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banites running into kohlingen
https://www.amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=48226		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Kraniumbrud [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:13 PM ]
Post subject:  banites running into kohlingen
ive seen it twice now..once where anything i did was just ignores, so i plead to the banites...if you have to do mythral crafting...do it in wiltum, i would appriciate if people considered that the npc guard of kohlingen arnt that incompetent that they dont recognise known banites..especially those that come in full black and green armor.
Author:  Isaiah [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:15 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
RAWR!! *smite*
Author:  762 [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:17 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
'scuse me? I'd appreciate a PM with details.
Author:  Kraniumbrud [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:45 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
you are not a dm, and this is no order, just a request..a plead..
and i most certainly do not wish to make a personal case out of this
Author:  762 [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:50 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
I'm the Banite faction leader, and if someone in the faction is breaking server rules, I'd certainly like an opportunity to bring that up with them.

You're not a DM either, by the way, and this is not the way to handle this.
Author:  Kraniumbrud [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:53 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
as i said it was just a request...i do not wish to make a big deal out of this, the peopl who do it know it, i do not wish to involve anyone else in this, including thier faction leader.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 17:56 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Hush. I am sure the naughty folks in question will read this and spank their own bottoms in disgust. :D

Anyway, it's Kranium's right not to name individuals, and I guess Gurth can simply ask the Banites in general not to walk in there (unless in a cunning disguise such as being completely naked).
Author:  corypx [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 18:10 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Dev Disco wrote:
Hush. I am sure the naughty folks in question will read this and spank their own bottoms in disgust. :D

Anyway, it's Kranium's right not to name individuals, and I guess Gurth can simply ask the Banites in general not to walk in there (unless in a cunning disguise such as being completely naked).


come on disco you know as a DM they can only do that if a DM is on and watching to bypass guards, hope you boys dont get performance anxiety knowing your being watched.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 20:28 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Wut?
Author:  Bella Rose [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 20:31 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
corypx wrote:
Dev Disco wrote:
Hush. I am sure the naughty folks in question will read this and spank their own bottoms in disgust. :D

Anyway, it's Kranium's right not to name individuals, and I guess Gurth can simply ask the Banites in general not to walk in there (unless in a cunning disguise such as being completely naked).


come on disco you know as a DM they can only do that if a DM is on and watching to bypass guards, hope you boys dont get performance anxiety knowing your being watched.



Dude chill, I'm sure it was just someone being a noob and they'll know not to do it. Please save your 'banite taunting' for ic, that would be awesome, because none of us are banites irl.
Author:  Grymia [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 20:59 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
If you IRL were Banites, I'd be SERIOUSLY worried.

That said, yarr.. long as the message gets spread not to do this (and especially ignoring the guards in the process) .. then I think all's well.
Author:  corypx [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 21:00 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Bella Rose wrote:
corypx wrote:
Dev Disco wrote:
Hush. I am sure the naughty folks in question will read this and spank their own bottoms in disgust. :D

Anyway, it's Kranium's right not to name individuals, and I guess Gurth can simply ask the Banites in general not to walk in there (unless in a cunning disguise such as being completely naked).


come on disco you know as a DM they can only do that if a DM is on and watching to bypass guards, hope you boys dont get performance anxiety knowing your being watched.



Dude chill, I'm sure it was just someone being a noob and they'll know not to do it. Please save your 'banite taunting' for ic, that would be awesome, because none of us are banites irl.


ok you dont seem to get my joke, I take it you have never seen someone streak at a sporting event, well them knowing thier being watched tends to give performance anxiety....
Author:  Dev Disco [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 21:02 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
I admit I didn't get it. :D
Author:  Galenson [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 22:54 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
It is up to the factions in the northern alliance forum to stop the Banites from doing so. That is one of their criteria, if Banites are getting into Kohlingen then we're not doing a good enough job.

Do not plea for them not to do this, infact I plea them to do so. It gives me work to do.
Author:  P Three [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 22:57 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
But not without DM supervision, whether you're "doing your job" or not. That's metagaming, and NO.
Author:  Pony [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:02 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
That is very silly Galenson. It especially gets silly as you could do so when no triad players are around and cause serious anoying things. The guards would react, hence you get a dm. Simple as that. This counts for all guard metagaming. I am not saying any of the banites did so from what I noticed.
Author:  Galenson [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:05 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Being afraid of losing is no reason to shy away from a task that your faction's devoted to either. In my timezone, DMs are few and far between. When one comes online, I'd rather not annoy them over something I can sort on my own.

