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HAK and new players, your opinions...
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Author:  Dev Disco [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 13:58 PM ]
Post subject:  HAK and new players, your opinions...
Image

Let's not beat about the bush: the effect of the HAK on the amount of new accounts is simply dramatic. It's half of what it used to be as so-so times.

However, it doesn't seem to have a lot of effect on the actual activity on the server. I think this happens because many people log in, look at the entry, log out and are never seen again. It seems to me that this group of players is gone. Incidentally the number of bans for "log in naked with hacked character" behaviour seems to have been zero this month (not sure about this, though).

Anyway, I wonder about comments from the field. Do you notice any difference in this department?
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:11 PM ]
Post subject: 
I've noticed no real difference. Alas I'll be starting on a new job tomorrow and won't be able to hang around internet and check the forum every 10 minutes, but in the last month or so I haven't noticed any difference with the HAK active.

The A server still gets nearly completely full around the same times and the B server gets its normal amount of traffic too. Infact in that time I can personally account for two people joining up. The fact that a HAK needed to be downloaded wasn't an issue at all.

I say keep the HAK and start using it. It's the upgrade this server needs. I for one can't wait, getting tired of looking at the new play things in the toolset anyway.
Author:  QPR [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:13 PM ]
Post subject: 
Number of players logged in seem to be the same as it usually is, even a slight increase from lazy holiday times. Atleast i ahven't noted any difference.
Author:  Maias227 [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:33 PM ]
Post subject: 
What week did the hak go in?
Author:  Dev Disco [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:37 PM ]
Post subject: 
Week 4, about halfway.
Author:  Mr Mago [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:38 PM ]
Post subject: 
The only difference I've seen, from constant browsing of the forums and looking at the server status on the side bar, is a decrease this weekend. But only this weekend.

For the past two months, the server looks to have been just as active as normally.
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 14:45 PM ]
Post subject: 
The main concern here is decreasing number of players because they can't randomly come across the server anymore log in and experience it. It needs a extra set now. Namely going to a website, downloading a set of files with the dubious name of HAK files, manually putting them in a game folder and hoping it will run.

Easy as can be for most of us, but not every one understands the machine and software they use. Some just use it and for those this would be a rather scary undertaking. Unless they are convinced it is worthwhile.

Though I don't personally think it will be needed as mouth to mouth advertisement is likely to keep the playerbase strong enough. And besides this being one of the better (best) RP servers, it is likely to attract experienced players with knowledge of NWN's workings too.

But what I'm getting is that we could create a third server if need be. Very limited number of users, just a HAKless demo of the world of amia, a showcase as you will.
Author:  Sylfwe [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 15:04 PM ]
Post subject: 
Haven't noticed any difference at all, I actually think having the hak encourages people to visit the forums and thus see the rules and familiarize themselves with the specifics of the class they're planning to play, as well as the subraces and mechanical changes to the game. I don't think "forcing" them to come to the forum is a bad thing, most other servers have haks anyway so chances are most people would know how to use them, and those who don't... well you've seen the occasional distressed thread here and there and they can easily be pointed to the hak.
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 15:06 PM ]
Post subject: 
True. Getting people on the forum is never too bad a thing. It always amazes me that people that have been playing for years still never been on the forum. Dispite having over 6000 forum members. Clean up time?
Author:  jafman30 [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 15:07 PM ]
Post subject: 
I say begin to use the hak. I've actually noticed that B has -more- players than usual. This may be due to the ending of the holidays, of course.
Author:  Sylfwe [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 15:12 PM ]
Post subject: 
hadeismetirion wrote:
Dispite having over 6000 forum members. Clean up time?


Never know when some stray player may suddenly remember their account and start playing again. Or maybe most are just lurkers, they simply read but don't post.
Author:  Jyro X [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 16:33 PM ]
Post subject: 
I've seen no real difference.

