey Grip process be reversed? I mean, can you make a one-handed weapon to become two-handed with the STR bonus? No.

Author:	Selvec Darkon [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 10:09 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Also, don't bother being smart and trying to bypass the penalties by applying positives bonuses to a DC Weapon request. I know at least three DM's who'll turn you down on the spot for doing that.

Author:	Mobile_Svensk [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 10:18 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Selvec Darkon wrote: Also, don't bother being smart and trying to bypass the penalties by applying positives bonuses to a DC Weapon request. I know at least three DM's who'll turn you down on the spot for doing that. Uh... what's the difference between doing that or drinking a potion?

Author:	PaladinOfSune [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 10:21 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Because the positive on the weapon would stack with the potion?

Author:	erroch [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 18:46 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Selmak wrote: There are magical staves which offer almost the same stats as a quarterstaff, but can be wielded by small and medium races alike. I would go for one of those instead. The bit I think he's going for is the magical staves count as two handed weapons for small races. Meaning if you want to be a gnome with a staff, you lose out on the off hand items.

Author:	PaladinOfSune [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 19:06 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Nope. It just means it's on the fighter bonus feat list. Edit: darn edits!

Author:	Blackdragon12121 [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 20:49 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Selvec Darkon wrote: Yep, no STR requirement however I myself will be coming down hard upon any MG requests that don't have a reasonable IC reason for the weapon they are requesting. I'm strong, or I trained in it, isn't good enough in my book for greatsword, greataxe, heavy flail or other gigantic weapons such as those. Helberd, spear or other more commonly used weapons with shields, sure, but the weapons that don't usually get used with a shield? Nah. Better have a good reason for it. Since when were halberds used with shields? This is news to me o.O.

Author:	Remal [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 21:13 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Very_Svensk wrote: Cough -2DEX for a WM ain't really ...An issue? Since they all need 13 DEX. Lawl. It's been changed to -4 DEX. OK Yes...so I have to choose between -2 ref AND -2 AC (-4 dex), and -2 ref....yeeeeeeah...even with 13 dex -2 dex puts it to 11, which means -1 ref and -1 AC. This will actually make me think to choose between this and -2 ref. -4 Dex? Yea sure.

Author:	Mobile_Svensk [ Mon, Aug 08 2011, 21:42 PM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
Aye. It sounds a bit stupid. -4 Dex = -2Reflex.

Author:	MoshingChris [ Tue, Aug 09 2011, 0:41 AM ]
Post subject:	Re: New monkey grip rules
I already fixed that I thought when it became available. Enjoy - 2 Reflex moves up to the first list - 2 Fort added the bottom list.