This whole concept of absolutely impenetrable fortresses has always been silly. In the past Kohl players complained about the racial gates and no reason to do their job, now that they can do their job you complain?

[edit] Personally, I'd challenge the issue on your own. Server policy says get a DM yes, but if you dont' need to annoy them, why would you?
Author:  corypx [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:10 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
but thats not how it works, because lets say a fight brakes out, this is not the matrix where you have 10000 agents who watch neo and you fight.

Galenson wrote:
[edit] Personally, I'd challenge the issue on your own. Server policy says get a DM yes, but if you dont' need to annoy them, why would you?


because its a the rule, you dont "need" a DM to do a self-rebuild because anyone could hold your items and you remake a player but its the server rules.

you need a DM because its a town with NPCs, if they throw a hellball what then, DM has to be there to see what damage is done IC.
Author:  Peeves [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:12 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Please, bother us. If I'm not available, I'll let you know. Otherwise, I'll boost my butt over there.
Author:  Lutra [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:14 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Yeah, do ask for DM supervision if you happen to be banished from Kohl.

If you wish to attack Kohlingen, then contact with DM Tormak.
Author:  Lutra [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:17 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Here are the holy words of Ron.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=32364
Author:  Grymia [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:19 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Because at this time, it's server policy, plain and simple.

Honestly, I don't see what the issue is for getting a DM if you want to attempt an infiltration.
Author:  762 [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:34 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Yeah, anyway.

I suspect this was not an actual member of the Banite faction. Not all who claim to be Banites belong to the Church of Bane on Amia.

We have a stickied thread in our forums dedicated to not metagaming NPC's. I don't see any reason to bring this up further.

Lastly...just because you see someone there, don't assume they don't have a DM with them.
Author:  Pony [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:35 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Galenson wrote:
Being afraid of losing is no reason to shy away from a task that your faction's devoted to either. In my timezone, DMs are few and far between. When one comes online, I'd rather not annoy them over something I can sort on my own.

This whole concept of absolutely impenetrable fortresses has always been silly. In the past Kohl players complained about the racial gates and no reason to do their job, now that they can do their job you complain?


The fear of losing has almost no relevance here, Galenson. Kohlingen is a city with a lot of guards, who would react, hence you need a dm to control them. Now, tell me how five people of cyric could enter kohlingen, preach about the dogma and try to gain followers without any guard player characters present would help the atmosphere? How do you define what is alright, and what is not for a banned person to do in the city without a dm? It would make no sense from a ic perspective, none, if the guards would allow such things to go on. Furthermore, this would allow a group of opposing characters to just overrun the one pc guard in kohlingen and start pillaging if it were permitted. Added to that, ooc conflicts after pvp are badly enough without such dire consequences. A dm being present ensures that bad feelings are reduced to a minimum, and even then it sometimes gets really bad. Also, it can not be expected that guard pcs are there around the clock. Most factions are very time zone depended and do not have thirty players.

Now, a solution that the guards have a real job could be for the lands claimed by a faction to be bigger than the areas where npc guard presence is a necessity. City X having to safeguard more lands, a large chunck of those without npc guards. You can go as far as to saying if trade routes and farms are not protected well enough, ic consequences happen, for instance a lack of food in city x and the population becoming unhappy. In other words, give factions more vulnerabilities so that they do not only need to hit each other's faction bases or cities. Then again, it becomes the problem that many evil factions are not in the situation they would care about such things. Gold is gathered by hunting, power does not really come from the npc's under your care, so already problems arise on how not to make it only one sided. Then you also need to take into account that the players need to deal responsibly. Burning the farmland and killing all the farmers is a one time solution, and then I doubt many would move back out there to work on the fields. So it requires maturity.

Then we already get to the problem that what if you kill the offending group? They will rise up soon again and start again with it. Right now this is the most ideal solution for a situation that is not really that great, but again, the rule can be changed when we, the playerbase, show we can handle it. At least that is my opinion.
Author:  Grymia [ Wed, Jun 09 2010, 23:39 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
762 wrote:
Yeah, anyway.

I suspect this was not an actual member of the Banite faction. Not all who claim to be Banites belong to the Church of Bane on Amia.