And I think actually -using- the HAK will only increased activity and new player influx. Word of mouth travels fast of new cool crap on Amia.
Author:  Onyx99 [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 17:08 PM ]
Post subject: 
I have too noticed an increase in players number on B lately. I also think using the hak would be more beneficial than not.
Author:  MadrikVale [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 17:39 PM ]
Post subject: 
Same here, I really haven't noticed a difference but yeah, B has been fuller. It's my preferred server, actually, with its enormous beauty.
Author:  MoshingChris [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 17:42 PM ]
Post subject: 
Go HAK. Its probably an even better way of checking on incoming players versus outgoing players. Its not offputting either since alot of other servers just use CEP for ease of use which is retardedly large.
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 17:58 PM ]
Post subject: 
Yeah, lets just go for it. Quite frankly everyone is so giddy about having the new area stuff and armours that there's no way back anyway. Might as well impliment it as soon as possible now.
Author:  HellScourge [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 18:22 PM ]
Post subject: 
As long as there is a reasonable link in the server description do I see no reason as to why the hak would attract less people.

Heck, I was browsing and searching for certain hak files for other NWN servers when they failed to provide any links as to where to get them.

Unless Amia does the same will there be no problem I think.
Author:  ClockworkRed [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 19:53 PM ]
Post subject: 
How do you know that somebody is naked when he logs in?
Author:  ainjyll [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 19:57 PM ]
Post subject: 
Start throwing that HAK in! The players are still here and the hours are still getting logged. Considering the age of NWN, I think that most people who still play have probably played on a server that's required a HAK and know how to take care of business on that end. Once word gets out about all the cool stuff going into Amia, we may get even more new players! As it stands now, we have this HAK that needs to be downloaded and not a bit of it shows in the module, this could kinda deter new people from wanting to stick around, ya know?
Author:  msheeler [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 19:58 PM ]
Post subject: 
If its any indication, its mid afternoon on a sunday and I see 90 players listed between the two servers. That's a darn lot of people!
Author:  tsukasa1991 [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 20:18 PM ]
Post subject: 
i havent notices a decrease in activity, and i have notices an increase in where the hell are the hak contents =D its time to implement
Author:  TormakSaber [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 20:21 PM ]
Post subject: 
Mm... I can't really argue with results. Seems I have to eat my hat afterall, heh.
Author:  Yurell [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 20:32 PM ]
Post subject: 
It looks like it may be time to begin using the haks, my fears are certainly alleviated.
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 20:59 PM ]
Post subject: 
TormakSaber wrote:
Mm... I can't really argue with results. Seems I have to eat my hat afterall, heh.

You do understand we want HD quality video of that on youtube.
Author:  TormakSaber [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 21:00 PM ]
Post subject: 
You'll have to settle for an apology from a grumpy old DM set in his ways.
Author:  Dwagin [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 21:29 PM ]
Post subject: 
Tormy deserves a hug. Don't get on his case, not that he needs me to defend him but his concerns were/are logical but he was standing up for what he felt was the right thing for the server.

What I have noticed

Well, this weekend was deader than normal but that could have been any number of things.

I've noticed some fresh blood since the haks went in. I personally know some people waiting for them to go active to return playing. Attributed idiot factor reduction is good. We'll have to see whether or not it has longer term effects.

The hak certainly still causing some issues with some people's machines.

I think part of the problem for this weekend has also been very strange network activity/latency lately from the server.
Author:  Dakotaen [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 21:37 PM ]
Post subject: 
TormakSaber wrote:
You'll have to settle for an apology from a grumpy old DM set in his ways.


HD quality video, or it didn't happen? <.<
Author:  Dark Immolation [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 21:42 PM ]
Post subject: 
I must agree with most of the folks thus far, I haven't seen a decline in activity or folk on(the times I play) at all.

