Awesome. More ways of making Blackguards the most meanest bastards on the game.
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| Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? https://www.amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=55479 |
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| Author: | Baden Ironblood [ Wed, Feb 09 2011, 15:24 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Extra Turn Undead is not available to Blackgaurds even though they have the ability to do so. Is this a basic game limitation that cannot be changed, or can a special request be made or a change made on the Amia server? If there was a logical reason why it is unavailable I'd like to know. Baden Ironblood |
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| Author: | Dramatic_Prince [ Wed, Feb 09 2011, 16:11 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Bioware didn't programme it in? With the hak it can be made a class feat. I think it's just so to punish low CHA BGs. |
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| Author: | Bravo21 [ Wed, Feb 09 2011, 17:17 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Bioware didn't delve into the intracasies of rebuking undead vs turning undead. BG's don't technically turn undead as they do not channel positive energy, being evil and all. But, since NWN doesn't support rebuking undead, BG's get limited turning and no extras. |
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| Author: | Selvec Darkon [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 12:18 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Where's my turn outsider? |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 12:57 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Selvec Darkon wrote: Where's my turn outsider? Right where you left your 25 Cha + 25 Wis cleric or paladin. |
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| Author: | Nekhy [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 13:18 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
I think Turn Outsider also requires the right domains. |
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| Author: | American_Knight [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 13:20 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Turn Outsider is given either as a feat for epics at 25 wisdom AND charisma, OR you can simply get Evil or Good domains. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 13:37 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Which is horribly skewed. Virtually free, if you pick one of 6 domains. An arm, a leg, and a cruddy build, if you want to get it any other way. I think Planar Turning should be changed to accept 25 Wis OR 25 Cha. Virtually no builds call for having 2 base stats that high on a lv30 cap world. And I'm not even sure if it's possible to get both stats that high by 30, even starting off with 18's and whoring CoT for Great Wisdom. Even if it is possible, it's certainly not worth it at that point. |
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| Author: | Nekhy [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 14:20 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
The domains that grant it aren't very good otherwise, though. |
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| Author: | MoshingChris [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 14:27 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Its still a Cleric though. We could disable domain spells completely and Clerics would still be pretty durned good. |
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| Author: | Selvec Darkon [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 15:14 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Nekhy wrote: The domains that grant it aren't very good otherwise, though. That sounds like a good reason right there to add it. Make people take the domain. Any encouragement to take domains over Travel and Plant has to be good. |
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| Author: | TormakSaber [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 20:22 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Yeah, and that encouragement will probably be "you can't get beyond the entry unless your domains (notice the plural) match." We can only hope, anyways. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 22:08 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Don't hope. We'd just see most clerics being made being a Maskarran/etc for no apparent reason..IC reason, at least. We can pick our poison. Some clerics being made with domains that make no relevant IC sense. Or many clerics being made with deities that make no relevant IC sense. |
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| Author: | PaladinOfSune [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 22:11 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
This topic is about clerics now? Extra Turning for BGs may be available in time. |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Thu, Feb 10 2011, 22:23 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Well the discussion was why blackguards couldn't get it like the other divine classes, so perhaps vicariously. I see no harm in it, other than the fact is it would just be going straight to fueling Divine Might/Shield, but such is the case with most classes that get Turn Undead. It's only really a problem for non-clerics that go BG. In which case, is it really so horrible you get shortchanged in the divine department, when it's not your original bag in the first place? CoT doesn't have access to it. But then again, it doesn't get Turn Undead, either. *shrug* |
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| Author: | soundofastream [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 0:40 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
lots of people do the 10fighter/2rogue/rest BG route (as its one of the better BG builds). I found creating a cleric/BG one of the harder things to build as there's never enough feats as it is to go around. And I also found that there's very little point trying to turn things your level is usually fighting against on Amia, as you'll be very lucky IF you do manage to turn them. Either the spawn is too low level for you to bother with OR, you're better off using it for divine shield or might. So the extra turn feats, on a cleric/BG build where the BG is the main game you're looking for, is very hard to fit in, without serious giving up something else that is normal on other builds. So I contend that there's no advantage, on average, that a cleric/BG gets on having the "option" of selecting it, when in reality, you've got no wiggle room anyway. In otherwords, cleric/BGs wouldn't really be able to take it, whilst a fighter/rogue/BG build, if this changes, would have spare feats to select it. |
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| Author: | DerkDerkistan [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 0:52 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Real clerics/paladins/BGs don't need Extra Turning. I get by just fine without it. :p |
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| Author: | Dark Immolation [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 0:58 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Personally, I don't find much need for it. Not that it's that great of a boon for BG, but that the class itself already offers a majority of the good bits of the divine classes at full AB, no less. They really aren't hurting to get 6 more uses of Divine Might or Shield. If they do, there's always the option of not using CHA as a dumpstat, as absurd as that may sound to some. |
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| Author: | TormakSaber [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 4:55 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
The answer to this topic is "Bioware forgot", btw, ans thus I have no issue adding it to the class's feat list. |
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| Author: | Baden Ironblood [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 15:47 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
As always Tormak you cut right to the heart of the topic. It sounds like it can be added on this server. The DMs don't seem to have a problem with it. Any time frame onwhen this could happen, if at all? |
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| Author: | PaladinOfSune [ Fri, Feb 11 2011, 18:02 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Done when it's done. Don't twiddle your thumbs in wait, it'll need a hak change. |
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| Author: | Dramatic_Prince [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 9:33 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Baden Ironblood wrote: Any time frame onwhen this could happen, if at all? Request it and make it a feat on your gear? |
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| Author: | TormakSaber [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 11:13 AM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
No, Extra Turning will never be allowed on gear because it is heavily exploitable. |
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| Author: | Tysonm1 [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 12:20 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Awesome. More ways of making Blackguards the most meanest bastards on the game.
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| Author: | Selvec Darkon [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 12:32 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
I'll come out and say it. I don't think Blackguards need another buff. Remember, Extra Turn Undead = Extra Divine Armor and Divine Weapon (Whatever that one is). That's not a good thing, and I don't think they need the help. They are already pretty bloody strong on Amia. |
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| Author: | Tysonm1 [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 12:44 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
Quote: Remember, Extra Turn Undead = Extra Divine Armor and Divine Weapon (Whatever that one is). Divine Might! P.S. Also, I want a Paladin summon from the celestial planes that acts like a rogue. T'arr. |
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| Author: | MoshingChris [ Sat, Feb 12 2011, 13:01 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Why is the Extra Turn Undead feat not available to BGs? |
This topic has run its course. Done when its done. |
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