We have a stickied thread in our forums dedicated to not metagaming NPC's. I don't see any reason to bring this up further.

Lastly...just because you see someone there, don't assume they don't have a DM with them.


Yarr.

It's usually a quick process if playing in Windowed mode to check if there's a DM based on the forum count (might not be accurate but I think it'd be accurate to wthin the last few minutes)
Author:  ainjyll [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 0:17 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Just a quick snippet:

Banned Cities/Areas Thread in the Banite Forum wrote:
Kohlingen
Certain surrounding areas*

Same as Cordor with a little bit more zealotry thrown in. Do not enter the city proper or any of the grounds guarded by Kohlingen guards without DM supervision.


The thread is stickied and right at the top of the forum for easy access.

And to expound a bit on what 762 said, not everyone dressed in green and black is a Banite and not all Banites are part of the official church. If NPC's or a PC is being completely ignored, screenie and send to a DM. I'm sure that, like our DM's, 762 doesn't condone such rule-breaking and, considering he leads the faction, a quick PM to him will also settle the issue with just as much certainty as the person will most likely get a good chaffing of the hind area or just booted from the faction (depending on their previous history).
Author:  P Three [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 0:34 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
But, playing devil's advocate, 762, you and I both know perfectly well that just because we as the faction leader tell people "Listen, we're bad. We're banned. DO NOT DO THIS [censored] WITHOUT A DM" doesn't mean everyone is going to listen. It happens in the Banites, it happens in Cordor, it happens with the Grove and the Triad. It happens. People do dumb stuff and either are too cocky or just simply are hurried and forget.

But it doesn't mean that everyone in the faction does it. It doesn't mean that everyone that says they're a part of the faction /is/. Sometimes it's someone that just got booted from the faction looking to start crap.

If you see them doing this, hell. Maybe they're new and they just don't know it's not okay. Give them a nudge. What've you got to lose? If they know, screeny and submit. Problem solved. If there's a DM there, they already know, it's cool. If not, your job is done.
Author:  762 [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 1:10 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Well yeah? That's why I asked for a PM, Axl.
Author:  P Three [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 1:36 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
Point being blanket statements on either side are bad.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 7:15 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
AxlLeigh wrote:
If you see them doing this, hell. Maybe they're new and they just don't know it's not okay. Give them a nudge. What've you got to lose?

This is an attitude I like, and one I recommend for everybody.

I'd also like to point out this thing: many people get annoyed when things don't go their way. More often than not there's no actual harm done, but IT'S NOT THE WAY IT SHOULD BE, G'DAMMIT. You have to realise that in these cases you are the one who gets annoyed, and nobody else will even notice. It's YOUR problem, and the best approach is to sit back a moment and ask yourself "why do I get so annoyed by such a trivial thing?". I mean, in the end you're just messing up your own mood, and 99% of the people around you don't give a damn (and right they are, they're not here to mind your emotional stability).
Author:  Grymia [ Thu, Jun 10 2010, 17:19 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: banites running into kohlingen
BrainSplitter wrote:
Alright, guys, it's starting to really drain on my nerves.


If you want to break a law, you have two choices;

A - Wait until a PC Guard is in the area (As a sub for NPC Guards)
B - Ask a DM.


If you can meet neither parameter; go to an area that is designated for that sort of RP, such as Cordor: South.


Minor, itty bitty little things can be ignored, of course, within common sense. But anything serious (Such as banned people walking around areas they are barred from without supervision; disguise or not) will result in the loss of either levels, XP, or equipment (epic loot inclusive).

You've been warned. Grab a DM/PC Guard, or keep it to the designated areas (Such as Cordor: South)


If a DM is being annoyed by something which (by all rights in the rules) shouldn't be done *He's not being annoyed by Kohlingen per se but he is being annoyed by similar behaviours*, then it's probably a safe bet to say that there is more then one or two people on an individual basis annoyed by running around a guarded area your character would be banned from (without DM supervision).

In WonWon's post I quoted, they do mention the option of a PC guard as a sub for NPC guards which is valid in many a case, so long as the other player recognizes the NPC guards would be on the guarding player's side and not just going to sit there dumbfounded. (They might not give chase, but things such as aiding grabs, or sounding alarms, yeah things they'd probably do but again there could be reasons why they wouldn't.)
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