I have a feeling once the HAK stuff actually starts showing up ingame, we'll actually get a few more people joining us. Either more of our own coming back to see what the deal is, or new folk showing up to try it after hearing it by word of mouth. I remember seeing a thread about Amia on the Bioware forums once, we might wanna post something there to tell everyone. That could always help. Along with editing our NWNwiki entry.
Author:  Torzeng [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 22:04 PM ]
Post subject: 
Part of me wonders:
How many accounts created are alt-accounts of "regular" players?

I don't know which way that will factor in but I think it's a missed note in the statistics if we're seeing a drop in alt-accounts (which I doubt), a drop in new-players, a drop in both, ect... Maybe too big of a thing to organize and examine.
My only thought here is if there was a coincidental decline in production of alt-accounts around the same time HAKs went in. That would skew results.

On the other hand, activity of the server seems good as ever. We're out of our slump of declined overall activity (I don't miss those "omg we're dying" threads in the least). Amia is healthy I would say!

Of course, I don't know of many new players coming in. When I'm playing, I've been around long enough that I'm usually RPing with the same folks over and over... Thats kind of how things go. I have tried to meet new faces but I haven't picked off any as "new players to the server". I would see maybe 1 a month by sheer coincidence before. How do you really track if somebody is a new player if they don't tell you?

I would say the test of HAKs isn't ready to be nulled. Sure, new account creation is down. Hours are slightly up, characters is slightly up, and used acounts is roughly the same.

I'm going to call Amia healthy. HAKs might be weeding out new-blood to get involved, meet new people, keep a large player-base. But Amia also has an already large player-base that can fill up a server-and-a-half at peak hours. Amia B hasn't yet grown to comparitive of Amia A on regular playerbase, and that is the trend before and after the HAK.

The only thing that would really suggest the HAK a poor choice if if Amia B was showing higher population before the HAKs were put in and lower now that HAKs are in. Why Amia B? Because it's not used to being capped out 65/65, so you can see a constant flow of activity range on there. A-amia 65/65 at odd intervals because (yes) it is largely influence by people seeing 1 or 4 DM's on it at unpredictable times.

No blame is being tossed or accusations, just stating the trends.

And Trends have not changed in Amia's community since the HAKs went in. The only change the statistics are suggesting is a decline in new players being introduced.
Author:  Siouxpernatural [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 22:39 PM ]
Post subject: 
hello all. I am new, sort of. I was on Amia a few years ago. Things happened, now I am back. Downloading the HAK was not a deterrent at all, it took but a few minutes of my time.

I must say that I am very impressed with many of the changes made. I probably haven't seen half of them yet. My favorite is the job system. I signed up to be a fisherman. Pretty cool. My least favorite change is the fact that all the healers I have run into are now charging to heal a character. I wouldn't mind really if I were an established character but for a low level character, those free heals were a huge help. The one in Cordor especially. But oh well, so it goes. Bottom line great work, many many thanks. Keep it up! (please) :D
Author:  TormakSaber [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 23:06 PM ]
Post subject: 
The heals were made to charge to help put a bit more gold-leeching into the economy. The most basic heal is quite cheap though, just to restore hitpoints. A level 4 character with 48 HP for example would pay 94 gold for a full heal, and that's if they only had one HP left. The other heals and restorations and removals are gold priced pretty similarly to what they would be in PnP as a guideline. And of course you can always ask around town in Cordor if a character could help you.
Author:  Dwagin [ Sun, Feb 28 2010, 23:22 PM ]
Post subject: 
The normal heal is very on par with cost of healkits +1
Author:  Dev Disco [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 7:44 AM ]
Post subject: 
The price also depends on the alignment of the priest...
Author:  Selvec Darkon [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 8:24 AM ]
Post subject: 
Hak went in at around the time school holidays in Oceania finished Disco.

That would better explain any drop.
Author:  Gunz [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 8:35 AM ]
Post subject: 
It's affected the server in mostly small ways, from what I've seen. I've seen a slight reduction in new players but also a reduction in jerks that come on to just mess with people. The server still suffers from a decline in players though, but who knows if it would have gone back up if the HAK wasn't put in. I think things are settling down in any case and the HAK didn't do the server all that much harm. I say keep it and activate it. Might as well. ::shrugs::
Author:  O'Raghailligh [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 9:11 AM ]
Post subject: 
Server activity appears to be constantly consistent, who cares about the nay saying players, DMs, and haters. The numbers speak for themselves.

Hak implementation has been succesful, initiate at will.
Author:  phalanxyrian [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 9:24 AM ]
Post subject: 
*waves the hak flag* Up to better armours, new monster and awesome area's!

The numbers dont lie, those who want to see the wonders amia hold still join the player base.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 9:25 AM ]
Post subject: 
Anyone has serious objections? Now is the time to speak.
Author:  Mahtan [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 10:04 AM ]
Post subject: 
Image

The last Amia hak a causes this. It adds some strange stacked signs that are not there in the pervious versions. I tested this with people that still had the Amia hak a 001 and then updating to 002.

This is in Winya, there might be other places with this kind of error too.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 10:11 AM ]
Post subject: 
O, that's what you get when people use default names for custom textures. I can fix that, though.
Author:  Dakotaen [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 10:40 AM ]
Post subject: 
"Go... The distance."
Author:  Garnith [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 11:11 AM ]
Post subject: 
And ye, the people did agree,
The hak shall come, most certainly,
And so, let us begin the show,
Lets change the world, oh great Disco!
Author:  Ramika [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 11:14 AM ]
Post subject: 
I've noticed no real change. I say go for it.
Author:  Sylfwe [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 11:21 AM ]
Post subject: 
*after a while, comes around covered in feathers and wearing a tribal chicken mask, then starts dancing around a fire* Do it Disco, do it Disco Ra Ra RA! *the ritual continues for quite some time*
Author:  Dramatic_Prince [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 11:46 AM ]
Post subject: 
Dev Disco wrote:
Anyone has serious objections? Now is the time to speak.
I'm all for new content, but for Ao's sake, please test extensively. Having your customers update the hak every 3 days is not good for business.
Author:  Dwagin [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 12:12 PM ]
Post subject: 
Could you make it impossible for people to get into the game world without downloading the updated hak?

Maybe require a pckey update so the mirror will let you pass which can only be gotten by typing /s #### and have the 'secret password' for each hak update be given on the chicken's portrait?


That way people will be sure to get it.
Author:  Lord-Hadeis [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 12:14 PM ]
Post subject: 
Lets face it Disco, you crossed the point of no return when you updated Amia Forest. All the HAK pack details look awesome and for once it really has a forest feeling to it.

You can't change it back now. Especially taking the Grove and the Glade into concern. They are such emotionally vunerable people. (sorry for the joke just had too)
Author:  Mobile_Svensk [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 12:16 PM ]
Post subject: 
Dwagin wrote:
Could you make it impossible for people to get into the game world without downloading the updated hak?

Maybe require a pckey update so the mirror will let you pass which can only be gotten by typing /s #### and have the 'secret password' for each hak update be given on the chicken's portrait?


That way people will be sure to get it.


That's a very very very good idea!
Author:  Pony [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 12:17 PM ]
Post subject: 
Nope, we can still revert back without much work, hence players were not given the chance for custom hak summons, plcs or clothing, so that we could. Even the designer projects are still hakless at the moment so no trouble would occur if we drop them. That being said, I am all for the haks to stay.
Author:  Dev Disco [ Mon, Mar 01 2010, 13:40 PM ]
Post subject: 
Dwagin wrote:
Could you make it impossible for people to get into the game world without downloading the updated hak?

Maybe require a pckey update so the mirror will let you pass which can only be gotten by typing /s #### and have the 'secret password' for each hak update be given on the chicken's portrait?


That way people will be sure to get it.


I could force you by simply changing the name of the hak at every update. I don't find that very user-friendly, though, and more often than not the fixes aren't making the game explode on you if you download a day later. So, the chicken routine seems to be the best of both worlds.
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